Confirmed with Link: Slavin re-signs, 7 years/$5.3 AAV

[tarheelhockey]

Side A: "Gee, Slavin is pretty good. He's not a Norris candidate yet, but he could be one day, isn't that neat? He could be our own Duncan Keith one day!"

Side B: "HE'S NOT ****ING DUNCAN KEITH"

A: "no, he's clearly not, but he really could be something one day..."

B: "NOT DUNCAN KEITH!!!!"

A: "Yes, we established that, but y'know, maybe one day..."

B: "HE WILL NEVER BE AS GOOD AS DUNCAN KEITH!!!!!!"

A: "Oooookay, but here's some actual numbers, and you know, he's probably not going to end up being that good, but y'know, maybe it's possible."

B: "IMPOSSIBLE BECAUSE HE IS NOT THE KEITH. ONLY THE KEITH IS THE KEITH."

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

You're coming at me irrationally hard over this. I hope whatever has you this triggered resolves itself peacefully.

Anyway, you definitely did state that Slavin will be a "perennial Norris contender" and "even money for the Norris".

Mocking me while subtly walking that back to "he's probably not going to be that good, but it's possible" is a hedge/weasel move. If you think he's a future Norris winner, stick to that. I'll call you wrong and we can walk away. But going about it the way you just did is a matter of losing respect in the process.

 

[tarheelhockey]

[long post]

Fair enough and I appreciate the detailed explanation.

The question in the last paragraph -- Keith's huge huge leap forward in the next stage of his career -- is where I think the comparison is inadvisable. Very few players develop that way, and the occurrences of it happening are basically a lottery. Slavin is very unlikely to suddenly surge forward that way.

I would question why the comparison to a very rare player who made an unpredictable mid-career quantum leap, rather than to other players who didn't.

 

[GoldiFox]

You're coming at me irrationally hard over this. I hope whatever has you this triggered resolves itself peacefully.

Anyway, you definitely did state that Slavin will be a "perennial Norris contender" and "even money for the Norris".

Mocking me while subtly walking that back to "he's probably not going to be that good, but it's possible" is a hedge/weasel move. If you think he's a future Norris winner, stick to that. I'll call you wrong and we can walk away. But going about it the way you just did is a matter of losing respect in the process.

Backin up some tude with a side of extra hot tude.

Slavin is a consistent top-5 Norris contender once the usual suspects age out and he hits his prime (~5 years). Of the guys I've watched closely (mostly EC) only Seth Jones provides the same shift-to-shift impact. Whether Slavin has any chance of winning a Norris depends on the Canes taking the next step as a team. Defenders on non-Playoff teams don't have a chance.

 

[Vagrant]

Fair enough and I appreciate the detailed explanation.

The question in the last paragraph -- Keith's huge huge leap forward in the next stage of his career -- is where I think the comparison is inadvisable. Very few players develop that way, and the occurrences of it happening are basically a lottery. Slavin is very unlikely to suddenly surge forward that way.

I would question why the comparison to a very rare player who made an unpredictable mid-career quantum leap, rather than to other players who didn't.

I think for me it's because their skills align really well. They're both skating defensive defensemen, aren't overly physical, positional defenders who have adequate but not overwhelming offensive skills and similar pedigrees. What really spiked Keith's transition to that upper echelon was finding out how good of a fit he was on a really dynamic Chicago powerplay and the natural progression that playing on better teams started to make on his countable numbers. Both of those things I could see happening with Slavin if he continues his current trajectory and the team continues their own. As has been mentioned, Keith has hovered around the 45-50 point mark as a rule over his career with defense that is obviously top shelf. I think that's an achievable ceiling for Slavin with what we've already seen. Just an opinion, but I don't think it's totally out of the realm of reasonable.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

You're coming at me irrationally hard over this. I hope whatever has you this triggered resolves itself peacefully.

Anyway, you definitely did state that Slavin will be a "perennial Norris contender" and "even money for the Norris".

No, actually, I didn't -- and it's exactly why I'm pissed off. And now, really pissed off.

Here is literally exactly what I said.

First: "Anyone here think that Slavin has an even money chance at a Norris one day?"

As in, does anyone actually think that? Phrased in the form of a question. Not a statement. An actual, honest to goodness question! Questions imply uncertainty! You clearly interpreted this to mean I was saying "I think that Slavin has an even money chance of winning a Norris." I was not. What I was saying was, "even if you think he's an even money chance for a Norris one day, I WOULD STILL TRADE HIM FOR LAINE." That. Was. The. Whole. Point. Of. The. Post.

Next: "If we start going to the playoffs on the regular and make some noise occasionally, I think he's a perennial Norris candidate."

And I do believe this. I believe he is a perennial Norris *candidate*, given the exact listed circumstances. *If* the Canes become a perennial playoff time, and *if* they make some noise occasionally. I believe that Slavin getting Norris consideration, under those circumstances, is the *likely* outcome. I think he's in the mix, getting votes every year. IF THE CANES ARE GOOD AND IF THEY MAKE OCCASIONAL DEEP RUNS.

Mocking me while subtly walking that back to "he's probably not going to be that good, but it's possible" is a hedge/weasel move.

I'm mocking you for misrepresenting my exact words, and those of others. Protip: people get mad at you on the internet when you misrepresent what they said. Maybe you've noticed!

If you think he's a future Norris winner, stick to that. I'll call you wrong and we can walk away. But going about it the way you just did is a matter of losing respect in the process.

That goes both ways, buddy.

Have a nice off-season.

 

[tarheelhockey]

No, actually, I didn't -- and it's exactly why I'm pissed off. And now, really pissed off.

Here is literally exactly what I said.

First: "Anyone here think that Slavin has an even money chance at a Norris one day?"

As in, does anyone actually think that? Phrased in the form of a question. Not a statement. An actual, honest to goodness question! Questions imply uncertainty! You clearly interpreted this to mean I was saying "I think that Slavin has an even money chance of winning a Norris." I was not. What I was saying was, "even if you think he's an even money chance for a Norris one day, I WOULD STILL TRADE HIM FOR LAINE." That. Was. The. Whole. Point. Of. The. Post.

Next: "If we start going to the playoffs on the regular and make some noise occasionally, I think he's a perennial Norris candidate."

And I do believe this. I believe he is a perennial Norris *candidate*, given the exact listed circumstances. *If* the Canes become a perennial playoff time, and *if* they make some noise occasionally. I believe that Slavin getting Norris consideration, under those circumstances, is the *likely* outcome. I think he's in the mix, getting votes every year. IF THE CANES ARE GOOD AND IF THEY MAKE OCCASIONAL DEEP RUNS.



I'm mocking you for misrepresenting my exact words, and those of others. Protip: people get mad at you on the internet when you misrepresent what they said. Maybe you've noticed!



That goes both ways, buddy.

Have a nice off-season.

Sorry, I took "Anyone think this guy is even money to win the Norris? I think he'll be a perennial Norris contender if things turn out the way we all expect they will." to mean you thought Slavin will be a Norris caliber defenseman.

My mistake, apparently.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

Sorry, I took "Anyone think this guy is even money to win the Norris? I think he'll be a perennial Norris contender if things turn out the way we all expect they will." to mean you thought Slavin will be a Norris caliber defenseman.

My mistake, apparently.

Yes, I do think he's a *potential* Norris caliber defenseman. I absolutely do. So do a lot of other folks. He's good, but we won't ultimately know how good until he hangs 'em up one day. The same thing was true with a 22-year old Duncan Keith.

That's all, dude. That's all I was ever saying. Seriously.

If you read what I wrote and thought I was being weaselly, I think that's on you.

 

[Vagrant]

He got some Norris votes last season at 22. Your mileage on what that means may vary, but he was one of 4 under 25 to get any votes at all with Seth Jones, Zach Werenski, and Dougie Hamilton. I think most wouldn't argue if you said those other guys are going to be Norris candidates over the long haul. I don't think it's out of the frame to suggest he'll be on the short list moving forward with any incremental improvement at all.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I don't think he has that ceiling. Mainly because I don't think he has that offensive game in him, even with improvement, and it's easier to see him getting worse than better defensively.

 

[the halleJOKEL]

this argument is stupid because literally nobody will win the norris after they rename it the slavin trophy in a few years

 

[Svechhammer]

We just locked up the Slavin-Peesh line for at least 6 more years for less than $10m per year total.

Wow

 

[NotOpie]

We just locked up the Slavin-Peesh line for at least 6 more years for less than $10m per year total.

Wow

Best part of this is that they'll be costing a robust $1.55 million this season. #profit

Also, as the guy who said I wouldn't trade Slavin for Laine today, I also said it was because I felt he was an integral piece of what projects to be a pretty good Top 4 on defense. It wasn't about who was better. It was about whether or not a guy who has elevated his game to become OUR #1 defenseman was more valuable to this specific team than a 1 dimensional goal scoring winger. Today, right now, I'd rather have Slavin as part of this team than Laine. Maybe not an intellectually sound argument, but I think this year's defense is more important to the Canes winning than sacrificing a piece of it for a 40 goal, 70+ point wing.

 

[RodTheBawd]

Again, you're painting a 19 year old as a 1 dimensional scoring winger. If your "today, right now" caveat means for this upcoming season alone, umm sure, ok.

 

[Lempo]

The man has at least three dimensions goddamnit! Tallness, thickness and girth.

 

[NotOpie]

Again, you're painting a 19 year old as a 1 dimensional scoring winger. If your "today, right now" caveat means for this upcoming season alone, umm sure, ok.

I'm not English major, but I believe, "...today, right now" has a pretty self-evident, easy to grasp definition....oh, wait a minute, I am an English major . So yeah, you've grasped my meaning.

The man has at least three dimensions goddamnit! Tallness, thickness and girth.

Thickness and girth could be considered the same thing....now adding diameter....that's "a whole nother thang".

 

[tarheelhockey]

I'm not English major, but I believe, "...today, right now" has a pretty self-evident, easy to grasp definition....

Today, right now, both Laine and Slavin are utterly useless players. Laine's probably asleep and Slavin could maybe help you move some furniture or something.

 

[NotOpie]

Today, right now, both Laine and Slavin are utterly useless players. Laine's probably asleep and Slavin could maybe help you move some furniture or something.

Have you not seen Mrs. Slavin? Jaccob works every day with a long-snapper so that he continues to out-kick his coverage....

Also, I think he's in Colorado hiking, being outdoorsy, and doing family stuff....

Nah, Laine is trying add a dimension to his game....like his buddy Sebastian Aho...

 

[Navin R Slavin]

Weasels, *****es. Weasels.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

that cant possibly be his gf

 

[Navin R Slavin]

that cant possibly be his gf

That's clearly just a lady who digs the weasel.

 

[Lempo]

Lüga Weasel would totally be a fit name for a person acting in films aimed for specific kind of connoisseurs.

 

[Roboturner913]

that cant possibly be his gf

No kidding, I have to believe he could at least rate a chick with a normal face instead of somebody that looks fresh out of the botox place.

 

[AD Skinner]

Don't caress the weasel
Don't fall too soon

 

[RodTheBawd]

I'm not English major, but I believe, "...today, right now" has a pretty self-evident, easy to grasp definition....oh, wait a minute, I am an English major . So yeah, you've grasped my meaning.

For an English major, I'd have expected you to understand how easily that statement could be interpreted as "based on what I've seen so far, today, right now... I'd take Slavin for the long haul." A logical, albeit arguable, position to take. Which is entirely different than "today, right now... I want Slavin for this upcoming season." An incredibly shortsighted position. Thank you for taking the time out of your shift at Starbucks to clarify

I'm just a Poly Sci major and ambiguity ain't my thing.

 

[Lempo]

I'm just a Poly Sci major and ambiguity ain't my thing.

As a BSc(Admin) I encircle ambiguity into my hermeneutic circle. Or if I take to the dark side, I rather use it to weasel out and get my way.

I should prolly get my thesis done.