Post-Game Talk: Penguins 4, Panthers 3: Never a Dull Moment

[Pancakes]

Not gonna lie I think every goalie needs that belief and swagger to make it to the NHL in the first place. Some guys deflect if the guys had a bad night but he's honest, no problem there.

Oh no doubt. It's a different position mentally than forward or d by far. All the great goalies have that swagger. Look at Roy, Brodeur, Hasek, Price, even Flower to a degree. They have a swagger, a confidence.

You have to have that as a goalie to be great. It's such a volatile position where focus and belief are paramount.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Swagger is definitely a good trait to have. You don't want to see a guy outright question himself at his job.

You also don't want to be a total D-bag while doing it.

I don't see Murray in that latter case.

 

[Tweed]

I'm not as sold on Murray simply because of when he came up and what this team has done in front of him. He knows nothing but winning. I'm waiting for the lean years (meaning more than one) to give a good analysis to how great he is. It's too easy to to fall in love with what this team has done and judge a single player on the back of what was a stacked team that could make up for deficiencies. He doesn't know what losing is at the NHL level. He's never had the pressure of being the other guy opposite of this team.

I'll take the guy who doesn't know the word "lose", over a guy who can endure lean years... all day, every day.

Why would you want to f*** around with what if's, when you've got a sure thing? Murray wins, that's all I know, and that's all that matters.

 

[Tweed]

Delete. Double-post. Thanks new forum!

 

[Ugene Magic]

I'll take the guy who doesn't know the word "lose", over a guy who can endure lean years... all day, every day.

Why would you want to **** around with what if's, when you've got a sure thing? Murray wins, that's all I know, and that's all that matters.

The Penguins win. Murray can't score the goals, and he can only play like 1/8 of the ice. He can only control what he can do in that space. Murray has the potential to be around longer than anyone if he is truly as good as some think. Do you not care about those years?

Nothing is a guarantee they'll win another cup, but the seasons keep coming.

Losing isn't a word you want to know, but you will experience it. That's a guaranteed fact. Happens to everyone.

Doesn't seem like a "what if" but more like a "when."

 

[Tweed]

The Penguins win. Murray can't score the goals, and he can only play like 1/8 of the ice. He can only control what he can do in that space. Murray has the potential to be around longer than anyone if he is truly as good as some think. Do you not care about those years?

Nothing is a guarantee they'll win another cup, but the seasons keep coming.

Losing isn't a word you want to know, but you will experience it. That's a guaranteed fact. Happens to everyone.

Doesn't seem like a "what if" but more like a "when."

I don't really care about those years right now, and I'm perfectly comfortable declaring Murray "awesome". I just use my eyes to tell whether he's good or not. And that's coming from a huge Fleury fan.

The flip side of the coin is that if he sucks when the lean years are here... I can turn around and say to you "of course he sucks, the team in front of him sucks, any goalie would suck in this situation... let's wait and see what he's like behind a really good team."

And that's just dumb.

Lotsa people have gone undefeated. That's also a fact. And nobody in the peanut gallery sat around sayin' "Well, let's see how good they are when they lose... then we'll know for sure whether they're great or not."

 

[FinProspects]

Focus+execution are not yet where those should be, still we win. Tells quite much about the team..Reminds me of Chicago Blackhawks, how they had this aura around them during their golden years, they just simply won no matter what... we do the same now, but I think we are even better, and the team is built in more solid ground.

Also: Geno 8 games 3+7=10. That is just ridicilous given how he has played. Once he reaches the god-mode (please stay healthy) who knows whats gonna happen.. another Art?

 

[Tweed]

He doesn't know what losing is at the NHL level. He's never had the pressure of being the other guy opposite of this team.

Everybody knows Bobrovsky, Holtby, Lundqvist and Rinne are "awesome" goalies. And they are your "other guy opposite of this team". The Penguins have eviscerated them. What does putting Matt Murray in their shoes prove, even if he gets wrecked? Nothing. Do you think any less of Bobber, Holtby, Hank and Rinne... because we've stomped them, time and time again? I doubt'er.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I don't really care about those years right now, and I'm perfectly comfortable declaring Murray "awesome". I just use my eyes to tell whether he's good or not. And that's coming from a huge Fleury fan.

The flip side of the coin is that if he sucks when the lean years are here... I can turn around and say to you "of course he sucks, the team in front of him sucks, any goalie would suck in this situation... let's wait and see what he's like behind a really good team."

And that's just dumb.

Lotsa people have gone undefeated. That's also a fact. And nobody in the peanut gallery sat around sayin' "Well, let's see how good they are when they lose... then we'll know for sure whether they're great or not."

That's not it at all. They can have a down year as soon as this year, or the next. A injury, or who knows what else can happen to him or another player. He hasn't even played a full season. These years are the ones where we'll find out about, Murray.

You guys are talking like it's a given even after all this team has gone through the last 8 years.

It's worth talking about even if it's off the beaten path.

This place is la...gging for me. Your last post; Everything just seems to be a given around here even thought the 7/8 years before that shows anything can happen, this year?, next. It's all relative.

Those other goalies have wrecked our team and others have wrecked them. But when they are wrecked, it's usually the team in front of them. Sound familiar?

But they had those times to react too.

 

[Tweed]

That's not it at all. They can have a down year as soon as this year, or the next. A injury, or who knows what else can happen to him or another player. He hasn't even played a full season. These years are the ones where we'll find out about, Murray.

You guys are talking like it's a given even after all this team has gone through the last 8 years.

It's worth talking about even if it's off the beaten path.

This place is la...gging for me. Your last post; Everything just seems to be a given around here even thought the 7/8 years before that shows anything can happen, this year?, next. It's all relative.

I'm not sure what other people are talking about. I only keyed in on your comment about reserving judgment on Murray being a good goalie.

If you're one of these guys that doesn't want to (or can't) assess a player, until they've retired, then fine, that's your schtick, have fun bein' like that. I just think you should go ahead and enjoy him for what he is "right now" (which is "awesome")... and worry about the future when the future is the present, whatever that may or may not be.

 

[Gurglesons]

I really don't understand what the argument that is going on is about.

Matt Murray isn't Jim Carey.

Dude is legit and there is a reason the only other goaltender to do what he has in terms of cups is Dryden.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I really don't understand what the argument that is going on is about.

Matt Murray isn't Jim Carey.

Dude is legit and there is a reason the only other goaltender to do what he has in terms of cups is Dryden.

Unless I'm totally misreading him, UM seems to think you can't judge whether Murray is a good goalie until he plays on a lousy team and still plays well.

Or something?

I don't really understand his argument on the matter, but if I recall, he was also pretty heavily in the Fleury corner in those "Fleury versus Murray" discussions. So maybe this is just him continuing that fight.

 

[Gurglesons]

I mean, isn't seeing him come in and save our asses in both the Ottawa and Nashville series enough?

I would definitely entertain the argument that Matt Murray was the main catalyst in both our cup runs. That isn't to say anything about Fleury's performance last year, but he was good ol' Fleury once we started playing Ottawa and in half the Columbus and Washington series.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Unless I'm totally misreading him, UM seems to think you can't judge whether Murray is a good goalie until he plays on a lousy team and still plays well.

Or something?

I don't really understand his argument on the matter, but if I recall, he was also pretty heavily in the Fleury corner in those "Fleury versus Murray" discussions. So maybe this is just him continuing that fight.

I was in the middle ground, having both.

Now Fleury is gone, and Murray has full riens. He's never held them for full seasons, nor has he had to go through tribulations. He's only known this team as they were constructed right before Fleury went down. Team at first juggernaut to what they are today.

It seems everyone thinks it's going to stay that way.

 

[Gurglesons]

I was in the middle ground, having both.

Now Fleury is gone, and Murray has full riens. He's never held them for full seasons, nor has he had to go through tribulations. He's only known this team as they were constructed right before Fleury went down. Team at first juggernaut to what they are today.

It seems everyone thinks it's going to stay that way.

Murray was a huge catalyst in making the 2015-16 team a juggernaut, what with not letting in more than 2 goals in like 10-11 straight games if I remember correctly.

You're severely underrating his contributions to both cup runs. There is a reason he was in the Smythe talk in 15-16.

 

[deakka]

Murray just wins . The stats isnt there at the moment for him, but he still hasnt lost in regulation this season.

And i rather have a goalie that does enough to win than a 93%+ goalie that finds ways to lose.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Murray was a huge catalyst in making the 2015-16 team a juggernaut, what with not letting in more than 2 goals in like 10-11 straight games if I remember correctly.

You're severely underrating his contributions to both cup runs. There is a reason he was in the Smythe talk in 15-16.

And they were that way before he ever stepped in the net.

You are severely underrating them as a team before he took over for Fleury.

Bold never happen. But from the end of the Cap series into Tampa series he was starting to leak 3+ and resulted in Fleury being put in. Now not all of this is on the goalies. The Pens played some bad games in front of them as well.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Murray just wins . The stats isnt there at the moment for him, but he still hasnt lost in regulation this season.

And i rather have a goalie that does enough to win than a 93%+ goalie that finds ways to lose.

The fact the Pens are one of if not the highest scoring teams has no bearings on anything?

 

[PensPlz]

I mean, isn't seeing him come in and save our asses in both the Ottawa and Nashville series enough?

I would definitely entertain the argument that Matt Murray was the main catalyst in both our cup runs. That isn't to say anything about Fleury's performance last year, but he was good ol' Fleury once we started playing Ottawa and in half the Columbus and Washington series.

Gold fish memories.

The entire team didn't show up to play those first 6 minutes in Game 3 in Columbus, but after that, he completely shut the door making 42 saves on 47 shots. CBJ wasn't going to be swept and really going to blame Fleury for not sweeping them? And then Game 5 he made 49 saves on 51 shots. And in Washington... yeah. Game 3 that Oshie OT goal never crossed. That was some bullshit, Game 4 was a complete team collapse in the third and game 6 we only put up 18 shots on Holtby. And then we go on and scored only 2 goals in the first 2 Ottawa games and somehow manged to win one of them, almost both... thanks to Fleury. But yeah, "good ol' Fleury" indeed.

The hole "Matt Fleury" shtick needs to end. This team defensive breakdowns in front of their own net and lazy starts to games is a problem that transcends who is in net. You guys used to just blame it on Fleury's goaltending and gave your favorite skaters pass after pass, but now it's still happening at the start of this year... and you're still blaming Fleury's goaltending? Boy...

 

[deakka]

The fact the Pens are one of if not the highest scoring teams has no bearings on anything?

Sure does. Probably means life is harder on the goalie with pens run and Gun style.

Or do you think the pens are carrying Murray?

 

[Gurglesons]

I think Fleury's legacy from 2010 - 15 speaks for itself.

I'm glad he had the heart warming Game 7 shut out in Washington and all.

Murray came in and won us the cup though.

 

[heysmilinstrange]

To go back to the previous discussion about Murray's personality, I don't think that giving honest assessments of how the team played means that a goalie is arrogant. It's not like he's Lundqvist out there glaring at his defense.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I do hope Murray starts to play better and his numbers reflect it, wins are great, but Murray needs to take a hold of the #1 job and be the cream of the crop in this league, he has the pedigree. Especially since Niemi is hot garbage and Jarry is working on righting his ship too.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I mean, isn't seeing him come in and save our asses in both the Ottawa and Nashville series enough?

I would definitely entertain the argument that Matt Murray was the main catalyst in both our cup runs. That isn't to say anything about Fleury's performance last year, but he was good ol' Fleury once we started playing Ottawa and in half the Columbus and Washington series.

To be fair, Fleury was playing much less than he was ever used to in the last 12yrs or so and wasn't exactly playing his best either, for him to come in and do what he did, while not playing as much as he is used to, to get into a groove...it's unfair to say he was wavering in the Sens series or the Caps series.

In Murray's case, he'll be fine. He has his goalie coach, the Pens need to play better team defense which is painfully obvious to everyone including the team and Murray himself, needs to be better as well.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

One can be afforded that playing behind this team the last couple seasons.

I'm not as sold on Murray simply because of when he came up and what this team has done in front of him. He knows nothing but winning. I'm waiting for the lean years (meaning more than one) to give a good analysis to how great he is. It's too easy to to fall in love with what this team has done and judge a single player on the back of what was a stacked team that could make up for deficiencies. He doesn't know what losing is at the NHL level. He's never had the pressure of being the other guy opposite of this team.

There is a difference.

This is one of the most illogical posts I've ever read on here.

Someone better tell Dryden and Roy their HOF careers don't count because they came into the league with great teams and enjoyed that luxury throughout most of their careers.