Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XI: We can read between the lines

[Thirty One]

Really hard to evaluate any winger on this team given the fact we are so weak up the middle. Zib is a number 2 center taking a role of a number 1. Way too inconsistent. Miller is a wing playing center and Hayes has turned into our checking center. Coming into the season we all knew how weak this position would be and it turned out to be true.

Sounds like it would be unfair to evaluate the centers too. And it wouldn't be fair to evaluate the defense, when they're playing behind a forward group that is completely unevaluable. No evaluation this year.

 

[silverfish]

ITT: Vesey is so much better than you're making him out to be.

Also ITT: Why would he get more than $1m AAV?

Wut

 

[Drew4u]

No chance Gordon gives Miller 5.5. Zbad only got 5.3 and he was viewed as the team's future top center. I think something around 4- 4.5 is reasonable.

 

[Avery16]

ITT: Vesey is so much better than you're making him out to be.

Also ITT: Why would he get more than $1m AAV?

Wut

I think the issue here is that there is a gap between adequate bottom-six performance and a 2 mill/year contract. You can be contributing on this team's bottom six and make less than what you're complaining Vesey is supposedly going to make next season.

 

[Lion Hound]

I hope $5.5 isn't the next cap hit for JT Miller...And I like Miller. I guess the cap increase is going to factor. Weird, you almost hope he has a really bad second half of the season to get him at a lesser number.

 

[silverfish]

I think the issue here is that there is a gap between adequate bottom-six performance and a 2 mill/year contract. You can be contributing on this team's bottom six and make less than what you're complaining Vesey is supposedly going to make next season.

Guess we'll see. Hope I'm wrong and you're right.

 

[DanielBrassard]

No chance Gordon gives Miller 5.5. Zbad only got 5.3 and he was viewed as the team's future top center. I think something around 4- 4.5 is reasonable.

Miller is going to be coming off back to back 50+ point seasons, with only 1 year left before UFA I think, so I can't see him getting much less than Zib.

 

[Kupo]

If Vesey was better, or more complete of a hockey player, he wouldn’t be a bottom 6 forward.

 

[Avery16]

Miller is going to be coming off back to back 50+ point seasons, with only 1 year left before UFA I think, so I can't see him getting much less than Zib.

He's not a C, though. I think his hit will come somewhere between Zucc's 4.5 and Zib's 5.35, but probably closer to Kreider's 4.625. All depending on the term, of course.

 

[Off Sides]

I don't think they are going to throw extra money at Vesey. Usually the Rangers look at what the other RFAs that have similar stats are getting, or have received, for bridges and they offer something in that range, because that is what the player would get if he went through with arbitration anyway.

For example, Josh Anderson may be a comparable player in stats, he ended up signing for 3 years at a 1.85M cap hit. If the Rangers go two years its going to be a little cheaper than that. So while I said above like 1.2M, 1.5M or so may be the better range based on that comparable.

Miller is different, he is going to get a contract that is higher than seems normal because he only has one RFA year left. Rangers have far less leverage there. He could go to arbitration, take the one year award and be a pure UFA the very next off season. Usually the player and team hedge their bets, player wants the security of a bigger guaranteed contract so will take a little less, team owns their rights longer so will pay a little more, all gets wrapped up in some compromise.

 

[Avery16]

If Vesey was better, or more complete of a hockey player, he wouldn’t be a bottom 6 forward.

Not true. Miller spent a good deal of time on the bottom six his first two full seasons with us and put up similar offensive numbers to what Vesey has these past two seasons.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I think argument against that is that it's not hard to get young cost controlled players if you don't care that they're terrible.

I think that argument buys into the hype surrounding Vesey coming out of college. I don't think he's terrible as cheap bottom 6 player. You want to call him a disappointment? Fine. Terrible is too strong of a word.

 

[Don Chytil]

The Rangers are less than a month away from a one of the more pivotal moments in the franchise's history

I enjoyed the Winter Classic win too, but let's not get carried away here

 

[haveandare]

I think that argument buys into the hype surrounding Vesey coming out of college. I don't think he's terrible as cheap bottom 6 player. You want to call him a disappointment? Fine. Terrible is too strong of a word.

Depends what you value I guess, to me, Silverfish's post makes it pretty clear that he's not good.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Not true. Miller spent a good deal of time on the bottom six his first two full seasons with us and put up similar offensive numbers to what Vesey has these past two seasons.

Miller put up better point totals and was a much better possession player. SF showed how bad Vesey is, he's not even a botttom-6 forward, he's a borderline 4th liner.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Miller and Vesey are the same age. One of the two is a 50 point per season player, the other would do well this season to hit 30. One is all situations and big minutes with a lot of hockey talent, the other's talents in hockey include skating, scoring from close in and being physical. Pretty much everything else he's awful at for an NHL'er.

Miller and Vesey are not comparable. The team should consider having neither on the team next season, but these are not the same consideration, at all.

 

[nevesis]

What a f***ing joke.

 

[Avery16]

What a ****ing joke.

That is f***ed

 

[Avery16]

Miller and Vesey are the same age. One of the two is a 50 point per season player, the other would do well this season to hit 30. One is all situations and big minutes with a lot of hockey talent, the other's talents in hockey include skating, scoring from close in and being physical. Pretty much everything else he's awful at for an NHL'er.

Miller and Vesey are not comparable. The team should consider having neither on the team next season, but these are not the same consideration, at all.

My post was to the limited extent of countering the argument that a better player would produce more than Vesey and not be on the bottom six. Miller is a better player and produced similarly from the bottom six to what Vesey has his first two seasons. Miller and Vesey may be the same age, but many here complained just as much that Miller was taking too long to develop, which is ridiculous. Also, Miller went pro at an earlier age than Vesey. The development isn't going to line up perfectly.

 

[silverfish]

What a ****ing joke.

No this can't be right. McLeod is just here to be a veteran leader and a body for the sell, not to actually play.

 

[DanielBrassard]

No this can't be right. McLeod is just here to be a veteran leader and a body for the sell, not to actually play.

He helps the tank

 

[Trxjw]

If the team is about to head down shit show avenue, I have no problem with Lettieri in Hartford playing big minutes.

 

[RGY]

Lettieri has a good future ahead of him. But he hasnt been doing much and has had reduced minutes by AV. Might as well have him go to Hartford for 1st line minutes and let McLeod take the garbage minutes.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

eh we all knew this would happen so not shocking

Lettieri will get more playing time in Hartford. McLeod helps the tank

 

[Kovalev27]

Literally everyone was in agreement days ago that Lettieri should be sent down. He’s been terrible in every metric. Has to work on his game.

Why is anyone upset over this?