Replacement players can't shake the stigma

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Beukeboom Fan

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alexmorrison said:
Your logic is flawed. Teams would be shooting themselves if they cut ticket prices by 50% AND expected players to come back.
If they cut ticket prices, they cut them for the year. Otherwise what do you tell season ticket holders "Well, we'll charge you $3,000 for your ticket but if player X comes back it goes up to $4,000 and if player Y comes back it's up to $4,500).
You can't set sliding ticket prices during a season.

That's a fine point, and something that I didn't consider. I would suggest that the teams could do some sort of "credit" for next year based. (Games for the first 2 months earn you "free" games next year based on 50% or something like that).
 

AlexGodynyuk

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Beukeboom Fan said:
That's a fine point, and something that I didn't consider. I would suggest that the teams could do some sort of "credit" for next year based. (Games for the first 2 months earn you "free" games next year based on 50% or something like that).
A plan like that would not work anywhere near as well though. Whether you're giving them future credit or not, the fan still has to fork over the big bucks up front to watch replacement players, with the hope (but not the guarantee) that when they get their credit next year, the big names will be back. As a consumer, a future credit is a nice bonus, but I'm much more concerned with the cost up front.
 

dakota

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The Messenger said:
By rich I am sure you are referring to the Billionaire Owners and not the Millionaire Players .... Right ??

everyone keeps talking as if these owners have been making their billions through their hockey teams.... when in fact the league has been losing money...

owners are billionaires in spite of their ownership of a hockey team in the NHL not because they own the hockey team...

each team is its own case study... but 19 out of 30 teams LOSE money... sure maybe some numbers are skewed.. but every business has to make money otherwise it goes belly up... the owners are trying to fix the industry and the first step to take is a new CBA.
 

CGG

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Beukeboom Fan said:
Can you imagine guys like Yashin, Holik, or Marchant not crossing the picket lines? I would bet that most any player with a valid contract would cross and play, at which point the hole thing comes apart from the PA perspective.

Beukeboom Fan said:
How many games do you think there would be before guys players start crossing the picket-lines? Look at Jagr. He'd be back in a New York minute. Hell, he left home to make $2.5M in Russia. How long do you think it'd take him to come back and play for his $11M paycheck?

I'm sorry, aren't players mindless kool-aid drinkin' sheep lemmings that are brainwashed into doing whatever Bob Goodenow tells them to do? I mean, obviously they're too stupid to think for themselves, otherwise they would have accepted a salary cap plus whatever else the owners tried to throw at them months ago, and they wouldn't have lost this season.

Which is it, players can think for themselves or they blindly follow Goodenow? To think they blindly follow Goodenow, but then will horribly disobey him and gladly leap across a picket line to collect their paycheques is a bit of a contradiction, no?
 

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FLYLine4LIFE said:
LoL he sees LITTLE Hazard in bringing in replacments. Hahahah. Good luck trying to sell out 1/2 of a building in the US...good luck trying to sell 3000 tickets to half the buildings in the US. Ticket prices are only going to drop what..10-20%? People are dreaming if they think they are going to be getting 50% ticket prices. Dreaming!
Of course this assumes all but 3000 season ticket holders leave. Reducing the price and having the season tickey holders who are A) corperate and probably don't care or B) want to hold their slot should be enough to hold the NHL over. It's alot easier with a $9million payroll
 
I think it's exactly this whole ticket price/replacement players vs returning players discussion that will decide which path the NHL chooses to follow.

The easiest solution ofcourse is to forget about impasse and go with replacements all year long. That's also the worst one from an entertainment standpoint. The prospect of being able to set fixed and reliable ticket prices might be interesting, but interest in third rate hockey will wane VERY, VERY fast.

The "selective" lockout option is also interesting. If you go with a lockout of any player making over the median salary (around 850k) then you end up with a ton of pluggers and role-players as the "stars" of your league. Not very attractive at all, but better than the 100% replacements route, and you do slip in a couple of decent young players that way. If you go with a lockout of everyone above the average salary (around 2 million I believe) then it gets much more interesting with better players being made available.

If you go with impasse and an imposed CBA, it's basically all or nothing, but potentially could be a gigantic win for the NHL, and leave the door open for a relatively normal season next year.

But I truly believe that this "how much can we charge and for how long" issue will decide which path is taken...
 

Epsilon

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dakota said:
everyone keeps talking as if these owners have been making their billions through their hockey teams.... when in fact the league has been losing money...

owners are billionaires in spite of their ownership of a hockey team in the NHL not because they own the hockey team...

each team is its own case study... but 19 out of 30 teams LOSE money... sure maybe some numbers are skewed.. but every business has to make money otherwise it goes belly up... the owners are trying to fix the industry and the first step to take is a new CBA.

Regardless, I can think of hundreds of things I would rather spend my hard-earned money on than to waste it on an inferior sporting product just to "stick it" to a bunch of people who couldn't care less about it. Anyone who spends money simply because they want to "get back" at the NHLPA either has big problems, or (for this board anyway) is some preppy kid with rich parents.
 

Seachd

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Epsilon said:
Regardless, I can think of hundreds of things I would rather spend my hard-earned money on than to waste it on an inferior sporting product just to "stick it" to a bunch of people who couldn't care less about it. Anyone who spends money simply because they want to "get back" at the NHLPA either has big problems, or (for this board anyway) is some preppy kid with rich parents.
Or they could be doing it realizing it's the best hope fans have in their part to get the NHL back to normal.
 

Drury_Sakic

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Its all about money...

If they come out.. and basicly GIVE away replacement player games tickets.. I am 100% on board..

But if they are asking even close to NHL player $..

Forget it..
 

djhn579

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Epsilon said:
Regardless, I can think of hundreds of things I would rather spend my hard-earned money on than to waste it on an inferior sporting product just to "stick it" to a bunch of people who couldn't care less about it. Anyone who spends money simply because they want to "get back" at the NHLPA either has big problems, or (for this board anyway) is some preppy kid with rich parents.

Some people may enjoy hockey no matter who is playing, and maybe the games will be just a bit more exciting since it would be played by people that can't afford to take nights off...

(I've lost a lot of respect for some players who have made a lot of money and publicly state that they don't care if the NHL starts up again...)
 

vanlady

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There is something that everyone is forgeting. Corporate sponsors are huge dollars and a major source of income for teams. I know of one corporate sponsor of a few NHL teams that will withdraw sponsorship just to keep labor peace with there own union. Will this also impact adbvertising dollars as well?

If NHL teams start losing huge corporate money, will they be able to afford to drop ticket prices for the average fan?
 

djhn579

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vanlady said:
There is something that everyone is forgeting. Corporate sponsors are huge dollars and a major source of income for teams. I know of one corporate sponsor of a few NHL teams that will withdraw sponsorship just to keep labor peace with there own union. Will this also impact adbvertising dollars as well?

If NHL teams start losing huge corporate money, will they be able to afford to drop ticket prices for the average fan?


And what if fans go to the games and watch more games on TV and ratings increase?

Ticket prices will need to come down at the start, and it probably doesn't matter if they lose as much money as they lost this year by not playing. They just need to get the fans to buy in and the NHLPA will be more interested in making a deal...
 

vanlady

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djhn579 said:
And what if fans go to the games and watch more games on TV and ratings increase?

Ticket prices will need to come down at the start, and it probably doesn't matter if they lose as much money as they lost this year by not playing. They just need to get the fans to buy in and the NHLPA will be more interested in making a deal...

You won't see games on TV. You forget the guys who run the cameras at games are unionized. The Canadian Labor congress is already talking amongst itself and have already determined that the PA picket line should be honored. So if concessions are unionized you won't have concessions either.

You also forget that when Safeway tried replacement workers in Alberta the CLC put the squeeze on them too. The reasoning is if it can happen to the PA it can happen to any union in Canada.
 

TonySCV

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Casual fans in non-traditional hockey markets (like LA) that go to games COULD CARE LESS who is in the sweater - as long as the game is exciting and competitive. The NHL can change the rules to make it more exciting - and the competitiveness will be there because lets face it - if it's AHL talent we're watching this fall, it'll ALL be AHL talent across 30 teams.

If they make the game more exciting, AND it's competitive, AND there's a reasonable level of parity, AND it costs $5-$20 a head to get in the door - who wouldn't go if the price is right?

The owners have had this ace in the hole for ages - and everyone can see it now - maybe the players will even notice now that they've pissed away a year of their livelihood.

- T
 

PecaFan

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vanlady said:
You won't see games on TV. You forget the guys who run the cameras at games are unionized. The Canadian Labor congress is already talking amongst itself and have already determined that the PA picket line should be honored. So if concessions are unionized you won't have concessions either.

Yeah right. Even when *CBC itself* went on strike some years back it didn't affect the broadcast.
 

GirardIsStupid

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X8oD said:
Infact, it hink people will pay, BECAUSE they are replacement players. Something about this country that just loves to stick it to rich people who want more "or else"

If that's true, why don't canadians stick it to the billionaire owners? Sheesh, I'm sick of this one-sided animosity towards the players. If any of you had the ability to play in the NHL, you would milk that cow for what its worth. If you think otherwise...not only would you not be jealous of the player salaries, but you would have to be the second coming of mother theresa or ghandi. Fans are potentially as hypocritical as the players and owners. Greed...its in us all.
 

jb**

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Top Shelf said:
To the key to whether or not people will come watch replacements is ticket prices. If the owners slash ticket prices - they will come.
Not if the product is inferior. Being in Philly, I highly doubt we will support a scab team imo.
 
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