OT: Demographic Shift in Canada favors basketball and soccer

Discussion in 'The Business of Hockey' started by TorontoSports, May 19, 2006.

  1. TorontoSports

    TorontoSports Registered User

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    Pretty interesting. Glad to see soccer growth going up on this continent, it is after all the "beutiful game." :)
     
  2. Bank Shot

    Bank Shot Registered User

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    There should be some programs to convert minorities over to God's game.
     
  3. sunb

    sunb Registered User

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    Not surprising at all given the socio-economic impacts. Knowing that most minorities are not as affluent as their caucasian counterparts and have less resources to dedicate to activities of leisure, it is obvious that hockey won't be their sport of preference. To play hockey, there not only needs to be an ice rink but also skates, sticks, pads and a lot of equipment. A game of basketball only requires a hoop and a ball while soccer just requires some nets and a field. This is the reason you don't see a lot of African-American and Hispanic hockey players. But as the economic situations of all Canadians improve, I wouldn't be surprised to see a growing interest in hockey.
     
  4. TorontoSports

    TorontoSports Registered User

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    What if they just prefer the games? That cannot be it? There really is no one answer, it is what it is. Your post is semi-prejudice, you are implying that minorities have little money, but if Canada is anything like america, I'd think you guys would have "visible minorites" that have immigrated to canada; some of which bring their money from back home and settle down. Just another hypothetical situation.
     
  5. Jazz

    Jazz Registered User

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    I think that Hockey Canada could help with this regard.

    Egs could be to encourage local ethnic shows to make shows at a local rink, supporting a local team or something like that, or give away merchandise etc.

    Also, the first wave of immigrants from 70s and 80s have kids now that have grown up with hockey, you will see increasing visible-minority representation (albeit slowly at first) within the junior ranks and eventually the NHL. Once one of these players will make it big and draw more attention to hockey within an ethnic group, things will change.
     
  6. GKJ

    GKJ Global Moderator

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    There is.
     
  7. BlueAndWhite

    BlueAndWhite Registered User

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    Excellent Point.

    Curse you Manny Malhotra.
     
  8. Eeyore

    Eeyore Registered User

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    There is something to that, but consider that immigrants typically have some familly in their native land and often send money back to support them. This reduces discretionary spending money.

    Soccer or basketball are always going to be cheap to play, since the equipment is cheap, and there is no shortage of suitable land. Hockey has more expensive equipment, and there is a shortage of rinks in many areas (particularly cities). So unless you play at a high level, you are going to play late at night or really early in the morning. It isn't as easy as it once was (for anyone, whether immigrants or not).
     
  9. MayDay

    MayDay Registered User

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    By and large, this is true. It's not prejudice, it's simple demographics. Minorities have a lower per capita income in North America than whites.

    Stating a fact is not prejudice. Prejudice is attempting to explain that fact with an explanation such as "Minorities are lazier/less intelligent/less skilled/etc."
     
  10. Jazz

    Jazz Registered User

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    Malhotra played in New York and none of my Indian business contacts in New York had heard of him.....

    I remember when Robin Bawa had a cup of tea with the Vancouver Canucks in the early 90s and it was huge news within the Indian community here. He later went to San Jose, I wonder how he was received by the sizeable Indian community there?

    Anyways, to expand on my point above, it will obviously have to be an above-average player.
     
  11. discostu

    discostu Registered User

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    Well, it may not be fact. From what I understand, the two fastest growing visible minority groups in Canada are Asian and East Indian/South Asian. These two groups have also been among the wealthiest demographics in North America. I don't have recent stats on that, so, I can't claim it as fact.

    Bottom line, I think more evidence is needed before one can diagnos the issue as minorities not having the money.
     
  12. sunb

    sunb Registered User

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    I'm not being prejudice at all. Minorities in Canada possess less, earn less and have less to spend than the caucasian majority in Canada. In Canada, the average minority is less affluent than the average caucasian and the richest minorities are a siginificant level below the richest caucasians. If is funny that you cite the United States, which is one of the most polarized nations on earth with the rich (usually whites) getting richer while the poor (mostly African-American and Hispanic-American minorities) getting poorer.

    When one social group is on a rung below another group on the economic ladder, you'll see stark differences. Whether it is consumption habits, preferences, hobbies, tastes or values, the economic disparity manifests itself in every venue of life. Hockey remains, to this day, a middle-class sport and lower-class Canadians simply cannot afford the hundreds of dollars of capital investment to get into it. A basketball or a soccer ball costs $11 at a department store. Even if a lower-class Canadian were to prefer hockey to basketball, he is constrained by economic influences and societal influences (peer pressure from friends and parents) to invest in the sport of basketball instead.
     
  13. sunb

    sunb Registered User

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    Wealthiest minorities among the pack yes but on average, they still earn less, possess less and spend less than whites. I'm not going to cite a study since every study out there will collaborate with the facts aforementioned above.

    I am an Economics major with concentrations in Political Economy and Sociology, and race dynamics is a topic of my expertise. Any reasonable statistics will show that the average Asian earns less than the average white.
     
  14. discostu

    discostu Registered User

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    I have heard to the contrary, and, if you are so deeply involved in the field, I'm sure it isn't hard for you to find a link to a credible study. I looked, but couldn't find anything.
     
  15. vcx*

    vcx* Guest

    I hope Vancouver gets a team again, this time not sabotaged by the NBA to fail like last time, no way in hell does a franchise do the stuff they did without some inside office bs.

    As for hockey, throw in another 2 canadian teams and 1 american team.
     
  16. vcx*

    vcx* Guest


    Say what? You know the thing with minorities is that they don't claim the full amount they make, you should know that mr economy dude.

    For an example, in BC, the secondary school Princess Margaret is mainly indo-canadian and because of that they consider it an inner-city school, pretty much ghetto. What they fail to realize is that those indo-canadian families make a lot of money but don't claim the full amount, there are ways around that i am sure you already know.

    It's not uncommon practice for minorities to be doing that, my family is like a freakin colour wheel.
     
  17. Realm

    Realm Registered User

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    Geez, NBA and Soccer? I would rather watch my dad take a shower then watch that crap!
     
  18. midg14*

    midg14* Guest

    I think its just -1 for all of them...
     
  19. go_leafs_go02

    go_leafs_go02 Registered User

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    Correct

    NHL

    + Ottawa Senators
    - Quebec Nordiques
    - Winnipeg Jets
     
  20. TorontoSports

    TorontoSports Registered User

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    I think you guys are being a bit naive, it is clearly obvious basketball is growing in Canada, and why shouldn't it? Soccer too.
     
  21. ludger

    ludger Registered User

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    Soccer and basketball, jesh I guess that.s when I drop out following sports. Is there anything more boring in sports than watching soccer?
     
  22. Cyclops II*

    Cyclops II* Guest


    Watching 9 foot imbeciles trying to run around a basketball court.
     
  23. discostu

    discostu Registered User

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    Well, I found a study that talks about the immigration income levels in Canada. It dispells this notion that the reason why hockey is losing ground to other sports is because of the inability for immigrant families to afford it.

    http://dsp-psd.pwgsc.gc.ca/Collection/Statcan/11F0019MIE/11F0019MIE2003197.pdf

     
  24. Alpine

    Alpine Registered User

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    All this time, I thought cricket was gonna be Canada's next sport.
    With the immigration patterns, why not? Cricket World Cup has an amazing following just not in Canada. I believe I read somewhere that as far as "world" advertising money makers Cricket WC was 4th after Soccer WC, Olympics and Rugby WC. For years the championship game of the Brier held the record as the most watched televised game in Canada. :shakehead
    I don't think I'll worry about basketball overtaking hockey in Canada in my lifetime. ;)
    edit: Since you're talking about Canada the post should read:
    "Demographic shift in Canada favours basketball and soccer"
    Get with the programme ( humour ;) )
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2006
  25. Saint Teemu

    Saint Teemu Registered User

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    I agree with this completely. It's obscenely expensive to buy all the gear for hockey, and you still have to factor in all the little extra costs. Here's a fictionalized example:
    "Great news, Dad! I made the AAA traveling team. Now I need red gloves, blue pants, and a yellow helmet to match the team colours. This year we're going to that tournament in Quebec City if I sell 8,500 boxes of chocolate almonds, or if you just shell out $2,000. By the way, my Easton Synergy stick broke when I looked at it sideways. I need $250 to replace it."

    I can certainly see how buying a new pair of soccer cleats every year would be a lot more palatable.

    Your comment about ice availability is spot on, too. In fact, the cost of gear and the crap ice times my team was allocated were instrumental in me quitting playing beer league hockey. I kind of miss it, but I've been considering playing indoor soccer as a replacement sport.
     

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