PC Building Guide and Discussion #11 (everything is expensive...)

[expatriatedtexan]

This really isn't an ideal comparison, but given that we're still waiting on R5, it's all that's really available - so, simply for interest's sake:

https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-4-core-benchmarks-intel-core-i7-7700k/

Interesting read, thanks for posting it. I'm rather pleased with the way Ryzen seems to be shaking out. It looks to be pretty close to Skylake i5 but as you said, not the best way to make the comparison. I'll be interested to read more and see what kind of itx solutions are around from mobo companies this summerish when I get around to building a new rig.

 

[Kestrel]

Interesting read, thanks for posting it. I'm rather pleased with the way Ryzen seems to be shaking out. It looks to be pretty close to Skylake i5 but as you said, not the best way to make the comparison. I'll be interested to read more and see what kind of itx solutions are around from mobo companies this summerish when I get around to building a new rig.

My sister is going to be upgrading a computer in the next few months. The best situation is to probably set her up with an R5 or R3 (assuming Ryzen continues to shake out well, and some of the current issues get smoothed over as expected)... but I'm really really fighting the urge to go for an R7 myself, and let her have my i7 6700K...

I don't do a lot of gaming, but an R7 should still be a more than capable gamer - but I do a fair bit of video conversion, the computer is a 24/7 media server, and I've debated running a game server on it too - those extra cores are becoming very tempting.

 

[Firestorm]

Unfortunately the answer is maybe
Really need to see the PSU sticker, looks kinda like this:

The specs on that sticker will tell the tale, 460W is not enough info.

I opened it up but I couldn't find it on the outside of the battery case, it must be on the inside.

I found this on the Dell website:
ftp://ftp.dell.com/manuals/all-prod...op/xps-8910-desktop_reference guide_en-us.pdf

Scroll down to page 19, it's either the AFPC one or the Bronze (as they are both 460w).

 

[SniperHF]

I opened it up but I couldn't find it on the outside of the battery case, it must be on the inside.

I found this on the Dell website:
ftp://ftp.dell.com/manuals/all-prod...op/xps-8910-desktop_reference guide_en-us.pdf

Scroll down to page 19, it's either the AFPC one or the Bronze (as they are both 460w).

The short answer is, provided the unit hasn't degraded, it will run a 1060 but I wouldn't test a 1070 on it.

It could probably run a 1070 too but that would be getting close to capacity at high load levels and I wouldn't want a cheap PSU running that hard.


Long answer:

MSI is the reference I use for requirements of video cards:
https://forum-en.msi.com/faq/article/power-requirements-for-graphics-cards Mostly cause they have a handy chart.


Both of the 460W units in that PDF have 3 12 volt power rails and have 18 amps, 16 amps, and 8 amps. A 1060 requires 20 amps per MSI. Since you have a total of 42 Amps you should be good to go.


The other thing you will want to check for is what type of PCIe connectors your PSU has vs what kind your card requires.
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/attachments/pcie6-2-jpg.57637/

1060's either use a single 6 pin, or less commonly a single 8 pin. You almost certainly have a 6 pin, but if you have an 8 pin you can get any type of 1060 you want.

There are adapters but I wouldn't do it.

 

[Diamondillium]

So with tax return windfalls coming in, I'm looking at replacing my aging laptop and figured I'd come here for advice.

I'm mostly looking for something in the 1300-1500 CAD range. Aesthetics are pretty important to me on this one as my last one was a bulky 'gaming laptop' style that was simply embarrasing and inconvenient to bring around anywhere. This time around I'm looking for a thinner, clean, look that I can use in public if I want. Touchscreen and battery aren't too important to me, but wouldn't hurt I suppose. 15" or 17" would work, as long as the 17" isn't too bulky.

I see something like this being a pretty good option with pretty decent specs all around. A bit low on total storage due to being exclusively SSD is the main drawback I see to it with my relatively untrained eye. https://www.amazon.ca/K501UW-AB78-1...e=UTF8&qid=1489506994&sr=1-79&keywords=Gaming.

Figured I'd at least pop in to see if there may be a better option in a similar range.

 

[Individual 1]

I'm mostly looking for something in the 1300-1500 CAD range. Aesthetics are pretty important to me on this one as my last one was a bulky 'gaming laptop' style that was simply embarrasing and inconvenient to bring around anywhere. This time around I'm looking for a thinner, clean, look that I can use in public if I want. Touchscreen and battery aren't too important to me, but wouldn't hurt I suppose. 15" or 17" would work, as long as the 17" isn't too bulky.

http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-ca/product...ready-retail-gp62mvr-6rf-242ca/10552437.aspx?

This says it has a Nvidia 1060 in the overview which is a big step up from the 960m, it has a SSD and a 1TB hard drive, 16gb of RAM, and the processor is also a step up.

 

[Diamondillium]

http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-ca/product...ready-retail-gp62mvr-6rf-242ca/10552437.aspx?

This says it has a Nvidia 1060 in the overview which is a big step up from the 960m, it has a SSD and a 1TB hard drive and 16gb of RAM, and the processor is also a step up.

Thanks for the suggestion, the specs and price on that seem excellent. I'd be on the fence with it aesthetically, however. Still seems like quite the 'bulky gaming laptop' look I'm trying to avoid, but it's not as bad as others. (It's definitely a weird thing to care about, I'm fully aware of that )

EDIT: I found this for the same price https://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834154409 but refurbished. It is pretty much perfect as it is the same specs but actually looks good, but I don't know if refurbished is a bad idea or not.

 

[Commander Clueless]

Refurbs are always a bit of a risk. Sometimes "refurbished" means "this was returned and we re-packaged it with the same problems hoping the next person won't care". On the other hand, I've had a lot of good experiences with Newegg refurbs specifically.



As for the MSI lappy, my girlfriend uses an older version of that laptop and loves it. They're a decent size without being overbearing, and personally I think they look pretty sleek. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, though.

I was looking at a new one with a 1060 in it for her. The old 900M series cards are underwhelming in my mind. For me, it's between the one you linked and this slightly more expensive one: http://www.ncix.com/detail/msi-dominator-gt62vr-6rd-202ca-16gb-0d-137085.htm

 

[Kestrel]

Ryzen 5 coming soon!

https://videocardz.com/67342/amd-ryzen-5-to-launch-on-april-11th

AMD is preparing four Ryzen 5 SKUs: 1600X, 1600, 1500X and 1400 for launch. The prices of mid-range Ryzen will vary from 249 USD to 169 USD. The 1600 series will feature 6 cores and 12 threads, while the 1500X and 1400 will be 4-core and 8-thread CPUs.

All Ryzen 5 processors are unlocked, which means you can overclock them if your motherboard supports it. Also, each Ryzen CPU features XFR (extended frequency range) technology which adds few MHz to official stated boost clock. Those rangers are higher for X-branded CPUs.

In official information for channel partners AMD revealed that Ryzen 5 are focused on 1080p gaming:

We’re thrilled to let you know we have an incredibly strong roadmap and our upcoming AMD Ryzen™ 5 processor will be focused on 1080p game play. The best is yet to come!

AMD Ryzen 5 CPUs will be available for sale on April 11th.

With how well the R7 1700 appears to overclock compared to the 1700x and 1800x, I really want to see if the R5 1400 overclocks easily to R5 1500x levels or beyond - the R5 1400 could be a new bargain gaming chip!

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

I currently have a GTX 970 and am still very much willing to upgrade this year. Should I go with the 1080 Ti, or do you think I would get more value out of waiting for possibly Vega (which could be cheaper than the 1080 Ti, but still have great performance) or wait for the HBM2 Nvidia cards (if they are coming out later this year)? What do you guys think?

I'm also really interested in the Asus PG27UQ for a G-sync monitor. Seriously, 4K, G-sync, 144Hz, HDR, etc.

I mean, I think may shell out the money for a 1080 Ti, but I'm thinking of waiting straight up for HBM2 cards though. I think Vega is supposed to be slower than the Ti, but at least around the 1080 (from what I've been reading).

 

[Kestrel]

I currently have a GTX 970 and am still very much willing to upgrade this year. Should I go with the 1080 Ti, or do you think I would get more value out of waiting for possibly Vega (which could be cheaper than the 1080 Ti, but still have great performance) or wait for the HBM2 Nvidia cards (if they are coming out later this year)? What do you guys think?

I'm also really interested in the Asus PG27UQ for a G-sync monitor. Seriously, 4K, G-sync, 144Hz, HDR, etc.

I mean, I think may shell out the money for a 1080 Ti, but I'm thinking of waiting straight up for HBM2 cards though. I think Vega is supposed to be slower than the Ti, but at least around the 1080 (from what I've been reading).

It all depends on your budget, how your current card is performing for you, and how much you're itching to do the upgrade. If you have the money and the itch, and savings aren't a big deal, do it now. Otherwise, waiting for those other cards may bring the price down. There will always be something new on the horizon though - you could wait indefinitely for the newest thing to change the market.

 

[Kestrel]

I didn't look high and low, but I'm seeing the i5-7600 coming in at $217 US in a couple of places. If the R5 1600 comes in at $219 as reported, that could make things interesting. The i5-7600 comes in clocked a bit higher, but the R5 1600 is an unlocked processor, and gets you 50 percent more cores. Could be a great processor for a gamer who also does some heavier chores and multitasking on his computer.

 

[Commander Clueless]

I currently have a GTX 970 and am still very much willing to upgrade this year. Should I go with the 1080 Ti, or do you think I would get more value out of waiting for possibly Vega (which could be cheaper than the 1080 Ti, but still have great performance) or wait for the HBM2 Nvidia cards (if they are coming out later this year)? What do you guys think?

I'm also really interested in the Asus PG27UQ for a G-sync monitor. Seriously, 4K, G-sync, 144Hz, HDR, etc.

I mean, I think may shell out the money for a 1080 Ti, but I'm thinking of waiting straight up for HBM2 cards though. I think Vega is supposed to be slower than the Ti, but at least around the 1080 (from what I've been reading).

If you're getting that monitor, I could see rocking a 1080 Ti.


Otherwise, the price reduction on the 1080 is highly appealing.

 

[Diamondillium]

Refurbs are always a bit of a risk. Sometimes "refurbished" means "this was returned and we re-packaged it with the same problems hoping the next person won't care". On the other hand, I've had a lot of good experiences with Newegg refurbs specifically.



As for the MSI lappy, my girlfriend uses an older version of that laptop and loves it. They're a decent size without being overbearing, and personally I think they look pretty sleek. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, though.

I was looking at a new one with a 1060 in it for her. The old 900M series cards are underwhelming in my mind. For me, it's between the one you linked and this slightly more expensive one: http://www.ncix.com/detail/msi-dominator-gt62vr-6rd-202ca-16gb-0d-137085.htm

Thanks for the thoughts! Reviews for it seem really good, I'm baffled that manufacturers can fit full-powered 1060s into such thin laptops now. Decided to take the risk and jump on the deal since I don't imagine I'll get one that nice at that price otherwise. Shelled out a bit for the newegg warranty just as a bit of risk aversion, even though normally I find warranties for things like these to be a waste.

Should be a huge upgrade on my current laptop (in both size and power, currently rocking a 10+ pounder with a 660M graphics card ), plus it doesn't look too out of place at an accounting firm if I ever have to bring it into work, which is nice.

 

[Commander Clueless]

Thanks for the thoughts! Reviews for it seem really good, I'm baffled that manufacturers can fit full-powered 1060s into such thin laptops now. Decided to take the risk and jump on the deal since I don't imagine I'll get one that nice at that price otherwise. Shelled out a bit for the newegg warranty just as a bit of risk aversion, even though normally I find warranties for things like these to be a waste.

Should be a huge upgrade on my current laptop (in both size and power, currently rocking a 10+ pounder with a 660M graphics card ), plus it doesn't look too out of place at an accounting firm if I ever have to bring it into work, which is nice.

Awesome, good luck!

I think I'm going for the other one. We could compare notes.

 

[Diamondillium]

Awesome, good luck!

I think I'm going for the other one. We could compare notes.

And ditto to your purchase! I do definitely envy the G-sync on your option. I've heard great things about that.

 

[Kestrel]

Home>CPUs AMD Announces Ryzen 5 Lineup: Hex-Core from $219, Available April 11th

http://www.anandtech.com/show/11202/amd-announces-ryzen-5-april-11th

Whereas Ryzen 7 was AMD’s main attack on high-performance x86 and a shot across the bow against Intel’s high-end desktop platform, Ryzen 5 is targeted more at mainstream users. The goal here is that where Intel has four cores with no hyperthreading, AMD can provide six cores with SMT, effectively offering three times as many threads for the same price and potentially smashing any multithreaded workload.

 

[karnige]

http://www.anandtech.com/show/11202/amd-announces-ryzen-5-april-11th

man that's so awesome. the word is for people who want 1080 gaming the 1500 at $189 does the trick. can't wait.

 

[Kestrel]

man that's so awesome. the word is for people who want 1080 gaming the 1500 at $189 does the trick. can't wait.

I'd even be tempted to grab the 1400, and overclock it... although the price difference between the two isn't really that high, and the cost of a good cooler will be higher than that, so the 1500x is probably the ideal one to go for.

I wonder how the r3 line will come out - I'm sure the r5 line is more ideal, but for the gamers really on a shoestring budget, the r3's could get them in the game when they otherwise might not be able to.

 

[Kestrel]

AMD is really tempting me to build a super home server

http://www.tweaktown.com/news/56757/amd-ryzen-cpu-16c-32t-coming-teased-999/index.html

AMD has shaken up the consumer CPU market with its new Ryzen processors, led by the Ryzen 7 1800X flagship CPU - offering 8C/16T @ 4GHz for $499. This disrupts Intel's market in a big way, because AMD is offering performance similar to, or better than the Core i7-6900K, a processor that costs $999.

The latest rumor is that AMD is ready to hit Intel in the HEDT market even harder, offering a new 16C/32T processor for the $1000 mark - beating out Intel's current flagship Core i7-6950X, which costs $1600+. AMD would reportedly unveil this new Ryzen CPU behemoth at Computex, in just two months time - while Intel launches its next-gen X399 chipset and new flagship Core i7 processor. The rumor is floating over from the ChipHell forums, picked up by Overclock3D.net.

 

[Kestrel]

And it appears to be confirmed that the Ryzen 3 and Ryzen 5 chips are actually the same silicon as the Ryzen 7 chips - the 6 core CPU's simply have 1 core in each of the two CCX's disabled, and the 4 core CPU's have 2 cores disabled in each CCX.

I'm very doubtful, but I'm hoping against hope that that potentially means the possible unlocking of cores - and who knows, maybe of SMT too. Imagine paying for an r3, and coming away with an 8 core monster

 

[Puck]

And it appears to be confirmed that the Ryzen 3 and Ryzen 5 chips are actually the same silicon as the Ryzen 7 chips - the 6 core CPU's simply have 1 core in each of the two CCX's disabled, and the 4 core CPU's have 2 cores disabled in each CCX.

I'm very doubtful, but I'm hoping against hope that that potentially means the possible unlocking of cores - and who knows, maybe of SMT too. Imagine paying for an r3, and coming away with an 8 core monster

So you are a processor core junkie? Not sure what the cure is for that

I am quite happy for AMD. Intel could use the competition, they didn't have anyone pushing them in the back until recently. Intel might not care so much about this segment of processors anymore, not sure. They missed the boat vs ARM for cell phones and tablets. The new growth area might be cars and the 'internet of things' appliances. The PC is not going away but it's not a high-growth segment anymore.

I won't be in the market for a PC until next year. My last AMD processor PC was a heater with loud cooling fans and I've gone Intel for the last 2. More cool and quiet. SO I will prolly stick with Intel this time around too (not 100% sure but 75% sure). I still wish AMD all the best though. Intel are slowpokes without a competitor. If AMD develops better motherboards (better performing parts) than Intel mobo suppliers though, that would make me switch.

 

[Kestrel]

So you are a processor core junkie? Not sure what the cure is for that

I am quite happy for AMD. Intel could use the competition, they didn't have anyone pushing them in the back until recently. Intel might not care so much about this segment of processors anymore, not sure. They missed the boat vs ARM for cell phones and tablets. The new growth area might be cars and the 'internet of things' appliances. The PC is not going away but it's not a high-growth segment anymore.

I won't be in the market for a PC until next year. My last AMD processor PC was a heater with loud cooling fans and I've gone Intel for the last 2. More cool and quiet. SO I will prolly stick with Intel this time around too (not 100% sure but 75% sure). I still wish AMD all the best though. Intel are slowpokes without a competitor. If AMD develops better motherboards (better performing parts) than Intel mobo suppliers though, that would make me switch.

AMD mobos are supposedly around 10% better priced right now - I haven't been pricing things out yet though, so I can't confirm.

Core junkie? I only got to do the unlocked core thing once, but it was definitely nice. My brother wanted me to put together a computer for him, so I got a tri core Athlon on the off chance he could get a cheap quad out of it, and it worked.

On the heat end - the new AMD processors have been reported to be hot, but apparently that has a lot to do with a 20 degree offset that current monitoring software hasn't been updated to account for.

I think AMD could be a good IoT option compared to Intel. Intel has some pretty cheap, low powered processors, and expensive high powered processors. AMD seems to be a lot better at doing cheap, but still reasonably powered processors.

But - we'll see what happens. I'm under no illusion that this does anything but just put AMD back in the game again. They're certainly not in the driver's seat.

 

[Bulls9220]

Have a question, thinking about buying my first PC or laptop to game on. Don't wanna completely break the bank and go thousands of dollars in just yet, but what would you guys reccomend to get started on?

 

[SniperHF]

Have a question, thinking about buying my first PC or laptop to game on. Don't wanna completely break the bank and go thousands of dollars in just yet, but what would you guys reccomend to get started on?

Since you still haven't decided between a desktop and a laptop that's probably where I'd start.

Random things I'd consider:
1. Is portability important?

2. Is ultra portability important? Meaning extremely light weight, very long battery life, small screen size.

3. If not thousand(S) of dollars, how much? 1200? 1000? 800? Assuming you don't have a monitor I'd look at $800 being bottom dollar for something workable.

4. Are you interested in a PC for playing games your console doesn't have?, don't have a console? , replacing a console experience?(meaning connecting to TV, using a controller mostly, etc)

5. Do you have an expectations on performance? Example: I'm tired of my console being framerate locked. I want to play at 2k or 4k. Stuff like that.