OT: Has the TO Wolfpack proven anything about trans-Atlantic leagues functioning?
- Thread starter cutchemist42
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Killion
Registered User
- Feb 19, 2010
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I havent read anything negative so I assume so, that its been a success. Air Transat is a sponsor, bringing over teams who then stay & practice at York University, flying the Wolfpack to the UK for games. Deal being the Wolfpack covered the cost of the Brit teams travel. Had they not secured Transat as the sponsor I'm guessing they'd be running a lot of red ink. The Toronto Club is comprised of players from all over the planet, living at the 2015 Pan Am Games Athletes Village, practicing & playing their games at the 9600 seat Lamport Stadium which is just west of downtown. The Wolfpack from what Ive read kicking some serious butt in their Division.... The other "trans-Oceanic" Rugby League is the Super 14 with teams in Argentina, Aus/NZ, S.Africa & Japan, aiming for the US last I heard... So be it Rugby, the NFL or the NHL, where theres a will theres a way.
The CWHL is also now Trans-Pacific with two teams in China, four in Canada and one in the US.
I think the NFL is probably the best candidate amongst the major leagues given that they only play one game per week and only half of them at home. The players wouldn't even need to based in the UK.
I think the NFL is probably the best candidate amongst the major leagues given that they only play one game per week and only half of them at home. The players wouldn't even need to based in the UK.
Mightygoose
Registered User
The Wolfpack just earned promotion frok the 3rd to the 2nd tier over the weekend. Averaging about 7K a game which is better than many teams to in the first tier Super League. So yes, a sucess on and off the field.
Transat sponsoring the key pillar IMO.
They'll play 3 or 4 games in a row at home ane play about 3 to 4 games on the road with a 'home base' in the UK too. This minimizes travel time and cost too.
If the Wolfpack can pull this off in the thrid tier in Rugby League (being the secondary code) can pull this off, there's no reason why an NFL team in London can't work either logisticllay.
Transat sponsoring the key pillar IMO.
They'll play 3 or 4 games in a row at home ane play about 3 to 4 games on the road with a 'home base' in the UK too. This minimizes travel time and cost too.
If the Wolfpack can pull this off in the thrid tier in Rugby League (being the secondary code) can pull this off, there's no reason why an NFL team in London can't work either logisticllay.
Rugby works because there is no entry draft, we have players in all sports scared to move to Canada imagine telling them to move to London!.
I think a team in London is a disaster waiting to happen for the NFL, Sure they sell out 2 or 3 games a year but after a couple of years the interest will die down. NFL isn't ever going to beat out the premier league or even championship (2nd tier of soccer in England) in London once the novelty wears off that team will fold or have to be moved back to NA
I think a team in London is a disaster waiting to happen for the NFL, Sure they sell out 2 or 3 games a year but after a couple of years the interest will die down. NFL isn't ever going to beat out the premier league or even championship (2nd tier of soccer in England) in London once the novelty wears off that team will fold or have to be moved back to NA
alko
Registered User
If they invent some transport device (aeroplane, tube, teleport ...) that can transport you from London to New York in 3-4 hours, then there is a potential. Otherwise no.
Rocko604
Sports will break your heart.
Toronto has a home base in England, so their games in Toronto are like road games in a way. They also played home games 2-3 weeks in a row for the most part until, IIRC, the Super 8s started. So yes, it proves a trans-Atlantic league works when the league is based in the UK. Hope it means Vancouver could be considered for a Pro 14 club down the road.
Now, would it work when the team is in London and playing in a North American league? Wolfpack only have to travel as far West as Toronto. A London NFL team would be travelling to LA, Denver, Phoenix, Seattle etc.
Now, would it work when the team is in London and playing in a North American league? Wolfpack only have to travel as far West as Toronto. A London NFL team would be travelling to LA, Denver, Phoenix, Seattle etc.
saskriders
Can't Hold Leads
Just do a system like baseball used to do. You only play in your own "league" other than one big two week road trip to the other continent where you play some but not all of the other league's teams.
cutchemist42
Registered User
Bjorn Le
Hobocop
I think it proves its not an infeasible business model. The Wolfpack didn't need on field support to be a success (I'd say the majority of Torontorians have never heard of the team, and the only significant exposure they've got outside rugby supporters is coverage by Tim & Sid who seem to be fans). Air Transat was vital, but I doubt the Wolfpack even exist without an airline sponsor. Not to mention, it's not really a burden for the airline anyway.
Theoretically, it should be able to be scaled up to any leagues similar to the Wolfpack without major issues I get the emotional opposition to a London NFL team, but I don't get it business wise. NFL teams are massive money makers, and that's regardless of whether a team sells out or not. A London team opens itself up to over 500,000,000 people as a potential audience. Realistically, only the UK and Ireland (perhaps Germany/France as well) can be counted on to be legitimate markets, but that's still over 70 mil alone in the British isles. Your average NFL game was watched by 16.5 mil people in 2016 (a significant drop from 2015, but still huge). I don't imagine a London team would bet significantly less than that, and there's potential for it to be substantially more, if games are timed properly (London games at night, away games in the very early afternoon/late morning, and only play on Saturday/Sunday).
The owner of the Wolfpack has suggested that transatlantic teams are feasible for all North American and European sports leagues, but I don't agree yet. You can't transpose MLB, NHL, or NBA seasons across the ocean unless the market for those sports also crosses the ocean (none of these sports have flexible enough schedules to make sure cross-Atlantic games are still viewable at reasonable times). I don't think the flight times is as big an issue; by next year the XB-1 (a ~40-60 seat supersonic jet that flies faster than the Concorde) should begin it's first flight tests, and supersonic commercial aircraft should make a legitimate comeback by the end of the next decade. At ~3 hours from London/Paris to NYC, flight times are a non issue. It's just the game has to be global in scope, or you have to play such a limited number of games to make it work. I actually think European soccer has the best potential for a transatlantic team in a major sport, but the way the sport works in Europe makes it very unlikely.
Theoretically, it should be able to be scaled up to any leagues similar to the Wolfpack without major issues I get the emotional opposition to a London NFL team, but I don't get it business wise. NFL teams are massive money makers, and that's regardless of whether a team sells out or not. A London team opens itself up to over 500,000,000 people as a potential audience. Realistically, only the UK and Ireland (perhaps Germany/France as well) can be counted on to be legitimate markets, but that's still over 70 mil alone in the British isles. Your average NFL game was watched by 16.5 mil people in 2016 (a significant drop from 2015, but still huge). I don't imagine a London team would bet significantly less than that, and there's potential for it to be substantially more, if games are timed properly (London games at night, away games in the very early afternoon/late morning, and only play on Saturday/Sunday).
The owner of the Wolfpack has suggested that transatlantic teams are feasible for all North American and European sports leagues, but I don't agree yet. You can't transpose MLB, NHL, or NBA seasons across the ocean unless the market for those sports also crosses the ocean (none of these sports have flexible enough schedules to make sure cross-Atlantic games are still viewable at reasonable times). I don't think the flight times is as big an issue; by next year the XB-1 (a ~40-60 seat supersonic jet that flies faster than the Concorde) should begin it's first flight tests, and supersonic commercial aircraft should make a legitimate comeback by the end of the next decade. At ~3 hours from London/Paris to NYC, flight times are a non issue. It's just the game has to be global in scope, or you have to play such a limited number of games to make it work. I actually think European soccer has the best potential for a transatlantic team in a major sport, but the way the sport works in Europe makes it very unlikely.
BKIslandersFan
F*** off
Only league this might impact right now is NFL.
My idea of how to make this work for NFL: Get a team in London, have International Series games in Europe and make the London NFL team the away team for all of them, therefore it saves the London team significant amount of traveling time and distance.
My idea of how to make this work for NFL: Get a team in London, have International Series games in Europe and make the London NFL team the away team for all of them, therefore it saves the London team significant amount of traveling time and distance.
European soccer has the best potential for a transatlantic team? Seriously? It's almost as if the other continents didn't have their own professional teams...
NFL London will happen. It just makes too much sense. The reality for the NFL is that the sport of football hasn't been able to create professional scenes outside NA. They have little other option than to expand internationally by adopting the top down approach.
London is about as safe a bet as it gets. Global financial center. One of the richest cities in the world. English speaking. Already exposed to the league. New Tottenham stadium geared to host an NFL team + option of Wembley. Gateway to entire European market. It's a no brainer.
The problem, if it is even a problem at all, is that there is no obvious second international market. German cities have been mentioned, as has Mexico City. But neither of those are anywhere near London.
Bjorn Le
Hobocop
Yes. They have support on this side of the ocean, and have a similar game structure o the NFL. I acknowledged that the nature of soccer leagues was part of the problem for they happening. They don't expand, and they're typically confined to single countries. But economically it makes the most sense even if it's not anymore likely than the NHL putting a team in Stockholm.
Most German cities are within a 2 hour flight from London. Frankfurt is an hour and a half for example. They're close.
Kane One
Moderator
Why will anyone want to get rid of one of their home games?
A London NFL team will likely have training facilities in both London and in the US and the players will probably stay in the US for a few weeks at a time.
BKIslandersFan
F*** off
I am not suggesting they do this for all of London NFL team's away games.
And teams are already forced to give up one home game already.
Kane One
Moderator
They are currently doing it to promote the NFL in London. Once there's a team there, I don't see why any of them would want to continue.
BKIslandersFan
F*** off
Promote NFL in other European countries? They could do one in Dublin and Munich etc...
Kane One
Moderator
Yeah they could, which would mean they wouldn't be playing "home" games in London.
BKIslandersFan
F*** off
What are you talking about? I was suggesting London NFL team be the away team in International Series games, that will then be relocated to other European cities.
Kane One
Moderator
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