Ryan Kesler potential?

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by trahans99, Nov 18, 2004.

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  1. trahans99

    trahans99 Registered User

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    Looking back now did Vancouver make the right pick in 2003 draft w/ Ryan Kesler?

    What is his potential? On TSN website it says hes a potential 3rd line player. If thats all he has potential to be, then I think he was picked too early (23rd overall in 2003). Again I don't know too much about this kid, but if TSN is right Vancouver made a mistake in a very deep draft.



    What was his ranking going into the draft? Or where was he projected to get picked?
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2004
  2. leafaholix*

    leafaholix* Guest

    He has no hands and will depend on his strength to produce at the NHL level, he's a very strong player physically and good defensively, but there's no offense there.
     
  3. Roughneck

    Roughneck Registered User

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    I definitely wouldn't say he was the wrong pick, but he was a safe pick. He won't be a star in this league, but he will be a solid player. They could have taken a greater risk, but there was something they liked about him and if he's playing on the 3rd line, netting 15 goals a season, it definitely wasn't a bad pick.

    Yes they could have gotten a better player, but they still got a good player.
     
  4. Douggy

    Douggy Registered User

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    And whats with all the Kesler jokes lately??
     
  5. Russian_fanatic

    Russian_fanatic Registered User

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    He put 15 pounds over the summer, and he has been playing some good hockey in the AHL, and is producing point. He has great speed, and I expect him to hit once he starts getting older. Kesler is a shutdown type guy, and even in the AHL he is playing against the teams top lines. I see so much Madden in Kesler. At first I didn't believe it, but I believe it now! There is no doubt in my mind once Kesler spends sometime in the NHL he will become a 20 goal scorer(not 25 or anything that far). His defensive game is superb at such a young age. Overall I'm VERY happy with this Kesler pick.
     
  6. Dapper Beast

    Dapper Beast Proper Villain

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    I watched the St.Johns versus Manitoba game last night and Manitoba fans (and others) were claiming Kesler was having a slow night, but I still thought he was the most mature looking player on either team. When I say that I mean he's exceptionally responsible, smart and active on the ice. Mark my words this kid has intangibles we haven't even seen yet and people who say he has 'no offense' are kidding themselves. Around these boards I'm starting to think he's pretty underrated and I was one of the people 'miffed as heck' (politically correct phrase) when the Canucks picked him. But night in and out this season I've heard him referred to as the 'most dangerous looking player' on the ice during radio broadcasted Moose games. Last night was my first chance to see him and I must admit he's impressive. And I'm starting to get the impression he's fairly 'clutch', as they say...he's a player who has responded very well to pressure situations thus far.

    So don't write Kesler off as a 3rd line checker with no offensive upside. That scouting report sells him short imho. I think at the very least he'll be a premier checking centre in the NHL and could, if he can further elevate his offensive game, easily have top-6, two-way upside.
     
  7. LaVal

    LaVal Registered User

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    how valuable are guys like John Madden, Mike Peca, etc to their team? his upside is different from that of most prospects, but doesn't mean it's any less valuable. that's why it's stupid when he's compared to an offensive prospect and people say they'd take the offensive prospect because Kesler's only projected to be a 3rd liner. how many hit or miss 2nd line scoring prospects are there compared to sure-fire heart and soul 2-way checkers?
     
  8. LaVal

    LaVal Registered User

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    he was ranked the 16th overall NA skater by CSS, projected to be picked around 20-25.. so he went where he was supposed to.
     
  9. Rabid Ranger

    Rabid Ranger 2 is better than one

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    You're right, you do tend to exaggerate. Kesler's not going to be a sniper at the NHL level, but to suggest he has "no hands" and "no offense" is a joke. He is fully capable of scoring 25 goals at the NHL level, and I expect him to do that in the near future while playing a great two-way game.
     
  10. X-SHARKIE

    X-SHARKIE Registered User

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    Agreed, plus this guy is going to be a head ache for opponets, and well be an MVP in the playoffs. You need guys like this to have a good team in the NHL.
     
  11. ginner classic

    ginner classic Registered User

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    guys like Kesler are essential if you want to win a cup. Suggesting he has Madden, Peca, Ricci, Brind'amour, Linden potential says he is a very very good prospect. He may not have a gret shot, but he is a great passer, I would rather have him over a softer, one-way player with 30 goal 'potential' any day.
     
  12. theo6060

    theo6060 Registered User

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    I disagree. I would be surprised if he ever got a 25 goal season, even if he were playing on the top line. The guy is just no gifted offensively. While he can do everything else well, he IS a 3rd liner. I'm not taking away what he does for a team, I'm just saying he's not going to produce offensively. I'd be happy with 15 from him and 30 points altogether. For what he brings, Vancouver was stupid to take him over Anthony Stewart. They'll have a hard time living that one down for a long time when Stewart reaches offensive totals Kesler could never get.
     
  13. Buffaloed

    Buffaloed webmaster

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    He's a bigger version of Matt Stajan and just as underrated.
     
  14. ZombieMatt

    ZombieMatt Registered User

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    When I see Kesler playing I see him as a 40-50 point kind of player in terms of offensive production. He will consistently be around 17-23 goals and roughly the same number of assists, perhaps slightly more if he gets second PP line action. He is a heart and soul type of player, a "skilled" defensive specialist if that makes sense, and I don't mean a guy who has offensive abilities. He has the potential to be an elite defensive player, not 'just another' third liner.
     
  15. NFITO

    NFITO hockeyinsanity*****

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    When Kesler was drafted I was pretty disappointed... I was very high on Stewart and really wanted to canucks to draft him.

    But Kesler's turned out to be a good pick for us.... his upside is definitely not as high as many of the 2003 first rounders... but where he lacks in his total ceiling, he makes up for lack of risk with him - he is already NHL ready and was as an 18 YO when he made the team... although the canucks do not like rushing prospects, they still signed him and gave him NHL time last year... last year he was the youngest player in the AHL as well, and even this year is among the youngest in the league, where most players can't play until they're 20 (with Kesler he's exempt because he's not coming from major junior, but from the NCAA).

    he is literally still a boy among men in his league, and still looks more mature than most players on the ice.

    I agree his upside is that of a 3rd liner, but that means little today... players like Ricci, Brind'Amor, etc that have been mentioned here have the same upside... they play in the top 6 on weaker teams, and Kesler will be able to do the same, but where such players are most valuable is on a shut-down role - that's what they do best.

    Kesler is no different... we have 2 other players who are very valuable to our team that play the same role - Linden and Cooke, and Kesler constantly gets compared to Linden... but with Cooke - he's best in a 3rd line role, but that doesn't reduce his value to the team, and IMO is more valuable to our success than most top 6 players are to their team's success.... Cooke can play on the top unit as he did last season when Bert went down, and did very well, but he's a much bigger asset for us on the 3rd unit.

    I see Kesler in the same mold... a guy who can jump into the 2nd line when needed, and one who won't look out of place there, but will likely be an average top 6 player, whereas he can be an elite 3rd line player.

    Linden is similar... his stats were bloated in his early days because 1) NHL scoring was up, and 2) the linemates he got on some offensive canuck clubs... but the points he got were essentially from hard work, not from talent with the puck... Kesler carries the same type of intangibles... he's not untalented - he does have hands, and speed to burn (and speed is a huge asset to put up points), but his hands and offensive abilities don't separate him from many other prospects out there... where he is a notch above from most prospects is in other intangibles - defensive ability, faceoffs, character, leadership... these are the things that he will bring his team in his career, and these are the things that are usually ignored by most fans, yet valued highly by teams - and things that carry a team when it matters most - in the playoffs!

    Even now there are probably a couple other players picked after Kesler that I probably would have gone with, but they are all higher risks... take Stewart for example - great talent, top notch prospect... his ceiling IMO is much higher than Kesler's. Where he falls short though is risk. Kesler is already NHL ready and at worst he's going to be a 3rd line NHL player - AT WORST. Stewart, while he may be a dominating top liner in the mold of Doan, or Bertuzzi, he may also turn into an Isbister... the risk is simply greater for Stewart than it is for Kesler to be a key part of his team in the future.

    Personally, I take that risk... the upside is to good to ignore... but if a team wants to play it safe, which the canucks did, as they want someone soon to come in and play a key role, than Kesler was their man... next hockey season Kesler will be a regular in our lineup, and will quickly move up the depth chart, taking over Linden's spot by the time he retires, and eventually IMO his role on the team as he matures and gets more experienced.... Stewart may be in the lineup next season, but chances of him cracking the lineup and being a key part, of a contending team, is not likely to happen for a few years.
     
  16. sunb

    sunb Registered User

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    Stop making uneducated comments.
    He has better hands than you'd think. How does he have "no hands" and "no offense there" when he has is the 18th leading scorer in the AHL with 6 goals and 14 points playing from a defensive shut-down role?
     
  17. sunb

    sunb Registered User

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    That is contingent upon the fact that Anthony Stewart will:
    1.) Make the NHL
    2.) Reach his offensive potential
    3.) Make the top 2 lines
    4.) Make the NHL soon and play there for a long time (because Kesler surely will)
     
  18. Rabid Ranger

    Rabid Ranger 2 is better than one

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    Who cares if Stewart scores more points? By focusing on that, you're ignoring the rest of Kesler's game, which isn't measured in mere production. He'll prove to be just as valuable, maybe even more so.
     
  19. leafaholix*

    leafaholix* Guest

    Except Matt Stajan has a lot more offensive abilities.

    Just watching them play against one-another last night, Stajan was one of the most dangerous offensive players on the ice. He's gotten so much bigger and stronger than last season, Stajan's easily the better player.
     
  20. leafaholix*

    leafaholix* Guest

    Have you seen him play at all? Ryan Kesler's not very smooth with the puck. He has a good shot and great positioning, that's the way he'll produce at the NHL level.

    Btw, I think andora's waiting on your response...

    http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.php?p=2123783#post2123783
     
  21. Rabid Ranger

    Rabid Ranger 2 is better than one

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    So much better that he's being outscored by Kesler this year and isn't nearly as complete a player.
     
  22. LaVal

    LaVal Registered User

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    it's comments like this that get me riled up. again, ignoring all other facets of the game except point totals. top-6 forwards are a dime a dozen, yet guys like John Madden are a rare and precious commodity, and often more important to their team than most realize.

    and who says Kesler can't produce in the NHL anyhow? a lack of natural offensive gifts never stopped guys like Ryan Smyth and Adam Deadmarsh from producing. players that that score from hard work, determination, sacrifice, and using their other gifts (e.g. size) to their full advantage. this is exactly the way Kesler plays.
     
  23. leafaholix*

    leafaholix* Guest

    Yeah, he has 3 more points while playing on a much superior offense.

    Btw, you want to compare the "completeness" of the two? Stajan's offensive advantage as well as his defensive game would beat out Kesler's defensive game and mediocre offensive game.

    It was evident last night, Stajan could have had 2 or 3 points. His offensive game has picked up with the size he's put on, he's a lot stronger now.

    Stajan's upside - great 2nd line centre/winger
    Kesler's upside - great 3rd line centre
     
  24. Captain Conservative

    Captain Conservative Registered User

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    That may be so, but Kesler is a full year younger than Stajan! Wait a second......

    I read some notes one of the Mckeens scouts posted from a Manitoba game, and he seemed to think that Kesler had signifigant upside
     
  25. theo6060

    theo6060 Registered User

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    When did I ignore the other facets of Kesler's game? I was replying to a comment about his scoring, which is why I said I would be happy with 15 from him in a season. My intentions aren't to rile you up, but this guy plays a game more suitable for the 3rd line. Never did I say that was a bad thing. The fact is, 3rd liners like him play that style because it's what they're good at and their hard work goes a long way, but, they don't receive top 6 ice time because if you're a top 6 forward, you have to put the points up! A lack of offensive gifts is what's keeping him from going to another level. Which, by the way, he should be a 6.5 on HF since he'll never put up second line points no matter how hard he works.
     
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