RLR: Malkin could be No. 1 Pick

[Foppa_Rules]

Ovechkin was born in September of '85, Malkins was born in July of '86.

 

[Crosbyfan]

If Ovechkin was 12 months older than Malkin instead of 10.5 he would have been drafted last year. Where would he have gone and are the '04s and '03s comparable enough for this to mean anything?

 

[EroCaps]

If Ovechkin was 12 months older than Malkin instead of 10.5 he would have been drafted last year. Where would he have gone and are the '04s and '03s comparable enough for this to mean anything?

He would have gone first overall last year, and I don't think it does. Just MO.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

And even if you are correct Mothra, This is not a no spin zone. Almost everyone on here has an agenda of some sort when they drop a post here. Its pointless to argue over.

What bunk. Malkin #1 overall? Pure pork. That's all that need be said.

Right on cue...

 

[Alex Kovalev]

What does saying Sharkie is full of BS and EroCaps is out to lunch (almost daily) have to do with this thread?

The irony...

He was replying to what I said about Erocaps to set the record straight.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

He was replying to what I said about Erocaps to set the record straight.

Well that makes it ok then...

 

[Classic Devil]

He would have gone first overall last year, and I don't think it does. Just MO.

Didn't someone try to draft Ovechkin last round with their last pick, stating something about technicalities with age? He was very nearly (like, as in days) away from being legal in last years draft.

 

[Foppa_Rules]

Yes they did draft him. In the ninth round I believe. It was later disallowed but I have a picture of Ovechkin putting on the Panthers jersey. Can you imagine the humiliation? He smiling and everything, thinking he is drafted into the NHL, only to find out later that it doesn't count and he has to wait another year! How horrible....

 

[Foppa_Rules]

And he was born only two days late. Bad luck.

 

[MagnusJondus]

And he was born only two days late. Bad luck.

Thank God. An Ovechkin vs. Malkin thread without Foppa is like a sewer without stench. I thought we were going to have to send out a search party for you, buddy.

Whew!

 

[Foppa_Rules]

Thank God. An Ovechkin vs. Malkin thread without Foppa is like a sewer without stench. I thought we were going to have to send out a search party for you, buddy.

Whew!

Well I'm here. Malkin #1...the outrage...

 

[GoRyanMalone]

Well I'm here. Malkin #1...the outrage...

Malkin may go #1. The Caps traded for Jagr after all.

 

[stardog]

All I have to say is that objectivley speaking, there is no way that Malkin should be #1 in this draft. AO has the highest upside of anybody, and while the gap may be closing, or closer, there is still a significant gap between the two. And while the gap may be "closer than some think" that doesn't neccesarily mean that it is a close gap.

RLR has an agenda. They may have a good scouting eye, but they hardly carry themselves in a professional manner IMO. They seem to want to "buck the trend" so to speak, simply for the sake of doing so. This always leads me to put an asteriks by everything they say. In other words, while there may be truth, or validity to something they report, you must wonder how much of it is truth and how much is show.

There is no GM who would dare take malkin over AO IMO. None.
They may HINT that they would do so, but it would only be a show, for posturing affect.

As a Pens fan, I am happy that we are getting Malkin. Yet that doesn't change the fact that I would quite easily prefer AO in every single way.

There seems to be many excuses flying around as to why Malkin could be just as good of a choice as AO, and even some Pens fans saying that they prefer having Malkin because of his position (C). I honestly feel that if we had won the lottery, there wouldn't be this kind of talk going on.
There wouldnt be an argument from the Pens faithful as to why Malkin may be a better choice. There wouldn't be the blatant justification going on to the extent that it is now. There wouldnt be excuses as to why Malkin is a better fit for the Pens. And i think that they would easily challenge anyone who suggested the arguments that are being thrown out on message boards worldwide.
And you know what? If that did happen, the Pens fans would be right, because Malkin is not the player that AO is. He does not have the upside AO does.

It is getting to the point of silly to see such bias being thrown out.
And I am not speaking of those who are saying that Malkin is close to AO because there could be somewhat of an argument formulated for that theory which would make sense.
I am speaking of those who are saying that Malkin is the better fit. I am speaking of those who say that they would probably take Malkin anyways because of various reasons. Because if it were the other way around, I am certain that these same people would not sing the same tune.

Face it guys. Malkin isnt AO. Probably never will be.

All of this of course is my opinion because we do not know what the future holds. But I am just suggesting that if people want thier opinions to be taken seriously then perhaps you should check yourself, and leave your "homer" hat at the door.

I too, am a homer from time to time. But I also like to think I have an informed and objective opinion as well and can look at things for what they are.
And in this case, what things are is really quite easy to see: Malkin will NOT go #1, nor should he. Nor should he even be considered with any sincerity for that spot. It belongs to AO and it belongs to him for a very good reason.

 

[stardog]

If Washington really wants Malkin...trade down to Pittsburgh and pick up a 1st next year and maybe Whitney.

Yeah right (from Pittsburgh's perspective. They are rebuilding and why would they give up a solid chance at Crosby, + Whitney, + Malkin? It makes zero sense for a rebuilding franchise to give up three critical parts of that future process for one critical part.
Zero sense.

 

[stardog]

Exactly. This is the usual bonehead RedLine disturbance in hopes to get some attention.

My point about RLR exactly. They are quite transparant to anyone with an ounce of intelligence.

 

[Doomsday Device]

Yes they did draft him. In the ninth round I believe. It was later disallowed but I have a picture of Ovechkin putting on the Panthers jersey. Can you imagine the humiliation? He smiling and everything, thinking he is drafted into the NHL, only to find out later that it doesn't count and he has to wait another year! How horrible....

Why would he have even attended the draft? Can you show us this picture?

 

[Jaded-Fan]

There seems to be many excuses flying around as to why Malkin could be just as good of a choice as AO, and even some Pens fans saying that they prefer having Malkin because of his position (C). I honestly feel that if we had won the lottery, there wouldn't be this kind of talk going on.
There wouldnt be an argument from the Pens faithful as to why Malkin may be a better choice. There wouldn't be the blatant justification going on to the extent that it is now. There wouldnt be excuses as to why Malkin is a better fit for the Pens. And i think that they would easily challenge anyone who suggested the arguments that are being thrown out on message boards worldwide.
And you know what? If that did happen, the Pens fans would be right, because Malkin is not the player that AO is. He does not have the upside AO does.

It is getting to the point of silly to see such bias being thrown out.
And I am not speaking of those who are saying that Malkin is close to AO because there could be somewhat of an argument formulated for that theory which would make sense.
I am speaking of those who are saying that Malkin is the better fit. I am speaking of those who say that they would probably take Malkin anyways because of various reasons. Because if it were the other way around, I am certain that these same people would not sing the same tune.

I am guessing at least part of that was aimed my way as I was the one who said that all things being equal, or even close to it, I would rather have a play making center just as I would have rather had Dan Marino in football over Jerry Rice, one who's skills are more oriented toward distributing than finishing always have more impact in my opinion. The analogy is loose as in hockey a wing distributes (passes as well) but with that caveat it holds up I think.

We can agree to disagree on the rest, I for one never said that I would take Malkin over AO, nor did I say that Malkin had caught him, what I did say is that more and more sources seem to be agreeing that AO has come along about average for what was expected, Malkin has really grown however and the gap where it was large at the start of the year has closed significantly to where Malkin is seen as a better than average top prospect too . . . ie, almost any other year he would likely be the first player taken and some scouts think that his potential is close to what AO's is . . .

I am not making those quotes up, nor are the Pittsburgh papers, nor is redline (though you imply as much, saying that they have an agenda, but I have seen it come up too often elsewhere to be as you say, just them with an agenda saying it. If they had been the only source, then that idea might have more credibility). So sure, as a Pen's fan I am glad to be seeing such things said, and the fact that more and more are saying it is even better. It is not pen's rose colored glasses though, we all have been reading it, to the point that those who were most vocal about how ridiculous it was, including you, have backpeddled of late . . . now even your tone and words have changed where say above that the gap has closed (only dispute is to what degree now) where before you hardly had that attitude . . . The strongest AO supporters as well have been a bit less vocal about it of late, which shows me that the basic concept, that Malkin has closed the gap to the point of being a 1(b) say instead of a 2 has sunk in. But I freely admit it is only 1(b) and that I would take AO over Malkin if given the opportunity. Never said anything different.

 

[EroCaps]

I am guessing at least part of that was aimed my way as I was the one who said that all things being equal, or even close to it, I would rather have a play making center just as I would have rather had Dan Marino in football over Jerry Rice, one who's skills are more oriented toward distributing than finishing always have more impact in my opinion. The analogy is loose as in hockey a wing distributes (passes as well) but with that caveat it holds up I think.

We can agree to disagree on the rest, I for one never said that I would take Malkin over AO, nor did I say that Malkin had caught him, what I did say is that more and more sources seem to be agreeing that AO has come along about average for what was expected, Malkin has really grown however and the gap where it was large at the start of the year has closed significantly to where Malkin is seen as a better than average top prospect too . . . ie, almost any other year he would likely be the first player taken and some scouts think that his potential is close to what AO's is . . .

I am not making those quotes up, nor are the Pittsburgh papers, nor is redline (though you imply as much, saying that they have an agenda, but I have seen it come up too often elsewhere to be as you say, just them with an agenda saying it. If they had been the only source, then that idea might have more credibility). So sure, as a Pen's fan I am glad to be seeing such things said, and the fact that more and more are saying it is even better. It is not pen's rose colored glasses though, we all have been reading it, to the point that those who were most vocal about how ridiculous it was, including you, have backpeddled of late . . . now even your tone and words have changed where say above that the gap has closed (only dispute is to what degree now) where before you hardly had that attitude . . . The strongest AO supporters as well have been a bit less vocal about it of late, which shows me that the basic concept, that Malkin has closed the gap to the point of being a 1(b) say instead of a 2 has sunk in. But I freely admit it is only 1(b) and that I would take AO over Malkin if given the opportunity. Never said anything different.

A little less vocal=people not being obsessive.

 

[LetsGOJackets!!]

I'm still pissed off neither of the two will get the chance

to play with Nash & Z. Now that would have been impressive!!!

 

[Jaded-Fan]

A little less vocal=people not being obsessive.

. . . ahhh, ok, that's your story and you are sticking to it . . .

 

[Alex Kovalev]

Ryan Whitney or our 1st next year will not be moved, there is no way. With the way Whitney is playing in the AHL playoffs (lead the pens in scoring last series), and like stardog said, our 1st is most likely lottery bound, so that our chance at Crosby.

Whats the point of trading Malkin and a chance at Crosby - probably end up Brule, Latendesse or Anikeenko for Ovechkin.

To me its just not worth it and doesnt make much sense from a Pens point of view.

 

[Mothra]

The analogy is loose as in hockey a wing distributes (passes as well) but with that caveat it holds up I think.

no...the analogy is ridiculous

what I did say is that more and more sources seem to be agreeing that AO has come along about average for what was expected, Malkin has really grown however and the gap where it was large at the start of the year has closed significantly

I dont see this "more and more"......I freely admit not following it closely as many...but what I have seen is the same 3 to 4 reports re-hashed....you have made it seem like its a large portion of the scouting ranks....not a majority...but a large portion

The strongest AO supporters as well have been a bit less vocal about it of late,

Maybe the fact that you and some others ridicule the AO supports has something to do with that.....you even said something to me...saying that all my posts were AO is God posts or something along those lines......when challenged to support that statement you flat out ignored it....fact is...you made that stuff up....just because I questioned some things of yours....you all of a sudden group me with posters I have nothing in common with.......now after blasting this group of posters (and lumping others with them unfairly) you have the nerve to say they are "less vocal"....*sigh*

 

[RoyIsALegend*]

Why would he have even attended the draft? Can you show us this picture?

Foppa_Rules is lieing, that's why.

When the Panthers selected him, the draft was well off of television by that round and Alexander Ovechkin was NOT present at last year's draft.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Maybe the fact that you and some others ridicule the AO supports has something to do with that.....you even said something to me...saying that all my posts were AO is God posts or something along those lines......when challenged to support that statement you flat out ignored it....fact is...you made that stuff up....just because I questioned some things of yours....you all of a sudden group me with posters I have nothing in common with.......now after blasting this group of posters (and lumping others with them unfairly) you have the nerve to say they are "less vocal"....*sigh*

we can agree to disagree on the first two points, reasonable minds can differ and have differing opinions and I do not think that either of us will convince the other.

The third point quoted above I can disagree with outright though, there have been two camps, with various degrees on both sides of course, but two camps, one basically thinking that Malkin is coming on the other that believes no such thing, but most in both sides have rolled eyes at the other at some point over the past couple of months, and my saying that a certain segment worships AO and rushes in anytime there is a suggestion that anyone could actually hold his jock even is not any news on the boards, nor is it really attack, even if I disagree with them, it is fans of AO or the Caps being rightly excited about having him. These thoughts are no recent thing, those comments have been going back and forth from the time of the lottery and before and none seem to have had thin skin about them, nor has anyone that I remember gotten out of line or could be accused of more than being a strong homer, and that goes for the Malkin is coming on sorts and AO is god sorts, I can not recall anything said that I would take insult with or feel ashamed of by anyone.

 

[Mothra]

we can agree to disagree on the first two points, reasonable minds can differ and have differing opinions and I do not think that either of us will convince the other.

well the second point of "more and more" is not as much opinion based as it is what I have seen....when asked to show all these new reports all I get is the same thing....the redline thing is something new however.....although it seems that several people here have issues with them as a whole....I have no idea about them so I cant comment...I guess the opinion part is how I take it when you say "more and more". To me that comes across as lots/many....and again...I dont see that...what I see is few...and in the scope of things, with the number of scouts/GMs there are inthe systems....very few

The third point quoted above I can disagree with outright though, there have been two camps, with various degrees on both sides of course, but two camps, one basically thinking that Malkin is coming on the other that believes no such thing, but most in both sides have rolled eyes at the other at some point over the past couple of months, and my saying that a certain segment worships AO and rushes in anytime there is a suggestion that anyone could actually hold his jock even is not any news on the boards, nor is it really attack, even if I disagree with them, it is fans of AO or the Caps being rightly excited about having him. These thoughts are no recent thing, those comments have been going back and forth from the time of the lottery and before and none seem to have had thin skin about them, nor has anyone that I remember gotten out of line or could be accused of more than being a strong homer, and that goes for the Malkin is coming on sorts and AO is god sorts, I can not recall anything said that I would take insult with or feel ashamed of by anyone.

You can disagree and thats fine of course.....but I will point out how you said I was some AO is god poster, with no basis of that at all....none.....all that was happening was I didnt take your side....so it seems to me that you are just labeling people that dont agree outright with you....this has nothing to do with "both camps"...or "rolling eyes"....I'm not in a camp...I wouldnt know AO or EM if they were sitting next to me...and have said as much......and what you are clearly missing in my third point wasnt that two sides disagree.....its that you said the AO camp must be coming around becasue they are "less vocal"...my third point was asking if that might have something to do with you and others blasting the AO supporters....and even labeling others that way when they are clearly not...just becasue they are not in "your camp"

I'm pretty sure you will attempt to deflect all of this....completely ignoring it.....or bring up in some smartass not too clever way how I should have thicker skin....when in fact maybe you should just read more.....understand that there are more than two "camps".....and understand that just because someone doesnt agree with you they arent in that "other" camp....