Perezhogin

[gb701]

Just a point: everyone keeps mentioning the NHL. While I agree in general that the NHL needs to clean its act up, this incident did not occur in the NHL, and so it has basically nothing to do with them. If a player in the CHL or Europe hits his opponent with his stick, is that supposed to be some sort of wake up call to the NHL as well? Each of these leagues needs to deal with their own problems, but they also don't need to problems of the other leagues imposed upon them when they are a neutral party to the situation.

You are right...but given the relationship between the NHL/AHL/ECHL etc. as well as Junior Hockey, I think we have a tendency to lump North American Hockey in the same basket - certainly TSN did in the way they introduced the footage - this is "another black eye to the game of hockey". What is worse is that there is ready comparison to international and European hockey where for some bizarre reason the players just seem to be better able to control themselves (despite what may be worse stickwork - or maybe because of it if you believe some posters).

Anyway, I think that from top to bottom, the solution to this is to prevent players who choose to deliberately try to injure other players from playing the game again. There are lots of other players waiting to step up, and it would not take many out of the game at any level before everyone else would GROW UP.

 

[Habs Icing]

After watching it again, it seems 100% clear that Perezhogin knew what he was going to do. He seemed to pause a split second before driving his stick into Stafford's face.

I don't give a flying crap what else went on in the game. THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR WHAT PEREZHOGIN DID! NONE!

Challenge the guy to a fight, check him into the boards. Don't swing your stick at his face. Anyone who defends him is a joke.

Then by your own words you're a joke. If you're gonna condemn Perezhogin for having excellent hand-eye coordination, why are you not condemning Strafford. He swung his stick at his head also.

And the more I think of it, the more I agree with Vlad.

 

[QcS]

After reading the whole thread, i'll offer my opinion.

What Perezhogin did was awful. He should be suspended for a long time.

On the other hand, Stafford should also get a suspension for his attempt.. but since we know that in hockey, only the results are punished, then that would not happen.

Last point.. Some of you say you don't believe in "an eye for an eye". I agree.
But if we agree on that, then would you also punish the 3 guys who pummelled Perezhogin after the slash? It was 3 guys who jumped on him swinging. I would seriously look at that.

Hockey is unfortunately a sport where players police themselves. That's how they want it. This should also be a consideration IMO.

 

[Vinceee]

After reading the whole thread, i'll offer my opinion.

What Perezhogin did was awful. He should be suspended for a long time.

On the other hand, Stafford should also get a suspension for his attempt.. but since we know that in hockey, only the results are punished, then that would not happen.

Last point.. Some of you say you don't believe in "an eye for an eye". I agree.
But if we agree on that, then would you also punish the 3 guys who pummelled Perezhogin after the slash? It was 3 guys who jumped on him swinging. I would seriously look at that.

Hockey is unfortunately a sport where players police themselves. That's how they want it. This should also be a consideration IMO.

So right...

 

[Tuggy]

Just curious what all you people would have done in Perezhogin's situation..

A guy takes a swing at your head, barely misses by skimming the top of your helmet, you have about half a second to do something. What do you do?

And to all those people that say they would just skate away....I doubt you have ever played hockey before.

You need to look at more then just the end result, which was horrible. Perez will get suspended for the playoffs and possibily 20-the whole season next year.

 

[gb701]

Just curious what all you people would have done in Perezhogin's situation..

A guy takes a swing at your head, barely misses by skimming the top of your helmet, you have about half a second to do something. What do you do?

And to all those people that say they would just skate away....I doubt you have ever played hockey before.

You need to look at more then just the end result, which was horrible. Perez will get suspended for the playoffs and possibily 20-the whole season next year.

DROP YOUR STICK - then if you want to go after him, do so. Fighting is still just a major penalty in the AHL isn't it?

This is not complicated stuff, guys. You swing your stick with intent to kill or maim, you are outside of the game looking in. Isn't any different where I play now, or when I played where it mattered.

 

[Nielson81]

Stafford should get the same amount as Perez, he did the same thing just didn't connect, give them both 30 games.

 

[Tuggy]

DROP YOUR STICK - then if you want to go after him, do so. Fighting is still just a major penalty in the AHL isn't it?

This is not complicated stuff, guys. You swing your stick with intent to kill or maim, you are outside of the game looking in. Isn't any different where I play now, or when I played where it mattered.

You think he was trying to kill him? Come on, aren't you being a little overdramtic.

 

[canucksfan]

Stafford should get the same amount as Perez, he did the same thing just didn't connect, give them both 30 games.

Is attempted murder and murder the same thing? Definatley not. Stafford should get suspended but not nearly as much as Perezhogin.

 

[The Pucks]

"you must be in control of your stick at all times"

How many times have we heard that? About a million, obviously Perezhogin was in control. After watching the replay about 30 times, forward and back, slow and fast I am confident he did not swing for his head, but he did swing with great vigor at his turned back and sholder. That alone is worth a 25 plus game suspension. I doubt that he meant to hit him in the face, but he did, and therefor he must suffer the conciquences. 40 plus games, no doubt in my mind, if I was in charge he would get one year minimum. Stafford would get 15 games. He swung his stick, but it was in a much less forcefull maner, as the reply shows, and there was a hesitation as he swung where he may have suddenly realized what he was doing and went upwards to miss.

Now the very interesting part, the comparisons to what Bertuzzi did. Does anybody think for one minute that Todd wanted Moore to strike his head on the ice, to suffer a neck injury from it? Todd wanted Moore to stand like a man and face up to his actions, but Moore was skating for deal life as fast as he could to get away. Yes, Todd was premedated, but his actual action, the sucker punch from behind was far less severe than the stick swing that Perezhogin took. The similarity of both is that the actions caused severe injury, so as in the Bertuzzi case, Perezhogin must face the charges.

What lead up the the Moore incident was swept under the carpet by all who persecuted Todd, so why should what Stafford do be brought into it? ALot of people here should look into a mirror and see if they recognize themselves after what they have said. Hypocristy at its best!

Now my personal opinion, I agree with alot of what Vlad said, but most of you can't seem to understand where he is comming from, he readily addmits that Perezhogin deserves a severe punishment and was very wrong, but the crap that leads up to these incidents must be taken out of the game. Would Bert have went after Moore if he hadn't head hunted Naslund? Would Perezhogin swung at Stafford if Stafford hand not swung 1st? Obviously neither incident would have happened. Get the darn game cleaned up, call the crap, make the players suffer for their actions, both borderline, and the obvious suspendable crap.

Thats my rant, sorry for the spelling

 

[The Pucks]

Stafford should get the same amount as Perez, he did the same thing just didn't connect, give them both 30 games.

So the next time somebody throws a sucker punch they should get the same a Bertuzzi?

 

[gb701]

You think he was trying to kill him? Come on, aren't you being a little overdramtic.

I don't think he cared.

Swinging a hockey stick into a guy's face with that much force can kill.

 

[Finkle is Einhorn]

Question for any American posters: how much, if any, play is this incident getting in the US media? You would think that something like this, coming on the heels of the Bertuzzi thing, would be pretty big considering how mental things got a couple of months ago. However, as of right now, I have seen relatively little coverage in the Canadian media. Which gets me wondering, what was it about the Bertuzzi incident that caused it to have the momentum it did?

 

[Skiblitz]

I don't think he cared.

Swinging a hockey stick into a guy's face with that much force can kill.

Especially to the back of the head/neck as some people are so fond of pointing out...( they seem to mean it in the sense that it wasn't that bad, he was aimimg for the helmet....just an accident he turned his head and got hit in the face )

As for the comment to the effect that hockey players want to police themselves, etc...( Yeah, I agree that the way to do it is drop BOTH stick and gloves...and for the older ones who remember this:take off the helmet too if the other guy does not have one...And I know some will say Perez. was too small/young to fight..it's not the point here) well if you police yourself, you ought to be able to also take the following consequences = suspension, stigma attached to your reputation, sadly possible retaliation...

 

[Bill McNeal]

Thats my rant, sorry for the spelling

I agree with everything you and Vlad said. While Stafford swung and missed, Perezhogin hit. It may be unfair, but that's how it works. As someone said, attempted murder is not viewed as harshly as murder. I really feel no sympathy for either in the case, they were both majorly at fault.

 

[canucksfan]

Question for any American posters: how much, if any, play is this incident getting in the US media? You would think that something like this, coming on the heels of the Bertuzzi thing, would be pretty big considering how mental things got a couple of months ago. However, as of right now, I have seen relatively little coverage in the Canadian media. Which gets me wondering, what was it about the Bertuzzi incident that caused it to have the momentum it did?

Im not an American but I did see it on CNN. They took about 30 seconds to talk about it.

 

[Genghis Keon]

The last paragraph you finally get it right. And turning hockey into war with your lame "eye for an eye" crap isn't going to fix it.

Radical steps are needed - or like I said before, the politicians and police will take over. Anyone who thinks that this is going to be tolerated just plain is not paying attention.

I don't think Vlad is preaching an "Eye for an Eye philosophy." I think he's saying that an "eye for an eye" philosophy is the reality of the game, and because of this, the only way to completely get rid of actions like Perezhogin's is to get rid of the source of their actions. If players get penalties and/or suspensions for mugging other players (like what Stafford clearly did to Perezhogin), the players being mugged will have nothing to retaliate over. However, since referees aren't calling penalties when they occur (like Stafford's crosschecks on Perezhogin), actions like Perezhogin's are bound to occur. Perezhogin oviously should not have acted the way he did and his actions warrant an exceedingly long suspension; however, if the leagues wants to entirely rid the game of such acts, they have no recourse but to call penalties whenever rules are broken (like the mugging Perezhogin received from Stafford). If the leagues aren't going to enforce the rules through officiating, this "eye for an eye" philosophy that obviously rules the sport is never going to leave.

I think Vlad is, in essence, trying to weed the garden that is the NHL by going for the weeds' roots, which may make the garden ugly with bare spots for a while (slow games filled with penalties) but will get rid of the problem (obstruction and initiating offences); while most are just trying to chop the heads off the dandelions (penalizing only retaliations and suspending the Perezhogins and Bertuzzis for months/years/life, but otherwise doing nothing), which will make the garden look nice but have no affect on the problems within it--more dandelions are going to pop up.

If I'm reading Vlad right, he wants the exact same thing that you want.

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

The last paragraph you finally get it right. And turning hockey into war with your lame "eye for an eye" crap isn't going to fix it.

Nobody said it will fix anything. It's just the way it is.

 

[Steve L*]

The way I see it Stafford meant to swing at Perezhogins head and grazed him, Perezhogin turned round to swing back and got him in the face not realizing Stafford was on the ice.

Staffords intent was to slash a head.
Perezhogins intent was to slash a body.

Stafford deserves a longer supsension for the intent as he was looking at Perezhogin when he swung his stick.

If I was in Perezhogins skates I would have done exaclty the same thing. It doesnt make it right but if someone tries to injure an opponent and then gets injured themselves, I cannot feel sorry for them.

 

[punchy1]

Just curious what all you people would have done in Perezhogin's situation..

A guy takes a swing at your head, barely misses by skimming the top of your helmet, you have about half a second to do something. What do you do?

And to all those people that say they would just skate away....I doubt you have ever played hockey before.

You need to look at more then just the end result, which was horrible. Perez will get suspended for the playoffs and possibily 20-the whole season next year.

This is more riduclous nonsense reasoning in my opinion.

Yes, the MAJORITY of players in pro hockey actually WOULD skate away or drop the gloves and have at it, they WOULDN'T do something as daft stupid and scatfilled cowardly as swing a stick in an attempt to take another players head off.

If YOU were right then most pro games would have AT LEAST one incident where one player or another would swing for the fences on another players head.

If YOU were right then the announcers and THE REST of pro players and paid pundits WOULDN'T BE CONDEMING THIS RUBBISH.

Everyone involved with the sport on professional level would be saying that the heaping pile of scat Perez has shown his self to be as merely being a victim of a bigger problem and that he did the right thing since Stafford swung first and other such RUBBISH.

To those who want to use what happened after Perez the coward done what he done then please, stop it, the two things have nothing to do with what Perez did.

Should those who went after the coward be punished? You bet they should, that too were rubbish but, two wrongs don't make a right has been around forever BECAUSE IT IS TRUE.

Gordon Benette it is amazing how some people will say the daftest things to defend the actions of a coward simply because he is in their system.

Stafford deserves his too but that DOESN'T make what Perez done even REMOTELY right.

 

[DJ Spinoza]

Then by your own words you're a joke. If you're gonna condemn Perezhogin for having excellent hand-eye coordination, why are you not condemning Strafford. He swung his stick at his head also.

And where did I defend Stafford's action? What Stafford did was wrong too, but it doesn't mean he deserved to be hit.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I feel that no one deserves to have their face bashed with someone else's stick.

 

[Vinceee]

Is attempted murder and murder the same thing? Definatley not. Stafford should get suspended but not nearly as much as Perezhogin.

he is dead??? they both attempted to murder

 

[Mayhem]

This is more riduclous nonsense reasoning in my opinion.

Yes, the MAJORITY of players in pro hockey actually WOULD skate away or drop the gloves and have at it, they WOULDN'T do something as daft stupid and scatfilled cowardly as swing a stick in an attempt to take another players head off.

If YOU were right then most pro games would have AT LEAST one incident where one player or another would swing for the fences on another players head.

If YOU were right then the announcers and THE REST of pro players and paid pundits WOULDN'T BE CONDEMING THIS RUBBISH.

Everyone involved with the sport on professional level would be saying that the heaping pile of scat Perez has shown his self to be as merely being a victim of a bigger problem and that he did the right thing since Stafford swung first and other such RUBBISH.

To those who want to use what happened after Perez the coward done what he done then please, stop it, the two things have nothing to do with what Perez did.

Should those who went after the coward be punished? You bet they should, that too were rubbish but, two wrongs don't make a right has been around forever BECAUSE IT IS TRUE.

Gordon Benette it is amazing how some people will say the daftest things to defend the actions of a coward simply because he is in their system.

Stafford deserves his too but that DOESN'T make what Perez done even REMOTELY right.

Bravo my friend. It is absolutely ridicuous the lengths some posters will go to, to defend actions that are indefensible. I don't care what happened before or after the accident or if he intended to hit him in the head or not. Bottom line is took a BASEBALL SWING at another individual and has seriously injured him to the point that he was bleeding and convulsing on the ice. What about this is not penetrating?

 

[Thomas]

I think people are missing the point. No matter how long Perezhogin is suspended it will not fix the actual problem. One could ban him from ever playing in the AHL/NHL for his actions and use it as an example to the rest of the players, but that simply wouldnt work. Punishing players for injuring another doesnt stop the fact the other player is injured, the league has to get to the root of the problem. In the heat of the moment you dont care about consequences, your adrenaline is rushing and you stand up for yourself.

The slash was easily preventable if the ref did his job. Stafford kept going at Perezhogin, and eventually Perezhogin exploded because the ref wasnt doing anything about it. All the ref had to do was assign a penalty for the two hand slash across Perezhogins leg, or the crosscheck to the face, or the attempt to slash him across the face. But in today's NHL players are forced to stand up for themselves and thats why these incidents happen. Suspending the players doesnt help, the league needs to fix its reffing system and start calling penalties when they happen, whether its regular season, playoffs or 5th OT of game 7.

 

[coolio123]

The whole hockey world will be seeing this, and remember that kid convusling on the ice. Any game Perezhogin plays in the future, he will be remembered for this and have a reputation. I tend to believe any other games Perezhogin plays opposing players will be trying to take his head off. This kid might have just ruined a possible bright NHL career.