Confirmed with Link: Sheldon Keefe Fired -- Discussion Thread

[notbias]

I said this before and Ill say it again since you want to ignore Bertuzzi was one of the best players for the leafs this series

If bertuzzi with 4 pts in 7 games was a 3M player and 2.5M overpaid

Then big 4 were the below:

Matthews 4 in 5 was worth 7.7M and was 3.93M overpaid (0.8 /(4/7) * 5.5M

Marner 3 in 7 was worth 4.13M ((3/7)/(4/7) * 5.5) and was overpaid 6.8M

Tavares 2 in 7 was worth 2.75M (2/7)/(4/7)*5.5M) amd was overpaid 8.25M

Nylander had 3 in 5 was worth 7.2M and was about 200K underpaid (3/4)/(4/7)*5.5

Core 4 overpayment according to your view of bertuzzi being 2.5M overpaid at 5.5M were = 18.78M overpaid

That is the reason we lost the series. Cant win by paying a 20M group of 4 players 40M

Once again, the core four underperforming does not make the 20M available to Treliving less than 20M.

They can suck, and his signings can be bad, both scenarios can happen.

Also, looking only at points is a pointless exercise.

 

[Evilhomer]

Once again, the core four underperforming does not make the 20M available to Treliving less than 20M.

They can suck, and his signings can be bad, both scenarios can happen.

Also, looking only at points is a pointless exercise.

I'm at a loss with people wanting Bertuzzi back. He only scored 20 goals playing on the second highest scoring team in the league, and he took more dumb or careless penalties than I can count. If he came back on another one year deal at a cheaper cost, sure, go for it, but I assume he wants the same or more money and more term.

 

[hamzarocks]

Once again, the core four underperforming does not make the 20M available to Treliving less than 20M.

They can suck, and his signings can be bad, both scenarios can happen.

Also, looking only at points is a pointless exercise.

Bertuzzi had a better series than Marner/Tavares by a lot. You want to look at beyond pts well those guys didnt give anything

You arbitrarily (due to your bias) decide that bertuzzi had the impact of a 3M player lool

Did he need to get 6 or 7 pts in 7 games to be worth 5.5M in your eyes?

He led the team in scoring along with domi and Matthews. They were our 3 top forwards followed by Nylander.

The 20M spent by Treliving this summer was worth the money besides Klingberg

Bertuzzi played at 5M player level in the playoffs

Domi played at a 5M level in the playoffs

Benoit played at a 2.5M player in the playoffs

Edmunson played at a 3M plauer in the playoffs

Lybushkin played at a 5M player in the playoffs

Reeves played like a 1M level player come playoffs

These guys were not the reason we lost

Marner,
Tavares,
Rielly,
Samsonov, Woll/Nylander/Matthews health
PP&PK
Jarnkrok, Robertson, and Holmberg
Were the reasons we lost

We got surplus value and impact from the moves made by Trelivng for the playoffs

The core being 20M overpaid kills any chance to win as any surplus value you get from good signings is washed away and turned negative

 

[MarMarSab3]

I'm at a loss with people wanting Bertuzzi back. He only scored 20 goals playing on the second highest scoring team in the league, and he took more dumb or careless penalties than I can count. If he came back on another one year deal at a cheaper cost, sure, go for it, but I assume he wants the same or more money and more term.

Im with you, have zero interest in bringing bertuzzi back. Warren Foegele could net us 20 for much much less.

 

[Skullz]

I have no real objection to Berube, but the leafs process when making hires is really starting to piss me off. It's downright unprofessional.

Dubas hired Keefe without interviewing anyone.

Shanahan hired Treliving with barely any other interviews. It was leaked that he was getting the job way before anyone was interviewed.

Now it seems like it is Berube, and this has been talked about for months. Likely on two interviews as well.

I do not understand why we are not casting a wider net with these searches. At least do due diligence for God's sake.

This is no way to run an organization.

 

[Anthrax442]

Im with you, have zero interest in bringing bertuzzi back. Warren Foegele could net us 20 for much much less.

I would do it on a 3x3.5 tops

 

[notbias]

Bertuzzi had a better series than Marner/Tavares by a lot. You want to look at beyond pts well those guys didnt give anything

You arbitrarily (due to your bias) decide that bertuzzi had the impact of a 3M player lool

Did he need to get 6 or 7 pts in 7 games to be worth 5.5M in your eyes?

He led the team in scoring along with domi and Matthews. They were our 3 top forwards followed by Nylander.

The 20M spent by Treliving this summer was worth the money besides Klingberg

Bertuzzi played at 5M player level in the playoffs

Domi played at a 5M level in the playoffs

Benoit played at a 2.5M player in the playoffs

Edmunson played at a 3M plauer in the playoffs

Lybushkin played at a 5M player in the playoffs

Reeves played like a 1M level player come playoffs

These guys were not the reason we lost

Marner,
Tavares,
Rielly,
Samsonov, Woll/Nylander/Matthews health
PP&PK
Jarnkrok, Robertson, and Holmberg
Were the reasons we lost

We got surplus value and impact from the moves made by Trelivng for the playoffs

The core being 20M overpaid kills any chance to win as any surplus value you get from good signings is washed away and turned negative

Your player evaluation is terrible in my opinion, so we can agree to disagree.

 

[hamzarocks]

Your player evaluation is terrible in my opinion, so we can agree to disagree.

I have always felt the same for you

Terrible valuation and consistently biased and changing viewpoints

A dubasite like none other

 

[colchar]

I have no real objection to Berube, but the leafs process when making hires is really starting to piss me off. It's downright unprofessional.

Dubas hired Keefe without interviewing anyone.

Shanahan hired Treliving with barely any other interviews. It was leaked that he was getting the job way before anyone was interviewed.

Now it seems like it is Berube, and this has been talked about for months. Likely on two interviews as well.

I do not understand why we are not casting a wider net with these searches. At least do due diligence for God's sake.

This is no way to run an organization.

We have no idea how many interviews were conducted for either position, and they do have to move quickly on a coach before another team makes and offer and scoops someone.

 

[nuck]

I'm at a loss with people wanting Bertuzzi back. He only scored 20 goals playing on the second highest scoring team in the league, and he took more dumb or careless penalties than I can count. If he came back on another one year deal at a cheaper cost, sure, go for it, but I assume he wants the same or more money and more term.

9 points in the first 3rd of the season and 21 in the last 3rd. It either took him a while to get comfortable or it took a while for Keefe to figure out how to best use him. I think he is the late season guy and will have a better year for the club but only for the right price.

 

[colchar]

I think there are off-ice issues with him, mostly butts heads with management and players don't apparently like him.

There have been a bunch of posts here indicating that players do like him.

 

[ChurchOfMatthews]

I have no real objection to Berube, but the leafs process when making hires is really starting to piss me off. It's downright unprofessional.

Dubas hired Keefe without interviewing anyone.

Shanahan hired Treliving with barely any other interviews. It was leaked that he was getting the job way before anyone was interviewed.

Now it seems like it is Berube, and this has been talked about for months. Likely on two interviews as well.

I do not understand why we are not casting a wider net with these searches. At least do due diligence for God's sake.

This is no way to run an organization.

Yep, a lot of people are blaming the players. For me ALL the blame falls on management.

 

[TonsofPuppies]

Yep, a lot of people are blaming the players. For me ALL the blame falls on management.

Agreed. The players would have been at fault for the first few years of this nonsense, basically up until the Montreal series. At that point, it was management's job to step in and break up this group, because it simply doesn't work. If a manager continues to employ a bad employee with a bad track record, that is on them, not the employee anymore.

 

[Clark4Ever]

I have no real objection to Berube, but the leafs process when making hires is really starting to piss me off. It's downright unprofessional.

Dubas hired Keefe without interviewing anyone.

Shanahan hired Treliving with barely any other interviews. It was leaked that he was getting the job way before anyone was interviewed.

Now it seems like it is Berube, and this has been talked about for months. Likely on two interviews as well.

I do not understand why we are not casting a wider net with these searches. At least do due diligence for God's sake.

This is no way to run an organization.

I would normally agree with you, but when there is a clear cut candidate available and time is of the essence, I don't mind if the organization fast tracks the process to hire the right person.

 

[The Masters]

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Focus your complaints people.

Sure old man JT wasn’t great - that’s predictable. And unmovable.

It’s Marner that has to move on. He’s a God and he shouldn’t have to play with mere mortal Leaf players. respect his authority.

 

[Fogelhund]

For those of you who have lost focus.

You are currently here. --> New Coach Discussion Thread
If you are looking to discuss Free Agents and next years Roster the thread is here --> GDT: - Trades & Free Agency -- Off-season edition

 

[Cleetus]

so they have only interviewed 2 candidates so far, McLennan, and Berube. wonder how many more Brad will interview?

 

[Fogelhund]

Nothing too exciting or new here, but I suppose the latest.

 

[Rare Jewel]

I have always felt the same for you

Terrible valuation and consistently biased and changing viewpoints

A dubasite like none other

There are a few contenders.

 

[Trapper]

this guy is going to be a culture shock lol

I like him already. Wish someone would say that here.

 

[Menzinger]

so they have only interviewed 2 candidates so far, McLennan, and Berube. wonder how many more Brad will interview?

Might just be the two. They've said to the media they're looking to move quickly on things

 

[colchar]

Focus your complaints people.

Sure old man JT wasn’t great - that’s predictable. And unmovable.

It’s Marner that has to move on. He’s a God and he shouldn’t have to play with mere mortal Leaf players. respect his authority.

They've gotten out from under allegedly unmovable contracts before.

 

[Suntouchable13]

I like him already. Wish someone would say that here.

After that 20 second clip, I am now sold on Berube

 

[Smif]

I just don't see the playoffs going any differently next year if they can't convince Marner to waive and bring back the core 4 plus a new coach. Coach still needs horses.

I could see them being tempted to run it back because the following season JT comes off the books and there's your natural rebalance of salary from F to D. Losing Marner this year and JT next year is kind've a scary thought.