Rumor: Sakic says Duchene offers aren't good and he may stay with Avalanche

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

You don't have to be a fortune teller to make safe bets. We've seen this in the past with Snow and Lowe and Co.

We've also seen HF posters be completely and utterly wrong about what the Avs will get in return for their players in the past.

 

[Ivan13]

Snow - Vanek

Lowe - Eberle and Yakupov

Sell high, Sell High, SELL HIGH!!!! Oh wait...no takers because I horrendously overvalued my players...get whatever I can for them.

Vanek? You're comparing an UFA with Duchene? Great example, fantastic even.

Eberle? Isn't that on PC? There was no reason to move him when Lowe was there.

Yakupov? When did he ever had high value? Should they've traded him on the draft day?

Three examples, all horrible in the context of this discussion.

 

[Goulet17]

Snow - Vanek

Lowe - Eberle and Yakupov

Sell high, Sell High, SELL HIGH!!!! Oh wait...no takers because I horrendously overvalued my players...get whatever I can for them.

Did Yakupov ever have the kind of NHL value to be included in this conversation (outside of a year or so after his draft)? Also, the Isles acquired Vanek during his last season prior to UFA status, not exactly a comparable example IMO.

People may be knocking the Eberle trade by the Oilers, but Strome is a younger player than Eberle with more restrict contract years remaining and Strome has proven NHL ability (50 pts in one season, although he has struggled since). The underlying motivation for the Oilers is that they also were trying to free up cap space, an issue that the Avs do not have.

 

[Viqsi]

We've also seen HF posters be completely and utterly wrong about what the Avs will get in return for their players in the past.

Player, singular. Unless there's documented examples other than O'Reilly.

 

[THE HOFF]

I don't think it's a matter of intelligence. When gretzky got fired someone had a decent article saying how it's hard for guys like him to think the game like other players, and how he took it for granted that they don't have the vision or intuition he had.

It could just be a matter of Sakic not understanding these guys. Why don't they must play better, why don't they have the same investment in the franchise that I have?

It must be new territory when you used to be able to go out onto the ice and almost will results into reality and now they need their players and other gms to cooperate to get these outcomes.

great reaction to my post and many great points here. I agree with everything but I was referring to basic moves he made as a GM, I totally understand how difficult it might be for a guy that sees the game his way (let's add Roy here also) to understand how players fall short of expectations.

but by saying he was willing to trade Duchene, he was only going to do two things : lower the player's commitment AND lower his value. so when I read this :

I've been one of the bigger Sakic critics but I'm glad he holding strong on his asking price.

that translates to me as this : the toxic situation will go on.

sakic shot himself in the foot and will NEVER get fair value for Duchene as a result.

 

[Bubba88]

Sakic is out of his mind and lost Control. Wait for Duchene to get traded at the 19 TDL for a 1st or leaving as UFA.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

Why post in the megathread when we can bump a week old one?

 

[Deadly Dogma]

Sakic is out of his mind and lost Control. Wait for Duchene to get traded at the 19 TDL for a 1st or leaving as UFA.

All the gong show is all on the Avs owner.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

Sakic is out of his mind and lost Control. Wait for Duchene to get traded at the 19 TDL for a 1st or leaving as UFA.

Why is it so inconceivable to consider Duchene was never on the block and Sakic was only listening to offers? And why does Duchene HAVE to be traded now? Not like there is the entire 2017-18 season, 2018 Trade Deadline, 2018 NHL Draft, 2018 UFA period, 2018-19 season, or 2019 Trade Deadline. TRADE HIM NOW FOR SCRAPS!!!!!

The amount of over-reaction which I assume is fueled by boredom or their team wanting "crappy" Duchene is impressive.

All the gong show is all on the Avs owner.

Kroenke is to blame now. I can get behind that. We have went from players to coach to gm. Owner is the only one left to blame.

 

[Bronson]

Marcus Johansson returned a 2nd and a 3rd when dealt to a divisional rival and Duchene is supposed to return more than a first round pick, a top squad player and a top prospect when dealt to a team in the east? [MOD]

 

[JoemAvs]

Marcus Johansson returned a 2nd and a 3rd when dealt to a divisional rival and Duchene is supposed to return more than a first round pick, a top squad player and a top prospect when dealt to a team in the east?

We kind of don't want to salary dump Duchene and think he is way better than Johansson. If you and your GM disagree with that, we will be happy to block your phone number if needed and if you can't stop talking about or to us.


At this point the Avs probably should trade Duchene but we have Mr. Stubborn himself at the helm unfortunately. So the odds are very high that Duchene will be an Avalanche player next season anyways unless some team cracks and pays more than they think he is worth. Which at this point also seems rather unlikely.

So people will get their wish. They get to see Sakic go full moron and make a very risky bet on Duchene increasing or atleast maintaining his value over the next 12 months. And odds are high that it won't pay off and that you all will be able to say you were right and that Sakic should have traded him now and that the Avs are terrible. Happy now?

 

[BruinLVGA]

Sakic is out of his mind and lost Control. Wait for Duchene to get traded at the 19 TDL for a 1st or leaving as UFA.

It's definitely a risk. The more time passes, the worse his value gets anyway. He already has only 2 years left, I can't imagine teams wanting to meet Sakic's demands when he will have 1 year left or ufa.

 

[hullsy47]

keep him joe u signed him ...tired of this already ,just take the cap space even

 

[Viqsi]

Marcus Johansson returned a 2nd and a 3rd when dealt to a divisional rival and Duchene is supposed to return more than a first round pick, a top squad player and a top prospect when dealt to a team in the east? Keep hitting that crack pipe, Suckic.

Johansson was a salary-cap-desperation move, and not a particularly good one. I don't think that applies here.

 

[Bubba88]

Why is it so inconceivable to consider Duchene was never on the block and Sakic was only listening to offers? And why does Duchene HAVE to be traded now? Not like there is the entire 2017-18 season, 2018 Trade Deadline, 2018 NHL Draft, 2018 UFA period, 2018-19 season, or 2019 Trade Deadline. TRADE HIM NOW FOR SCRAPS!!!!!

The amount of over-reaction which I assume is fueled by boredom or their team wanting "crappy" Duchene is impressive.



Kroenke is to blame now. I can get behind that. We have went from players to coach to gm. Owner is the only one left to blame.

I don't even care for my Team to get him... best offer I'd be interested in would be Anisimov, Forsling + 2nd. I know the answer already and I don't want him as 2 year rental. He'd be gone after that.

You really think that nobody wants to trade him for 1 1/2 years now? Like this is just all other GMs interested in a Player that is untouchable?
We've seen this movie before and it didn't end well for the Team.

I don't think that Hamonic + Little more is scraps or Fabbro+ is scraps.
Duchene is on the block with all those interest, with Sakic always talking about it, like really he does get quoted lots of times about Duchene.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

I don't even care for my Team to get him... best offer I'd be interested in would be Anisimov, Forsling + 2nd. I know the answer already and I don't want him as 2 year rental. He'd be gone after that.

You really think that nobody wants to trade him for 1 1/2 years now? Like this is just all other GMs interested in a Player that is untouchable?
We've seen this movie before and it didn't end well for the Team.

I don't think that Hamonic + Little more is scraps or Fabbro+ is scraps.
Duchene is on the block with all those interest, with Sakic always talking about it, like really he does get quoted lots of times about Duchene.

Because that is all anyone asks him about. He has never once said "I am actively shopping Matt". You talk about the 1 1/2 year rental but to a playoff team that believes he is the missing piece, he is very very valuable. Could he have been the difference for Nashville last season? Maybe, maybe not, but his term is not that big of a negative.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Very risky move by Sakic if he keeps him for 2017-18 season. Clearly Duchene does not want to come back and it showed in the second half of the season. In my opinion. That did hurt his value and if he were to come back and have an horrible start which is more than likely considering where he is mentally right now (according to rumors) and the team around him, Sakic will have a lot of trouble getting fair value.

I'm curious to see how this situation end. Personally, I'd love to see him land in Montreal but I don't see anything that we would be willing to part with that Colorado at this point.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

Very risky move by Sakic if he keeps him for 2017-18 season. Clearly Duchene does not want to come back and it showed in the second half of the season. In my opinion. That did hurt his value and if he were to come back and have an horrible start which is more than likely considering where he is mentally right now (according to rumors) and the team around him, Sakic will have a lot of trouble getting fair value.

I'm curious to see how this situation end. Personally, I'd love to see him land in Montreal but I don't see anything that we would be willing to part with that Colorado at this point.

I think what hurt his value the most was the world championships. Every Av player outside of Soderberg (Mackinnon, Landeskog, Compher, Pickard, and Barrie) showed they still had it and their season may have been an anomaly. Duchene moved down the Canada lineup fast and he was playing with all-stars.

To me that shows his weak mental game and he beats himself up more than we do and that is pretty bad.

 

[BaseballCoach]

We kind of don't want to salary dump Duchene and think he is way better than Johansson. If you and your GM disagree with that, we will be happy to block your phone number if needed and if you can't stop talking about or to us.

At this point the Avs probably should trade Duchene but we have Mr. Stubborn himself at the helm unfortunately. So the odds are very high that Duchene will be an Avalanche player next season anyways unless some team cracks and pays more than they think he is worth. Which at this point also seems rather unlikely.

Sometimes the best deals are the ones you don't make, for example the Habs dodging the Lucic bullet.

The one that comes to mind in this case is the Sharks NOT trading Patrick Marleau after his terrible season at 28 yo in 2007-2008. His production plummeted into the 40s at a time when scorers were getting at least 10 points more than they do today.

That being said, I think there is risk here, and as hypothetical Habs GM, I would not offer much in terms of good players on my roster already. I imagine real-life GMs are mostly thinking the same.

It may well be that Duchene will rebound from last year's debacle, and that NOT trading him for current perceived value is the best decision Sakic can make.

 

[More 2004]

Wasn't COL Duchene's favorite team growing up? Odd that it has become such a sour situation that he wants out.

 

[clownshoes]

At this point he should probably just wait and hope Duchene has a bounce back season, then trade him at the deadline. Though I doubt he will bounce much higher than last season with all the mental games going on.

 

[SI90]

Wasn't COL Duchene's favorite team growing up? Odd that it has become such a sour situation that he wants out.

Did he ever say he wants out? I remember him responding to a question that was asked and he said if it helped the team and a change might be good. I don't ever think he directly said he wants a trade or doesn't want to play for the Avs

 

[SniperOnTheWing]

Wasn't COL Duchene's favorite team growing up? Odd that it has become such a sour situation that he wants out.

Like the old adage goes, "never play for your heroes"

 

[NORiculous]

Wasn't COL Duchene's favorite team growing up? Odd that it has become such a sour situation that he wants out.

Goes to show how "well" this team is managed.

 

[TorstenFrings]

Because that is all anyone asks him about. He has never once said "I am actively shopping Matt". You talk about the 1 1/2 year rental but to a playoff team that believes he is the missing piece, he is very very valuable. Could he have been the difference for Nashville last season? Maybe, maybe not, but his term is not that big of a negative.

Name one instance of a GM saying "I am actively shopping X". They don't even say it that bluntly, when they are talking about journeyman UFAs at the deadline. They just imply and maybe say it more to the point through some media type. Sakic has also not said "Matt Duchene is not for sale and will fullfill his contract with the Avalanche."

If he never intended to trade Duchene under any circumstances, he should have come right out and put an end to it. I think, we can all agree, that is not what happened.
So, maybe he only intended to feel out the market and only trade him for something that really knocked his socks off. Sure, that's not even that unlikely. But do you disagree that he needs to **** or get off the pot some time soon? He has been "feeling out the market" for over a years. He doesn't need to trade Duchene, but he needs to either trade him or pull him off the block. Very publicly.

The media is not a passive bystander in this situation, but neither is Sakic. Come on!