Senators FURIOUS about heavy handed HFNHL ruling.

Discussion in 'HFNHL Talk' started by BlueAndWhite, Oct 19, 2005.

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  1. BlueAndWhite

    BlueAndWhite Registered User

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    Change the word "furious" to "perturbed" and the words "heavy handed" to "legitimate".

    So I guess we have: Senators perturbed about legitimate HFNHL ruling.

    I recently traded a player who I had resigned before the UFA period (aka free agency) and the trade was thrown out because well there is a rule in place that does not permit resigned UFA's to be traded until the All-Star break.
    Note: The trade was declined but I was given the option of paying the penalty. Something I have decided to do.


    You can overcome this rule by paying a penalty of the player's salary (for a year).

    Now, I understand why the rule exists, Krueger explained it well here:
    http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=132812

    However, I also believe that the basic premise of the rule is not being affected in this particular situation (nor will it be in the situation for other teams crippled by this ruling).

    Keep in mind that some of these players were signed during the last HFNHL season (2003-2004), well before there was significant talk about an NHL lockout or a cap, let alone the existing cap structure in the HFNHL. This isn't a case of "you made your bed, now sleep in it", at least it does not appear so IMO.

    I fail to see how preventing teams from trying to fit under the cap, or become more economically viable is helping the league out in the long run.

    Please note that I am not asking that this rule be thrown out, as I think this rule is perfectly valid. However, what I am asking for is a one time exception considering the circumstances and events that have occured since these players were signed.

    As it stands, even if it means that the penalty is reduced to paying half the player's salary ... it would be an improvement.

    Thank you for your time.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2005
  2. kasper11

    kasper11 Registered User

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    The rule was put into place because teams were constantly resigning their own Free Agents to use them as trade bait and not risk losing them without any return. The salary cap doesn't change that. You could put the player on waivers, and allow another team to pick him up, thus relieving you of the salary. By trading him, you are only attempting to get something for your player that you would not have had if he had been allowed to leave via free agency.
     
  3. BlueAndWhite

    BlueAndWhite Registered User

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    I personally believe the salary cap does change many things. I don't see how this constitutes as "hoarding". This is not the case, of where I wouldn't be able to financially pay the player that I had resigned. I am trading the player because under the new HFNHL rules I cannot afford a player making that much money.

    I signed the player to a contract well before the current HFNHL rules were even discussed. Rest assured, in the current economic HFNHL climate I would not have signed the player to a similar deal.
     
  4. Dr.Sens(e)

    Dr.Sens(e) Registered User

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    The fact remains these players re-signed at a discount with their existing team based on a loyalty factor (randomly generated, but there regardless).

    As such, the player signed cheaper than they would have received via free agency (for example, Paul Kariya received more via free agency that year than Modano did re-signing with your team - fair to say Modano would have been more sought after had he been a UFA). Had it been in the real NHL, his agent would have insisted on a no-trade clause, but because we don't want to have to keep track of that, we put the penalty in place in case teams tried to move the player soon after the signing.

    And if you're disappointed because 'you didn't know the rule was coming and wouldn't have signed him', well this is the same situation NHL teams were faced with of signing players under one set of circumstances, and then having to deal with them under a new CBA. It's the same situation other HFNHL teams currently face as well, and you have the same option they do, which is as Rich says - put him on waivers to be picked up by another team. Either way, you wouldn't have been able to use him as trade bait, which is exactly what you're doing now.

    If you think you're perterbed, think of the player who signed to play in Ottawa on a contender at a cheaper price, and now you're trading them to a worse team before they even play a game and they're stuck with the same contract.

    Now THAT is something Reggie is definitely upset about - he feels you shouldn't be able to trade the player at all, but rather tear up the contract and make him a UFA if you can't afford him...perhaps we should discuss that alternative further in stead?
     
  5. Just to add one point.

    When the cap model was in discussion for the HFNHL we did take into consideration the UFA period that had just passed. Simply put, the cap model also introduced a 25% role back for the entire payroll which brought 29 of 30 teams under the hard cap at the point it was announced. Ottawa was the only team at the time that was over the $45M hard cap (St. Louis just barely squeeked under). We could not justify special rules or changes to existing rules that to help out one team. The fact that Ottawa had a payroll over $80M as at the end of the 2003/04 season(when the league average was approximately $33 or $34M) is the only reason you are currently faced with this challenge.

    At the time it was not noticed how much the the Islanders had spent on resigning UFA's so in the end the Isles are also in the same situation. Then again it goes to show why we were forced to introduce this rule in the first place. The Isles resigned potential UFA's Keith Tkachuk, Doug Weight, Adam Foote, Chris Chelios, Roman Cechmanek, and Teppo Numminen.

    Truth is, despite the fact you are perturbed, this event just demonstrated that the one year cash penalty is probably not enough. Had you let Modano go as a UFA you would have gotten a 2nd round compensation pick. Now, after paying a few bucks (I better not see that the trade was revised to include cash from Columbus to pay, in whole or in part, the penalty) you got material assets in return that probably still leaves you coming out ahead vs. the compensation pick. The league as a whole is the loser in these transactions as it limits the quality of players available on July 1st.

    ok ... so I lied when I said I just had one point to add :deadhorse
     
  6. Ville Isopaa

    Ville Isopaa Registered User

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    I also was affected by this rule with Amonte during the last season that was played. I had resigned him the previous season and as I was cutting all salaries early in the season, I had to bite the bullet and keep him around for half a season longer than I had planned. It killed a deal I had on him, but that's just life. In the end I think the rule is still good and has a legit reason to exist.

    btw, should cash transactions really be allowed in this kind of deals? Isn't that really working against the rule and trying to get around it? Atleast if the cash part is more than half the penalty for trading the player.
     
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