Should the Caps Fire Barry Trotz (February 19th)

[brachyrynchos]

Sheldon Keefe hockey statistics and profile at hockeydb.com

I wonder if they take a look at this guy

Ranger fans really want him, too. Babcock is safe w/ the leafs, so the idea is that TOR won't block any teams from negotiating with Keefe, not sure if he's the right guy or not, but he's done well with the Leafs prospects. Could bring a fresh perspective at a relatively cheaper salary.

 

[Blades of Steel]

I just did a quick forum search:



I do assume most people, such as this poster, mean it in jest. But some people repeat things so often, that well, they begin to believe it.

yeah, it's total joke

just trying to keep myself amused with years of disappointment, so why not point to something ridiculous..

 

[Lindemann]

I fully believe in GMBM

His trades for Kemp and Jab were looked at as dumpster dives but actually were very solid signings

McPhee could never correctly dumpster dive

 

[justafan22]

Keefe would be great for you guys.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Yeah, stuff the insults. What she said above.

Also "They choke, not the coach" is not blaming everyone. Stop it.

You don’t get it....moving on.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

We have what? Two or three guys o the roster who have run through all the coaches? How can anyone argue the team hasn't changed? And does anybody believe this team is better without Ovie? Backstrom is maybe arguable depending on who would replace him, but that's a short list.

The problem is Leonsis and Patrick. They are the constants. They are the ones who let McPhee squander Ovie's prime with an AHL D corps and rookie coaches while proven Cup winners went elsewhere. They are the ones who stood by as he traded FF for nothing. They are the ones who so desperately want to cultivate this dynastic image that they'll hire anyone who worked for the organization ever over the right people.

Say what you want about the players, but they are the bottom of the organizational hierarchy. The misplaced priorities and losing mentality come from the top down, not the bottom up.

Well, the two top owners aren’t changing....now what? I don’t see anyone defending Leonsis or Patrick. Unfortunately they don’t play the games either. Backstrom is 10000% someone to consider in a franchise-altering trade scenario. Anyone not named Ovechkin should be and should have been years ago.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Not false at all but you can sub in any hierarchical organization if you don't like basic service industry analogies.

Every team has levels of leadership and accountability. What's being said, in a contrarian vein most likely, is that the coach doesn't choke and it's on the players to produce. This is just not how the real world works. Accountability works upwards. That doesn't mean there's no accountability at the bottom, it means the greater and final responsibility rests with the person who is IN CHARGE. That is literally the definition of their job...to get results from their team and take responsibility for that mission.

Is gmbm the right guy? If not, replace him.
Is BT the right guy? If not, replace him.
Is player x the right guy? If not, replace him.

So start at the bottom. Has BT had a roster good enough to win the Cup? If "yes" then gmbm has shown he can do the job and your next glance is at BT. If no then that relieves some of the pressure on BT and some of the players. Get a better GM who will assemble the right team, then re-evaluate.

Has BT had the players to win the Cup in his time here, and in Nashville?

It's a lot more simple than that to me. If you look at the organization from top to bottom, you have GMBM who did his job each year to field the most competitive team. Then, Trotz coached them well enough to win a Stanley Cup last year, and well enough to win the division this year. Players have failed to execute the game plan. Some players do need to be replaced. I like our core for the most part, I just think some elements should be replaced/upgraded.

Trotz will be replaced this summer, unless he gets us past the 2nd round by some miracle. Change is around the corner, for better or worse.

 

[Capsman]

It's a lot more simple than that to me. If you look at the organization from top to bottom, you have GMBM who did his job each year to field the most competitive team. Then, Trotz coached them well enough to win a Stanley Cup last year, and well enough to win the division this year. Players have failed to execute the game plan. Some players do need to be replaced. I like our core for the most part, I just think some elements should be replaced/upgraded.

Trotz will be replaced this summer, unless he gets us past the 2nd round by some miracle. Change is around the corner, for better or worse.

What is the game plan? And assuming there’s a viable game plan, how do you know Trotz coaches it well? How do you know his game plan is suited to his personnel?

All I see is a team that is very static offensively and doesn’t look like the players are on the same page.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

You don't win as many games as he has at the top professional level and not coach pretty damn well and certainly not without some kind of game plan. It's disingenuous to suggest otherwise.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

What is the game plan? And assuming there’s a viable game plan, how do you know Trotz coaches it well? How do you know his game plan is suited to his personnel?

All I see is a team that is very static offensively and doesn’t look like the players are on the same page.

I have a hard time believing that the Caps could have been as successful as they have been without a game plan. Players fail to execute all the time. Whether it's a missed assignment defensively, a soft pass or a neutral zone turnover, we see them fail often. That was the issue to me in Game 7. Winnik shoots high and wide on a breakaway, Oshie misses a tap-in, Shattenkirk & Ovi fail to get the puck out. Compare us to the team we faced that day. The Penguins' players did very few mistakes and were very careful with the puck.

 

[maacoshark]

What is the game plan? And assuming there’s a viable game plan, how do you know Trotz coaches it well? How do you know his game plan is suited to his personnel?

All I see is a team that is very static offensively and doesn’t look like the players are on the same page.

Obviously Trotz has a game plan. But you are right, do we have the personnel for his system? If that ius the case. Do we change the personnel or the system?

 

[mad4comp]

Obviously Trotz has a game plan. But you are right, do we have the personnel for his system? If that ius the case. Do we change the personnel or the system?

Nobody does... Which is why he didn't win with the defensive stalwart that was Nashville.... They were perfect for his system... unfortunately his "system" sucks. It's not the 1960's anymore... defense doesn't win championships. The dinosaur that is Trotz needs to find another line of work.

 

[maacoshark]

Nobody does... Which is why he didn't win with the defensive stalwart that was Nashville.... They were perfect for his system... unfortunately his "system" sucks. It's not the 1960's anymore... defense doesn't win championships. The dinosaur that is Trotz needs to find another line of work.

We scored 4 goals tonight. That should be enough to win. We had a ton of shots. We didn't lose in the offensive zone. We lost in the defensive zone. Maybe Trotz doesnt use a defensive system. It sure doesnt look like it.

 

[peterthegreat12]

We scored 4 goals tonight. That should be enough to win. We had a ton of shots. We didn't lose in the offensive zone. We lost in the defensive zone. Maybe Trotz doesnt use a defensive system. It sure doesnt look like it.

You will defend Trotz at all costs.

 

[Holtbyisms]

< - - - - -

 

[Capsman]

We scored 4 goals tonight. That should be enough to win. We had a ton of shots. We didn't lose in the offensive zone. We lost in the defensive zone. Maybe Trotz doesnt use a defensive system. It sure doesnt look like it.

We also gave up more goals tonight, is that on Vrana and Djoos?

I also disagree that we lost in the defensieve zone only. 3 of our goals were PP goals and we had a ton of PP opportunities. We had one ES goal and for most of the game had trouble generating quality ES shots. And there is a huge element of shooting and crashing he net forb rebounds missing when we do get the chances, as we saw in the OT.

 

[WcRoenick97]

We need a coach with actual cup winning experience. We don’t need another up and comer or coach who has never been past the second round. We need Suter.

 

[Lindemann]

It seems the logical choice is Reirden based on keeping him from interviews, etc

But is he different than Trotz?

I don’t know but today’s NHL is switching to translation and speed. We need a younger coach that can do that

 

[g00n]

Too late to fire him, but he should be let go if they don't make the ECF at least. Obviously.

If we hire a new coach that preaches speed I think things will change significantly. Recall that gmbm talked about getting faster and more aggressive after Barry's year 1 loss to the Rongos. To me, that along with the plugger roster moves we've made, tells me BT is involved in buying the groceries and he's not really cooking what gmbm is craving. Making the playoffs each year has likely saved his job and prevented a firing, while lackluster results will mean refusal to re-up his contract.

I would not be surprised if we see a more uptempo team/coach with some roster moves made to dump some of the plodders. Then you need to worry about goaltenders that can stop a rush once in a while because if you think the puck is going the other way a lot now (it is, 2nd worst in the league) just wait until we're going balls to the wall offensively.

 

[Slateman]

Yes. As part of a complete cleaning of house. But yes.

 

[maacoshark]

We also gave up more goals tonight, is that on Vrana and Djoos?

I also disagree that we lost in the defensieve zone only. 3 of our goals were PP goals and we had a ton of PP opportunities. We had one ES goal and for most of the game had trouble generating quality ES shots. And there is a huge element of shooting and crashing he net forb rebounds missing when we do get the chances, as we saw in the OT.

I didn't mention Djoos or Vrana. Half of the roster has played poorly. Unfortunately we cant scratch them all.
My point was that 4 goals should have been enough to win. We had chances to score more but Bobrovsky was pretty good. We got mediocre goaltending again

 

[Chimaera]

He should've been gone during the season.

As it stands now, they're too late.

 

[trick9]

Still wondering why people generally agree that the defense sucks and has done so for entire year, and yet want to give Reirden a promotion?

There are worse options, sure. But even if you think Trotz is controlling him and Reirden is not to blame at all, isn't it still a huge risk to promote him? I mean there are better coaches available. Even if you want to go with someone with no experience there are much better options available that don't come with such a huge red flag.

 

[nothingbeatshockey]

It seems the logical choice is Reirden based on keeping him from interviews, etc

But is he different than Trotz?

I don’t know but today’s NHL is switching to translation and speed. We need a younger coach that can do that

And herein lies the problem: if you do fire Trotz only to replace him with his assistant, has a change been made? Maybe Reirden would coach sufficiently different than Trotz to make a difference, but it seems more intuitive that finding someone new with actual playoff success would be more likely to produce a real coaching change.

And, unless you're willing to substantially change the roster, you're just re-arranging the chairs on the deck of the Titanic.

 

[Capsman]

Too late to fire him, but he should be let go if they don't make the ECF at least. Obviously.

If we hire a new coach that preaches speed I think things will change significantly. Recall that gmbm talked about getting faster and more aggressive after Barry's year 1 loss to the Rongos. To me, that along with the plugger roster moves we've made, tells me BT is involved in buying the groceries and he's not really cooking what gmbm is craving. Making the playoffs each year has likely saved his job and prevented a firing, while lackluster results will mean refusal to re-up his contract.

I would not be surprised if we see a more uptempo team/coach with some roster moves made to dump some of the plodders. Then you need to worry about goaltenders that can stop a rush once in a while because if you think the puck is going the other way a lot now (it is, 2nd worst in the league) just wait until we're going balls to the wall offensively.

The good teams (Penguins, Nashville, Vegas) can play fast and get back quickly. They don't need to take unnecessary chances to generate scoring opportunities. And when they do, they are all well versed in covering for each other. Well oiled machines.