Retool or Rebuild if JT leaves and what would you do?

[Richie Daggers Crime]

That world could be a lot worse.

Could it? Seems like a world of perpetual misery and picking in the 10-12 spot in the draft. 33 year old 40 point Stastny as your 2nd line center.

 

[Doshell Propivo]

I know where you're coming from, but these players are commodities and it's a business..this isn't the same as having a job in Goldman Sachs where they pick the brightest, invest in training them and let them fight their way to the top.

This is buy low, sell high. Lee will bring a better return than if we try to throw picks, prospects and Nelson at other teams. If we didn't need anyone, we wouldn't trade him, but he is currency and we need his currency now. He will not be worth as much as he is now...well..we might have +- 2 years to play with.

Absolutey stupid post.

 

[sabremike]

JT's departure means more $ to help the D and the bottom 6.

I believe you need better possession players in the bottom 6 regardless of JT resigning.

Unfortunately all the current bottom 6 guys and bottom pairing defensemen are signed to long term deals that are untradeable so yeah, team is pretty much screwed.

 

[Matt Watson]

Personally, I want JT to leave. I've been an Islander fan since they first laced them up in '72 and I have bled orange and blue ever since, but Tavares deserves better than this train wreck of a franchise. He's been a great soldier for us and has given his all but

a) he's not the right guy to lead this team based on his skill set and personality and

b) I would like to see him playing for a Cup on a team that can maximize and compliment his talents, not ask him to do things he is not capable of. That team is not the Isles.

As for Lou Lamoriello. Please no. Great hockey mind, one of the best ever, but also an aging, old-school NHL dinosaur who is not suited to developing a young team as the game continues to change and become faster and less physical.

Finally, I leave you with this thought: If you were a top-level UFA and the Isles were willing to spend the money (which they aren't), are the Islanders a franchise that would be anywhere in your top five, or even ten, desirable places to play? No need to answer, cause we all know what that answer is.

The future is not bright. In fact, I genuinely feel sorry for Barzal.

 

[SI]

Unfortunately all the current bottom 6 guys and bottom pairing defensemen are signed to long term deals that are untradeable so yeah, team is pretty much screwed.

Yeah, I disagree. There are ways to upgrade the bottom 6 via free agency.

With bringing up Ho-Sang and a strong 2 way C and PK like Filppula or Riley Nash that 3rd line is much better than it was last season.

 

[SI]

My point is -

If Tavares signs or walks away - They still need to upgrade D, G, and 3C.
Isles would have more cap room to address those areas.

Tavares resigning is preferred and I still believe he will, but incase he does not - you still have to build a competitive team for next season.
Stastny and Filppula to upgrade up the middle.
I'd try to build a deal around Nelson for Grubauer.
Ian Cole and Leo Komarov as free agent targets.

Lee - Stastny - Bailey
Beauvillier - Barzal - Eberle
Ladd -Filppula - Ho-Sang
Komarov - Cizikas - Clutterbuck
Wagner
Leddy - Boychuk
Cole - Pulock
Pelech - Mayfield/Davidson

Grubauer
Greiss

And if by the deadline this team is bottom of the league, then you can make some decisions on Lee and Eberle and maybe even Leddy.

 

[sabremike]

Yeah, I disagree. There are ways to upgrade the bottom 6 via free agency.

With bringing up Ho-Sang and a strong 2 way C and PK like Filppula or Riley Nash that 3rd line is much better than it was last season.

Again what are you going to do with all the bottom 6 guys currently under contract? That's where Garth really screwed this team.

 

[Matt Watson]

My point is -

If Tavares signs or walks away - They still need to upgrade D, G, and 3C.
Isles would have more cap room to address those areas.

Tavares resigning is preferred and I still believe he will, but incase he does not - you still have to build a competitive team for next season.
Stastny and Filppula to upgrade up the middle.
I'd try to build a deal around Nelson for Grubauer.
Ian Cole and Leo Komarov as free agent targets.

Lee - Stastny - Bailey
Beauvillier - Barzal - Eberle
Ladd -Filppula - Ho-Sang
Komarov - Cizikas - Clutterbuck
Wagner
Leddy - Boychuk
Cole - Pulock
Pelech - Mayfield/Davidson

Grubauer
Greiss

And if by the deadline this team is bottom of the league, then you can make some decisions on Lee and Eberle and maybe even Leddy.

Thoughtful analysis and no disrespect intended at all, but that is, at best, a 90-95 pt and 1st round exit team without much of a future beyond that. In short, it gets us nowhere closer to where we want to be. Painful as it is, this team needs to start over. Completely. And with someone who knows WTF they're doing in the front office and behind the bench.

 

[denis5]

Unfortunately all the current bottom 6 guys and bottom pairing defensemen are signed to long term deals that are untradeable so yeah, team is pretty much screwed.

Not completely true. Yes for Clutter and Ladd, but Casey is a useful enough player with three years of term; that's a movable commodity if that's what the Islanders wanted to do. That leaves three slots of near complete vacuum for the rest of the bottom six. As for Pelech and Mayfield, the term is long, but the dollars are short. Worse comes to worst, you could bury both contracts in the minors or buy them out and have it impact the cap very little. Bottom line, these are issues that a decent GM could work around.

 

[Instant]

My point is -

If Tavares signs or walks away - They still need to upgrade D, G, and 3C.
Isles would have more cap room to address those areas.

Tavares resigning is preferred and I still believe he will, but incase he does not - you still have to build a competitive team for next season.
Stastny and Filppula to upgrade up the middle.
I'd try to build a deal around Nelson for Grubauer.
Ian Cole and Leo Komarov as free agent targets.

Lee - Stastny - Bailey
Beauvillier - Barzal - Eberle
Ladd -Filppula - Ho-Sang
Komarov - Cizikas - Clutterbuck
Wagner
Leddy - Boychuk
Cole - Pulock
Pelech - Mayfield/Davidson

Grubauer
Greiss

And if by the deadline this team is bottom of the league, then you can make some decisions on Lee and Eberle and maybe even Leddy.

That roster isn't even close to being competitve. But let's do it, for the fun of it.

- There's no way getting Grubauer from the Caps won't cost us one of Lee or Eberle. We're in the same division and we'll have to overpay for him.
- I don't see Stastny coming to NYI if Winnipeg offers him a contract and they probably will.
- Bellows should be ready to play in the NHL this season, so you also need a spot for him. I'd also re-sign Johnston and have him in the line-up, he's like a better and cheaper version of Matt Martin.
- I'm not sure if we will have enough cap space left (after signing Stastny, Flippula, Komarov, Cole and Grubauer) to keep one of Lee/Eberle and also Beauvillier, Barzal and Pulock.

The only real upgrade I can see here is the goaltending, which is needed, but that's not a much better roster than we had this season.

 

[SI]

Again what are you going to do with all the bottom 6 guys currently under contract? That's where Garth really screwed this team.

What are you talking about - Ladd, Clutterbuck and Cizikas are the only Fowards under contract. You have Ho-Sang you can bring up and Johnston should be your 13th F- that leaves two spots to fill.

 

[sabremike]

Not completely true. Yes for Clutter and Ladd, but Casey is a useful enough player with three years of term; that's a movable commodity if that's what the Islanders wanted to do. That leaves three slots of near complete vacuum for the rest of the bottom six. As for Pelech and Mayfield, the term is long, but the dollars are short. Worse comes to worst, you could bury both contracts in the minors or buy them out and have it impact the cap very little. Bottom line, these are issues that a decent GM could work around.

Nobody is taking Casey's contract unless you retain a significant chunk of salary or give them an asset of value as a sweetner.

 

[SI]

That roster isn't even close to being competitve. But let's do it, for the fun of it.

- There's no way getting Grubauer from the Caps won't cost us one of Lee or Eberle. We're in the same division and we'll have to overpay for him.
- I don't see Stastny coming to NYI if Winnipeg offers him a contract and they probably will.
- Bellows should be ready to play in the NHL this season, so you also need a spot for him. I'd also re-sign Johnston and have him in the line-up, he's like a better and cheaper version of Matt Martin.
- I'm not sure if we will have enough cap space left (after signing Stastny, Flippula, Komarov, Cole and Grubauer) to keep one of Lee/Eberle and also Beauvillier, Barzal and Pulock.

The only real upgrade I can see here is the goaltending, which is needed, but that's not a much better roster than we had this season.

OK - Grubauer isn't going to cost Lee or Eberle. I do agree Grubauer will be tricky for the team to acquire with a division rival, but it is possible.

And Bellows is not ready for the NHL - needs some time in the AHL and could be first F up with injury, but they should not hand him a spot on the roster- let the kid come in and take someone's belt.

And that roster is better than you think- Filppula is a great PK guy, high possession player, and very good Defensive F (so is Komarov). Cole would be a good addition to this d corp and less risky than resigning de Haan.

Look the roster will never look as good without Tavares, but they should not completely sell off assets - they should try to retool the best they can and see how they fair.

If the roster is as you say - not competitive enough - then at the deadline you can sell UFAs like Lee and Eberle for the 2019 draft picks.

 

[SI]

Nobody is taking Casey's contract unless you retain a significant chunk of salary or give them an asset of value as a sweetner.

Completely disagree - there are a number of teams that would gladly take on Casey without sweeteners or salary retention.

But he is not available and he is useful to the Isles - they need Casey next season.

 

[denis5]

Nobody is taking Casey's contract unless you retain a significant chunk of salary or give them an asset of value as a sweetner.

I don't agree, but it doesn't matter as it doesn't change my point, which is that there is a LOT of room to improve the bottom six, and nothing slot/contract wise to prevent that from being done.

 

[steveat]

If the Jets sign Stastny, I would try to trade for Perreault...I think that kid can play. He'd be perfect as a third line centre and he can play top -6 wing as well.

 

[Instant]

OK - Grubauer isn't going to cost Lee or Eberle. I do agree Grubauer will be tricky for the team to acquire with a division rival, but it is possible.

And Bellows is not ready for the NHL - needs some time in the AHL and could be first F up with injury, but they should not hand him a spot on the roster- let the kid come in and earn it.

And that roster is better than you think- Filppula is a great PK guy, high possession player, and very good Defensive F (so is Komarov). Cole would be a good addition to this d corp and less risky than resigning de Haan.

Look the roster will never look as good without Tavares, but they should not completely sell off assets - they should try to retool the best they can and see how they fair.

If the roster is as you say - not competitive enough - then at the deadline you can sell UFAs like Lee and Eberle for the 2019 draft picks.

Do consider that at this point not re-signed Lee is a luxury, high scoring, one year rental. Grubauer will definitely cost us more than Nelson + picks, but I'm open to all sensible suggestions. Bellows should be ready for NHL. The league is getting younger and younger every year and we should keep up. Cooking players for years in the AHL gets us nowhere. I don't mean just throw him out there, but ease him into this and if he's ready for it, great. If not, then send him back and hope he will pull a Beauvillier. Cheap, quality wingers are exactly what this team needs.

And maybe that roster is worse than you think? Ever thought about that? I do know who Filppula is and the same with Cole, thank you. But we're talking about Tavares-less Isles here. No UFA will come here unless we seriously overpay them, which will harm our abilities to re-sign all of our young guys. Besides, my view on UFA is that they're a great addition to the team, but you can't build a succesful team on UFAs and you're halfway this road already. I'd rather take the road Winnipeg took. Look at the team they have now.

 

[sabremike]

I don't agree, but it doesn't matter as it doesn't change my point, which is that there is a LOT of room to improve the bottom six, and nothing slot/contract wise to prevent that from being done.

You can improve it, but the 3 bad contracts make it very tough which is why giving 3rd and 4th liners big contracts was one of Garth's biggest mistakes. In an ideal situation you could get several useful bottom guys but as pointed out 3 of the spots are already claimed.

 

[Skip To My Lou]

If the Jets sign Stastny, I would try to trade for Perreault...I think that kid can play. He'd be perfect as a third line centre and he can play top -6 wing as well.

Unless Stastny is willing to take a 2 year deal for a discount, I can't see him coming back to Winnipeg. The Jets have a ton of contracts that they need to focus on and they may not have the space to keep him.

 

[steveat]

well, I would not mind us signing him for 4 years. The guy is still good with excellent work ethic. Some players age gracefully and I think he is one of them. I don't think I would go as high as 5 years, but you never know...he may take a discount for a longer contract.

Then I'd still go for Perreault...I'd trade picks or prospects for him...I figure they need to prepare for cost control very soon and would welcome prospects and picks that wouldn't become a contract problem for a few years.

 

[seafoam]

Colorado is going to be looking at Stastny to come back and play behind MacKinnon.

Can't see him choosing NYI over Colorado.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Not completely true. Yes for Clutter and Ladd, but Casey is a useful enough player with three years of term; that's a movable commodity if that's what the Islanders wanted to do. That leaves three slots of near complete vacuum for the rest of the bottom six. As for Pelech and Mayfield, the term is long, but the dollars are short. Worse comes to worst, you could bury both contracts in the minors or buy them out and have it impact the cap very little. Bottom line, these are issues that a decent GM could work around.

IMO, the stumbling block with Cizikas is his contract. You'd have to find a team who really believed he could be their full time 3C, otherwise it'll be a tough sell to unload a guy making that much to be a team's 4C.

 

[Isles72]

ladd and boychuk will require protecting in the SEATTLE expansion draft ; think about that .

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Here we go with the Stastny talks. Misery begets misery. All the Isles would be doing is treading water, while being 6 inches under the surface. This team needs to retain Tavares and add appropriate pieces/coaching or else it's pretty much doom. You can't compete with the powerhouses in the conference with a cobbled together Filppula/Stastny/Komarov/Cole/Vrbata/Marooon whoever. This is the kind of thinking that people are f***ing grilling Snow for having.

 

[doublechili]

Here we go with the Stastny talks. Misery begets misery. All the Isles would be doing is treading water, while being 6 inches under the surface. This team needs to retain Tavares and add appropriate pieces/coaching or else it's pretty much doom. You can't compete with the powerhouses in the conference with a cobbled together Filppula/Stastny/Komarov/Cole/Vrbata/Marooon whoever. This is the kind of thinking that people are ****ing grilling Snow for having.

Yeah, I agree. Stastny right now is a nice player and a great pickup for a team like Winnipeg looking for a rental to help them win a Cup (just might work). But whoever signs him to his next contract, let's guess a 6 year term, is going to have a bad contract in the not too distant future. We can't do that anymore - we've already got a couple of millstones.

VGK committed to a philosophy that works in the league today, hired a coach to implement it, and picked up players to execute it. Cheap players, BTW. They avoided the temptation of picking up big names with bad contracts that didn't fit what they were trying to do. And all the experts think they're some kind of miracle. No, just some smart guys navigating in a sea of mediocrity.