Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by Watsatheo, May 20, 2007.
Which prospect do you prefer?
O'Marra by a fair bit.
I felt since both they were drafted that O'Marra had better offensively potential and similar defensively and intangibles potential (maybe an small edge to Chipchura), right now I would take O'Marra for the chance he would produce more on the scoresheet.
I assume O'Marra has more offensive upside, but Chipchura is one of those players that goes unnoticed. He's been really good in his own end and on the PK this year in Hamilton as a rookie. Offensively he's scored some pretty goals but at the nhl I got to wonder if he will ever produce that much. Although at this point it's hard to say as he's in his first year in the AHL and O'Marra just finished his OHL career.
I thought they were even enough back when O'Marra was drafted, and I guess picking between them would then depend on whether you liked more of a bang-and-crash guy with some finish (O'Marra) or whether you liked a guy with more playmaking ability and hockey sense (Chipchura).
I know this season was somewhat marred by injury for O'Marra and all, yet I couldn't help but think he failed to progress. I probably saw him around a dozen times in all, and he seemed to have lost his touch to some extent.
So while it's too early to say anything for sure, I'd pick Chipchura, because he's moving more conclusively in the right direction from the games I've seen. His game is only getting better and better as the season and AHL playoffs proceed. O'Marra could easily make up that ground next season himself, but the point of fact is that right at the moment that's an unknown. So Chipchura edges ahead.
chipchura is going to be a good nhl player. but i feel o'marra has the potential to be a good second liner, while i see chipchura more in a defensive third line role. for that reason i would pick o'marra.
agreed, however Chipchura has the potential to turn into an Andreychuck... is that a bad thing? but seeing as we already have Higgins, Komi and supposedly Fischer (huge leader...huh ) i would take O'Marra...more scoring
I'm happy with Chip...still think he's better than ladd...so what do it know
A guy who never scored more than 21 goals in junior?
So your saying Chipchura has the potential to turn into a 2 time 50 goal scorer(Andreychuk)?
I saw it as a late career Andreychuk... he did say O'Marra has more scoring abilities(which is true) and I think we all know he doesn't really have the upside to score 50..
I don't know O'Marra much, but, if I take from what I read in this thread,
O'marra has 2nd liner potential
Chipchura has 3rd line potential.
From that only, gotta give the edge to o'marra...BUT
I believeCHipchura can ba an ELITE 3rd defensive center.
Can O'marra be an ELITE 2nd liner?
I much prefer a veyr good 3rd liner to a average/good 2nd liner.
Where did O'Marra get all this offensive potential from ? His numbers in the O were nothing special and he was a crash bang guy at the WJC.
I see him as a third line guy all the way.
lol this is exactly what i meant, the inspirational Leadership qualities of Andreychuck in the latter stage of his career, his role Behind LeCavalier and Richards. Clearly someone who doesn't have more offensive upside then O'Marra (30-35 goals maybe) can't be seen as someone who can score 50 goals
then again who knows...no one here would've predicted Messier's career...no one, except someone who sees potential greatness in everyone
this is what's great about life is that u can't pedict anything...only make an educated guess
As a Habs fan I love having Chipchura in our system, but I still think I'd trade him for O'marra because I think the habs need a little more offensive potential from their prospects.
The one thing that I think is being left out in this arguement is Chipchura's leadership qualities. He was the captain of team Canada and is already developing a leadership role on the bulldogs as a rookie. That alone is pretty impressive.
o'marra actually has great leadership qualities aswell.
In 2002-03 Oâ€™Marra won the 2003 Carnation Cup with the Mississauga Senators where he scored 111 points in 76 games.
Represented Canada at the 2003/ 2004 Under-18 Junior World Cup where he scored
5 points in 5 games with 3 goals 2 assists.
He was Canada's captain at the 2004-2005 World Under-18 championships and helped in leading Canada to a silver medal when he scored a team-leading five goals (tied for third most in the tournament) in six tournament games.
He was an alternate captain on Canadaâ€™s gold medal Under-18 summer team at the 2004 Junior World Cup in the Czech Republic.
Won a gold medal with Team Ontario at the 2004 World Under-17 Hockey Challenge in St. Johnâ€™s, NL where he scored 3 goals and 5 assists for 8 points in 6 games.
Played in the 2005 CHL Top Prospects Game in Vancouver BC.
Won a gold medal with Canadaâ€™s National Junior Team at the 2006 IIHF World Junior Championship in British Columbia.
In 2006 he also participated in the 2006 OHL All-Star Classic.
Oâ€™Marra was named the Player of the Game for Team OHL in the 2006 ADT Canada-Russia Challenge, where he notched the opening goal and an assist on the game winning goal.
He became a double gold medalist with the Canadian National Junior Team, winning the gold medal at the 2007 IIHF World Junior Championships.
In his four OHL seasons, he has scored at almost a point-per-game pace with 89-122-211 in 227 career games and has 290 penalty minutes. He has added another 15 points with nine goals and six assists in 15 playoff games.
That makes absolutely 0 sense. A player on the second line is there because he is better than the players on the third line (usually). O'Marra and Chipchura have extremely similar styles, so if one is a second liner and one is a third liner, it's because one is better than the other. What the hell is an elite third liner anyways?
I don't think a Richard Zednik is better then a Mike Peca. Each have different roles.
Talking about making no sense, that was pretty a senseless post, anyone who follows hockey knows that the 2nd line is the offensive B squad & the 3rd line is the top defensive player. So yeah, I'd take an elite 3rd liner ahead of a so-so 2nd liner.
The way that Chipchura is performing in the AHL playoffs this year make be believe that he's more of a big game performer. After all, winning the cup is what it's all about.
hmmm...well, people have responded earlier...I guess you know by now.
Just for your education...
An elite thrid liner is one of the best defensive forward in the league. This year I guess we could say sammy pahlsson is one since he is in nomination for the selke...I wouldn't put him in that category yet though... In this category, I see John Madden as the perfect exemple. Guy Carbonneau and Gainey, though I was too young to watch them play, I believe were in that category too.
My opinion is that O’Mara could also be an elite (meaning very good) 3rd line forward because of his defensive abilities but I also believe that he has the offensive ability to be an elite (meaning very good) 2nd line forward.
I see O’Mara, kind of in the same mold as Jonathan Toews. Toews has been known as a good defensive player and up until now wasn’t really recognized so much for his offensive ability.
There was a reason that O’Mara played in a defensive role at his first WJC and that was that he was a good defensive forward with offensive abilities. But at this years WJC, he was used in a more offensive role, playing on a line with Cogliano and Pyatt.There was a reason for that also, he is a good offensive forward with defensive abilities.
Toews did the same thing; he played a defensive role at his first WJC and an offensive role at his second WJC.
It seems to me that when a prospect is hyped as being a really good offensive player, the first thing that the team that drafts him want to do is make sure that he is not a defensive liabilty. So a lot of the time, these offensive players have to play on a 3rd or 4th line or in the minors so that they develop their defensive abilities.
So when a guy like O’Mara or Toews is drafted as a complete player (the safe pick) because he already is very good defensively, it doesn’t mean he is not good offensively. It means he is good both offensively and defensively.
When prospects considered “a complete player” go to the NHL they may not have to spend as much time working on their defensive game, which allows them to become part of the offence a lot sooner.
hmmm...the point was not saying if he was good or not it was saying if he was VERY good or not. All the numbers you showed don't impress me ont bit. He was playing in the OHL, which is a very offensive league. AND, at the U-18, many good players perform awesome because it seems to be a pretty easy tourney(at least offensively). This guy is a first rounder you just HAVE to expect that he has achieved quite a few things... but since most of what you told me are things he did at the u-18 and such, it's not so impressive...I don't mean to say that he wont be good, but just that this looks like its impressive, but it's not that much in fact...
Thanks, not that made sense
Note that I wasnt trying to disregard O'Marra, who I don't know much...I was jsut showing my opinion on what I knew and what I thought. I kind of fell that most of those complete players end up as 3rdliner, not because they wouldn't fit a second line, but because they can play a role that no one else on the team plays as well..they might be kinda victims of their own talents..still, its probably what will keep them in the NHl for many years..