Ryan Miller Vs. Henrik Lundqvist

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NYRGoalieGlut*

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I love these posts where someone says Ryan Miller or RM and doesn't give a reason. All I want is a reason. Has anyone seen the Rangers defense? I mean, the defense is playing better than the talent but it's not very good. It can be argued that Lundqvist is the MVP of the Rangers, without him, they'd be .500 at best, even with Jagr and Prucha. Without Miller Biron had what 13 straight wins? I'm not saying Lundqvist will be better, but jesus, there's nothing more frustrating than having a thread for discussion and you get "Ryan Miller". Absolutely no answer as to why. Can this be elaborated? Just like someone called him a flash in the pan. This is ridiculous. If you make claims back them up. I didn't really have too good of an argument and that's why I'm saying that I don't know the answer, I do know who's more valuable this year. If I did have an answer I'd back it up instead of "Ryan Miller", um well, um, I guess it's because he's um, not playing for the Rangers, and um that's about it. Oh and um, he doesn't look flashy all the time when making saves, so um I'll take Miller. Plus Miller is much easier to pronounce. How about some credibility?

Edit: It's ridiculous there are even more people than I thought that picked Miller (in fact pretty much everyone that isn't a Rangers fan and Rangers fans had some explanations, what a novel idea). :shakehead It's ridiculous Lundqvist carried his team and is the only reason they are where they are. Yet this is practically a shutout for Miller. For some reason I think people think that as I said because Lundqvist doesn't do cartwheels on the ice and jump around like a slinky he doesn't have much of an upside or something. Why doesn't someone watch a game (and of course there are exceptions). Once again, even though this sounds like I'm saying he'll be better, I don't know that. My only point is, I don't know why it's so skewed towards Miller, honestly. Seriously, if I didn't know any better, I'd pull the North American bias card, but I know better, or at least hope I wouldn't have to use that card. (Of course if he was Lehtonen and was a high first round pick, that card would useless).
 
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NYRGoalieGlut*

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BTW, one more thing it's hilarious, the guy was never given his due when he was great in the SEL, and no one ever considered him too great of a prospect, the guy is the Rodney Dangerfield of hockey. Whatever, he'll prove everyone wrong.
 

Levitate

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miller = better known prospect, and was more hyped as a great upcoming goalie than lundqvist. playing in NA didn't hurt either...not saying a bias against euros, but a bias against people who didn't play in the college, AHL, etc....therefor getting more exposure than a late round pick who played off in sweden

personally, i have no idea...right now it seems like they're very close and i think it'll stay that way. i hate to play the fence sitter, but i can see these guys putting up practically identical numbers in their careers if they keep it up.

i love lundqvist but there's no denying that miller is a good one too...to give an answer, i'll just say lundqvist because i'm biased and love how he's come out of nowhere (well, kinda...ranger fans were pretty sure he'd be good this year, but not this good this fast) to carry this team so far. and he's a great fit for NYC and ranger fans, which can be more important than you think playing on the rangers
 

Davisian

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2 very good young goalies, and I'm happy with Lundqvist.


Regarding Miller- Let him be a lesson to Ranger fans for the reason to keep Montoya in the AHL for a couple seasons.
 

Icicle

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Biron got those 13 wins letting in 3-4 goals a game. Most of which were bad. The Sabres won those games because of a very energetic offense.
 

NYRGoalieGlut*

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Levitate, you bring up a good point. That said, that's ridiculous. If people are doing that consciously, shame on them. What a poor reason, because they know Miller better. At least say, I know Miller better and maybe even pick him, but this Ryan Miller thing, and no explanation is ridiculous. As I said, maybe I should say I'm better than both of them and leave it at that. Same kind of credibility. At least back up your statements. Or are these people lazy. C'mon everyone that was too lazy to actually explain, come back and explain.

P.S. The whole offense reason for Biron winning those games is all fine and good now, but why do I have a feeling that if Miller won those games he'd get the credit and not the offense? And that was probably a bad argument. Still it's undeniable that Lundqvist is more important to his team. He constantly has pressure on him to be awesome. Unlike Miller that has an offense and a better defense to fall back on. Oh and if I see another one of those shots on goal stats I'll scream. Most overrated stat there is. (Of course a team that gives up 35 on average probably isn't very good on D and 25 on average is probably pretty good on D but these are extremes). If a team allows 30 wide open bad angle shots and another 20 point blank shots, which goalie has it easier?
 

cybresabre

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NYRGoalieGlut said:
P.S. The whole offense reason for Biron winning those games is all fine and good now, but why do I have a feeling that if Miller won those games he'd get the credit and not the offense?
If Miller had played as well as Biron and put up similar stats during that 13 game stretch, while the offense showed up every night like it did, then the offense would still get the credit, hell-- even if Andrei Trefilov was in net. We had adequate goaltending, but certainly not the stand-on-head calibre that would merit extra attention. The offense would bail us out and even if we were down a goal, we managed to end up winning.

I'm a big supporter of Ryan and haven't seen Henrik play often, so I'm not going to make a choice.
 

UAGoalieGuy

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Lundqvist now 20-6-5..his GAA will shrink from 2.17 after letting in one vs. the Devils and his save% will go up somemore from .925 with 31 saves. This is 3 wins in 4 nights for him. That tells a lot about his endurance and conditioning. He keeps this up he should be in the top 3 in the rookie of the year voting at year end.

BTW: Lundqvist is the first Rangers rookie goalie to get 20 wins since Richters rookie year.
 
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Skroob*

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Davisian said:
2 very good young goalies, and I'm happy with Lundqvist.


Regarding Miller- Let him be a lesson to Ranger fans for the reason to keep Montoya in the AHL for a couple seasons.

i dont think hes gonna have a choice, Davisian. Lundqvist isnt gonna let anyone else see the light of day, methinks.
 

Chainshot

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2Leetch_94 said:
Actually, it's 2-0 Miller but what this exactly prove? Lundqvist was the best Ranger on the ice.

He was at that and for someone under the spotlight of NY press attention, he's a remarkably well-spoken and press-savvy young man. It looks like the East should have some dynamite goaltending matchups for years to come with the likes of Lehtonen, Lundqvist, MAF, Miller, Niittymaki, Toivonen, Ward, et. al.

With some smarter play from a well-payed defenseman tonight, this one probably goes to a shootout. And we might still be watching them shoot. :D
 

2Leetch_94

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Chainshot said:
He was at that and for someone under the spotlight of NY press attention, he's a remarkably well-spoken and press-savvy young man. It looks like the East should have some dynamite goaltending matchups for years to come with the likes of Lehtonen, Lundqvist, MAF, Miller, Niittymaki, Toivonen, Ward, et. al.

With some smarter play from a well-payed defenseman tonight, this one probably goes to a shootout. And we might still be watching them shoot. :D


God knows the Rangers like long shootouts. Perhaps, we might of seen that that well-payed defenseman at his best. ;)

But, the East does have a ton of very talented goaltenders and youngsters, period. Going to be very exciting to watch for years to come.
 

czarin

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Both goalies are great, no doubt.Lundqvist made some great saves tonight as did Miller.They look like they will have very similar careers if they stay on pace.Im not going to choose any goalie over the other tho, i havent seen enough of Lundqvist to make a judgement and even if i did my choice would prolly still be biased to Miller as im a Sabres fan.But either way i think it will be answered if we can both stay at 4-5th in the standings.Would be a great playoff series :)..i think that would/could answer this very nice debate :)
 

sabresrat

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FLYLine88 said:
:biglaugh:


Great reasoning!

It ties into experience in the North American game. Salo was the last one to do anything, and he didn't stick around long once people figured him out.

Right now the answer is Miller. Once Lundqvist has sustained success, it will be him. He certainly looks more talented.
 

UAGoalieGuy

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I think the reason Salo fell apart was because of that goal he let in in the 2002 olympics off his head or somethin crazy like that against Belarus. He never recovered mentally from that imo.
 

Levitate

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sabresrat said:
It ties into experience in the North American game. Salo was the last one to do anything, and he didn't stick around long once people figured him out.

Right now the answer is Miller. Once Lundqvist has sustained success, it will be him. He certainly looks more talented.

salo played in NA for quite awhile...and by your logic, the great finnish goaltender is a myth, and the only good goalies in the NHL are US or canadian
 

Synergy27

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The way I look at it, I truly do not care how good Ryan Miller is (and he is very, very good, no doubt). There are only two players in the NHL right now who I would be willing to trade Lundqvist straight up for, Ovechkin and Crosby. Not Phaneuf, not Richards, Not Lehtonen. Watching him play night in and night out, he is extremely poised, plays perfect positionally, and shows quick reflexes when these things fail him. He gives the Rangers a chance to win almost every single game he plays in, and when I remember that he is still just a 23 year old rookie, all of these positives are magnified.
 
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