Friedman: On Evander Kane's Future

[Colt55]

That can't be verified. It's impossible to know

Look they rarely ever pan out like i said its mostly talk and guessing. But seriously Blues need a Right handed 2ndline 3rd line right winger capable of 20+ goals. Not a left winger who has been know to be a locker room cancer. Just dont need that in our locker room

 

[Beerz]

Look they rarely ever pan out like i said its mostly talk and guessing. But seriously Blues need a Right handed 2ndline 3rd line right winger capable of 20+ goals. Not a left winger who has been know to be a locker room cancer. Just dont need that in our locker room

Well he hasn't been a cancer in Buffalo. That's all I know.

 

[Colt55]

Well he hasn't been a cancer in Buffalo. That's all I know.

I'll take your word for it but i would not want to risk it. He doesnt fill a need on our team. He is Lh LW we Need a RH RW and we dont need to break the bank for a rental that could possibly have locker room issues. Im not trying to slam you but we just dont need or want that.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

There is a huge disconnect here. Its said the Blues were interested in Kane. Which shouldn't be a suprise as theyve been open to adding a top 6 guy since they lost Fabbri. I havn't seen a shred of evidence to indicate they are ready to open the piggy bank for Kane. Some fans are taking offense to Blues fans not willing to give up top prospects(nothing has been proven to say Army is willing to either) for what looks like a rental...a rental of a position if strenght none the less.

This bickering back and forth would make more sense if Blues fans were trying to throw out lowball offers....which no one is. Just more of "not really interested".

Evidence? This is not a court. Best we have in most situations are rumors from insiders. GMs don't come out and say I want guys X and Y on my team and I want to get rid of guy Z. Doesn't work that way..

 

[DJN21]

If you are referring to me, again, show me 1 post where I over-evaluated a prospect.

Not you friend rest easy. And I'd like to say I agree with the poster above who pointed out no blues fan really showed interest in kane as a rental. It doesn' make a ton of sense for them nor do they have the prospects or 1st round pick the sabres would be targeting ooutside of dunn. This thread has spiraled from sabres fans having a conversation on what they'd target from an uninterested blues fan base, which was confounded by a few blues posters going above and beyond to overrate their prospects and degrade kane for...reasons. Pointless all around.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Not you friend rest easy. And I'd like to say I agree with the poster above who pointed out no blues fan really showed interest in kane as a rental. It doesn' make a ton of sense for them nor do they have the prospects or 1st round pick the sabres would be targeting ooutside of dunn. This thread has spiraled from sabres fans having a conversation on what they'd target from an uninterested blues fan base, which was confounded by a few blues posters going above and beyond to overrate their prospects and degrade kane for...reasons. Pointless all around.

Fair enough, my bad.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

Not you friend rest easy. And I'd like to say I agree with the poster above who pointed out no blues fan really showed interest in kane as a rental. It doesn' make a ton of sense for them nor do they have the prospects or 1st round pick the sabres would be targeting ooutside of dunn. This thread has spiraled from sabres fans having a conversation on what they'd target from an uninterested blues fan base, which was confounded by a few blues posters going above and beyond to overrate their prospects and degrade kane for...reasons. Pointless all around.

This thread is inspired by Friedmann and Bobby Mac stating Kane is being made available and it seems Blues are prime candidate for him for whatever reason. Its not just fans talking nonsense.

 

[DJN21]

Fair enough, my bad.

No worries at all bud. If you wanna entertain trading us tank let me know lol.

 

[Colt55]

Evidence? This is not a court. Best we have in most situations are rumors from insiders. GMs don't come out and say I want guys X and Y on my team and I want to get rid of guy Z. Doesn't work that way..

Were any of those x and ys said to be blues top prospects . Nope I'm. Sure army kicked the tires. If he was #1 rental out thereally why are only 3 teams interestep, why hasn't army or marry b been seen at buff games scouting him???

 

[DJN21]

This thread is inspired by Friedmann and Bobby Mac stating Kane is being made available and it seems Blues are prime candidate for him for whatever reason. Its not just fans talking nonsense.

Kane has been available for months and has been linked to half the teams in the league. This isn' news it' speculation. Blues fans on the main page trade forum never seemed receptive to kane as a viable aquistion. We as sabres fans can speculate on what we'd want in said hypothetical trades but bickering with people who say sprry not interested just makes you appear as a pushy salesman.

On another note sabres fans are never going to get positive feedback when discussing kane. Just wait until a real trade goes down. Our return will be solid, of that I'm sure but casual fans aren't open to discussing that now. Once kane scores a few goals in another jersey you'll see minds change...cest la vie.

 

[Zip15]

Well someone from the Buffalo side said Kane for Schwartz (won't even discuss how preposterous and uninformed that suggestion was) and then we've seen Dunn/Walman + Kyrou/Thompson or the even more laughable Thomas + Fabbri. Blues fans can't really overrate the prospects being discussed in this thread because Buffalo fans seem to think they're going to snatch someone off the current roster. The trade with Schwartz included had to have been a really bad joke, the Thomas and Fabbri proposal is light years away from being remotely palatable for the Blues and anyone that thinks they'd be able to land Dunn for a rental is extremely misguided, not to mention there was an add of a top 5 organizational prospect on top of Dunn.

Honestly, the only realistic proposal that's been thrown out is Kyrou and Noel for Kane. I think the Blues would need to add a pick on top of that for Buffalo to consider it but at least its a start that could have some legs for discussion. This pretty much boils down to Buffalo fans wanting to take advantage of having a great rental player that isn't in their future plans and Blues fans not wanting anything to do with said rental no matter the price, especially the crap that's been thrown out thus far.

Except I stated that the Sabres would add something, but, by all means, continue with your foot-stamping without even asking the type of asset I was willing to attach to Kane.

Show me my evaluation of a prospect I overrated.

If you are referring to me, again, show me 1 post where I over-evaluated a prospect.

I remember you from the Miller trade discussion days. I have neither the energy nor the desire to dig them up, but your takes on the untouchability of Ty Rattie and Dmitrij Jaskin would look pretty silly in hindsight. It's okay to overrate prospects. We all do.

It was still a mistake and we could've selected Roslovic or Aho with that pick. Like we said all along, Miller completely clashed with our style, and it was a disaster.

Perhaps you should've traded Rattie + 2nd instead.

I believe the proposal you're referencing the poster alluded to Buffalo adding on to Kane.

He said "even if it requires Buffalo to add something" so you're correct but even suggesting that there's a possibility they might not have to add makes it a ridiculous proposal. Dunn + Kyrou is worth quite a bit more than rental Kane + whatever Buffalo would add outside of Eichel, Reinhart, ROR, Risto, etc.

And I'm not suggesting that Buffalo would add any of those guys to that because that would be stupid but the gap between those guys and any other player/asset from Buffalo is too great to add to rental Kane and bridge the value gap to Dunn and Kyrou.

What if I said Nylander? (I know, I'm sure Kyrou is the better prospect because Nylander was struggling against pros instead of curb-stomping the OHL like he would have last year in his D+1 season.) But, again, that would have required you to stop and ask what the add to Kane is, before you set off on your tantrum.

 

[Dbrownss]

Evidence? This is not a court. Best we have in most situations are rumors from insiders. GMs don't come out and say I want guys X and Y on my team and I want to get rid of guy Z. Doesn't work that way..

DA was rumored to be looking to move a dman+prospect for forward help not too long ago. You couple that with common sense and you can have a good educated guess as to who's available.


I just see this as an echo chamber for Buffalo fans and what they want. Ignoring other fan bases as to their teams' needs. By this i mean the Blues lack top end talent on LHD and RW, and what they don't need is another LW. Every prospect named is a position of need for the Blues. I just cant see them dealing from a position of weakness to fill a position of strenght. If Kane was RHS....We'd be far more interested and willing to meet the fantasty demands.


I would be interested in Kane and i can see the blues having intetest but it would require a restructuring of the LW. As in...saying by to Steen and his damn near 6m cap hit.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I remember you from the Miller trade discussion days. I have neither the energy nor the desire to dig them up, but your takes on the untouchability of Ty Rattie and Dmitrij Jaskin would look pretty silly in hindsight. It's okay to overrate prospects. We all do.

And in both Buffalo and Ottawa threads, I was correct, they ended up going for less and Jaskin and Rattie were never moved. I always said Rattie was going to be a complete boom/bust player. He'd either be top 6 winger or he'd never make it. Jaskin was the one with the higher floor, lower ceiling, but I was definitely wrong on how he'd develop. I never said I am 100% right on how prospects will develop, what I was saying, is that I generally have a solid feeling on how the prospects are valued while they are still prospects.

At the time Rattie and Jaskin were untouchable prospects, and Buffalo fans didn't get what they thought they'd get for Miller.

 

[McDonald19]

He's going to LA.

LA has a shallow prospect pool, would they give up another 1st rd pick?

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Just out of curiosity, how do you guys value Ferland in comparison to Bennett? Higher, lower?

I still have Bennett quite a bit higher myself. But Ferland has definitely closed the gap without question.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I really hope the Blues don't pick up Kane. He doesn't seem like a player who would gel into the Blues lineup and he plays a position that we have enough of. Plus if we are trading one of our prospects I'd much rather pick up a natural RW (RHS is a plus) signed for at least 1 more year.

 

[simon IC]

Not you friend rest easy. And I'd like to say I agree with the poster above who pointed out no blues fan really showed interest in kane as a rental. It doesn' make a ton of sense for them nor do they have the prospects or 1st round pick the sabres would be targeting ooutside of dunn. This thread has spiraled from sabres fans having a conversation on what they'd target from an uninterested blues fan base, which was confounded by a few blues posters going above and beyond to overrate their prospects and degrade kane for...reasons. Pointless all around.

Very well said! Thank you.

 

[Colt55]

So not very many people interested in E Kane. Especially at the Value the poster expressed. I wonder what kind of contract Kane thinks he will get.

 

[Jame]

So not very many people interested in E Kane. Especially at the Value the poster expressed. I wonder what kind of contract Kane thinks he will get.

For someone who dislike's Kane so much... it's a bit surprising that 20% of your posts are about him.

 

[Colt55]

For someone who dislike's Kane so much... it's a bit surprising that 20% of your posts are about him.

Been a slow week. I'm vested in this convo. But your response does only deflect my point. There is not much interest in this guy. You may not get the return you like. Maybe time to lower expectations.

 

[Jame]

Been a slow week. I'm vested in this convo. But your response does only deflect my point. There is not much interest in this guy. You may not get the return you like. Maybe time to lower expectations.

Yea... let's judge the interest in Evander Kane based on a message board, and not Bob McKenzie's reporting



I'm pretty confident the Sabres will get a typical high end rental package (see Ladd/Hanzal)...
OR
They will go deeper in to a hockey deal by adding more than rental assets. i.e. Kane + McCabe or Girgensons or Larsson and so on....

 

[Shootica]

Been a slow week. I'm vested in this convo. But your response does only deflect my point. There is not much interest in this guy. You may not get the return you like. Maybe time to lower expectations.

So Elliotte Friedman and Bob McKenzie say that interest in Kane is picking up and list four teams that are in on him, and this is your takeaway?

 

[Colt55]

Yea... let's judge the interest in Evander Kane based on a message board, and not Bob McKenzie's reporting



I'm pretty confident the Sabres will get a typical high end rental package (see Ladd/Hanzal)...
OR
They will go deeper in to a hockey deal by adding more than rental assets. i.e. Kane + McCabe or Girgensons or Larsson and so on....

OK well time will tell. I'm more than willing to admit when I'm wrong. So we shall see. FYI every year there is a lot of talk and very little action before winter freeze, pretty similar at deadline as well.

As for ladd, he was a leader, he had heart and has experience winning. Kane has neither of those features

 

[Colt55]

How is it that those four teams that are in on him haven't even had scouts seen at buff games... let me guess winter weather. No doubt teams are kicking the tires. But in the cap world, and with his reputation there is less interest than being reported. I'm sure some team will grab hIm but not at what you have bee asking

 

[Jame]

OK well time will tell. I'm more than willing to admit when I'm wrong. So we shall see. FYI every year there is a lot of talk and very little action before winter freeze, pretty similar at deadline as well.

As for ladd, he was a leader, he had heart and has experience winning. Kane has neither of those features

Correct... instead... he just scores a lot of goals.