nylander/rielly vs aho/slavin

[Hugh Mungus]

which W/D duo would you take?

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[Hokinaittii]

Nylander and Aho are pretty much equal in talent. Slavin is slightly more promising than Rielly.

I'd pick Canes duo.

 

[TheDoldrums]

Nylander > Aho
Slavin >> Rielly

Leafs fan. I'll take Carolina slightly. But I'm really high on Slavin.

 

[Wayne Primeau]

Nylander >= Aho
Slavin >>> Rielly

Pretty easy call.

 

[Jyrki Lumme]

Nylander is better than Aho, but Slavin is a lot better than Rielly.

 

[Cor]

I'll take the younger d-man who has played over 300 NHL games, and is now on a playoff teams top pairing and the kid who put up 61 points in his 20 year old season and may transition to Center

 

[Wayne Primeau]

I'll take the younger d-man who has played over 300 NHL games, and is now on a playoff teams top pairing and the kid who put up 61 points in his 20 year old season and may transition to Center

I hate to break it to you, but Slavin is younger than Rielly.

 

[A1LeafNation]

I hate to break it to you, but Slavin is younger than Rielly.

By how much?

 

[jetsforever]

Good poll, I'd take Nylander over Aho but Slavin over Rielly. Right now I think the defence gap is bigger so voted Carolina.

 

[Wayne Primeau]

By how much?

Two months, but still.

 

[kelsier]

As much as I like Nylander I would still take Aho ahead of him. Aho has the shades of Zetterberg & S. Koivu in his game and in my opinion is better suited for center. Nylander has better physical tools and skating ability, but there are not many players in the league who can read the game better than Aho. He's extremely underrated here and I don't expect all to agree. Slavin comes ahead when comparing the two defenders so this is an easy choice.

 

[Morgs]

Nylander > Slavin >> Rielly > Aho

Close, but I take Leafs because of Nylander alone.

 

[Cor]

Slavin being better than Rielly is a myth. He had a better season. Doesn't mean he's a better player.

- Rielly was playing against a higher Quality of Competition than Slavin. Despite that, Slavin's possession impact is minimal over Reilly's. When you actually adjust, Rielly is the better possession player.
- Rielly got minimal powerplay time last season. Considering the success of the Leafs powerplay, had he been on it, his point totals would have been higher, likely higher than Slavin's.
- Morgan Reilly's primary points/hr is higher, while shot impact/hr is on par (Rielly better generation, Slavin better suppression, not adjusted for QOC)
- Slavin's PDO was at 101.0, which suggests he's due for a slight regression, while Reilly's PDO was down at 97, which suggests he's due for quiet the bounce back season.


Jacob Slavin is good, had a terrific season, however Rielly is at worst on par, and looking at analytics is superior despite the down season.

 

[WilliamNylander]

The gap between Nylander and Aho is bigger than the gap between Slavin and Rielly IMO.

So I went with the Leafs duo.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Slavin being better than Rielly is a myth. He had a better season. Doesn't mean he's a better player.

- Rielly was playing more minutes, and against a higher Quality of Competition than Slavin. Despite that, Slavin's possession impact is minimal over Reilly's. When you actually adjust, Rielly is the better possession player.
- Rielly got minimal powerplay time last season. Slavin was a regular. Considering the success of the Leafs powerplay, had he been on it, his point totals would have been higher, likely higher than Slavin's.

ESTOI/GP: Slavin 19:23; Rielly: 18:49
SH TOI/GP: Slavin 3:07; Rielly: 2:22
PP TOI/GP: Slavin: 0:55; Rielly: 0:58

Slavin played more minutes ES and SH than Rielly and they had the same amount of PP time/GP. If you watched the Canes, you'd know that Slavin basically got mop up duty on the PP as they wanted him out there when the penalty ended so he wasn't a "regular" on the PP. I know both players played the toughest minutes on their respective teams.

I do agree with you that the gap isn't as much as some in this thread are implying though. I am, and have been a Rielly fan all along and think he's better than many people think. Rielly, IMO, has better offensive skills/potential and Slavin has better defensive skills/potential. I also don't think the gap between Aho and Nylander is as big as some are implying.

Close poll.

 

[tony d]

I went with Option 2. Nylander's better than Aho. Slavin may be better than Rielly but the difference isn't that much.

 

[Cor]

ESTOI/GP: Slavin 19:23; Rielly: 18:49
SH TOI/GP: Slavin 3:07; Rielly: 2:22
PP TOI/GP: Slavin: 0:55; Rielly: 0:58

Slavin played more minutes ES and SH than Rielly. If you watched the Canes, you'd know that Slavin basically got mop up duty on the PP as they wanted him out there when the penalty ended so he wasn't a "regular" on the PP. I know both players played the toughest minutes on their respective teams.

I do agree with you that the gap isn't as much as some in this thread are implying though. I am, and have been a Rielly fan all along and think he's better than many people think. Rielly, IMO, has better offensive skills/potential and Slavin has better defensive skills/potential. I also don't think the gap between Aho and Nylander is as big as some are implying.

Close poll.

I stand corrected on the Slavin being a regular on the PP. Thought he was.

FYI, Rielly-Zaitsev as a pair faced the second highest QOC in the league, Rielly was 7th among all D individually. Slavin wasn't even top 20 IIRC.

So while Slavin may have had the highest QOC on the Canes, it still doesn't compare, because Rielly faced insane competition.

The good news is, it seems like Babs is going to try and balence out the QOC this season, so that's gonna to help Rielly immensely.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Slavin being better than Rielly is a myth. He had a better season. Doesn't mean he's a better player.

- Rielly was playing against a higher Quality of Competition than Slavin. Despite that, Slavin's possession impact is minimal over Reilly's. When you actually adjust, Rielly is the better possession player.
- Rielly got minimal powerplay time last season. Considering the success of the Leafs powerplay, had he been on it, his point totals would have been higher, likely higher than Slavin's.
- Morgan Reilly's primary points/hr is higher, while shot impact/hr is on par (Rielly better generation, Slavin better suppression, not adjusted for QOC)
- Slavin's PDO was at 101.0, which suggests he's due for a slight regression, while Reilly's PDO was down at 97, which suggests he's due for quiet the bounce back season.

Jacob Slavin is good, had a terrific season, however Rielly is at worst on par, and looking at analytics is superior despite the down season.

Maybe this is part the reason why the Leafs PP improved to #2 last year. It's not as if Rielly has a better skill set that anything that Zaitsev or Gardiner offer to the PP. His shot is not the greatest slow release and power wise. He can pass the puck, but so can others. It's an assumption Rielly would rack of PP points as we have not seen this yet in his career. BTW I am curious why did you vote as a Canes fan for Nylander/Rielly in this poll?

 

[Sypher04]

Maybe this is part the reason why the Leafs PP improved to #2 last year. It's not as if Rielly has a better skill set that anything that Zaitsev or Gardiner offer to the PP. His shot is not the greatest slow release and power wise. He can pass the puck, but so can others. It's an assumption Rielly would rack of PP points as we have not seen this yet in his career. BTW I am curious why did you vote as a Canes fan for Nylander/Rielly in this poll?

NO.

Adding the talent of Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Brown specifically to career seasons from Kadri and Gardiner did though.

Rielly's passing ability is easily tops on our defense. His slapshot is nothing to write home about, but his wrister gets through and on net pretty consistently. And his release isn't particularly slow as you claim.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I stand corrected on the Slavin being a regular on the PP. Thought he was.

Actually, you stand corrected on their ages (you said Rielly was younger), OA TOI (you said Rielly played more minutes), and PP TOI. It's not a big deal, but your posts lose some credibility when you have some basic facts wrong. It also indicates (maybe incorrectly) that you haven't watched Slavin much and are going simply off of stats.

FYI, Rielly-Zaitsev as a pair faced the second highest QOC in the league, Rielly was 7th among all D individually. Slavin wasn't even top 20 IIRC.

So while Slavin may have had the highest QOC on the Canes, it still doesn't compare, because Rielly faced insane competition.

The good news is, it seems like Babs is going to try and balence out the QOC this season, so that's gonna to help Rielly immensely.

Point being, Slavin still faced very tough competition in all situations and did fantastic against it so it does compare. I watched both players extensively as the Leafs are my 2nd team and I'm a big Rielly fan. Slavin, is a superior player defensively. He's almost robotic in that he rarely makes a mistake and every decision defensively is the right one. Rielly just isn't as good defensively as Slavin is, competition or not.

That said, I think Rielly is better offensively and has more offensive potential than Slavin and do agree that if he was used in a more offensive role, he'd outproduced Slavin. The same way defense comes naturally to Slavin, Rielly is more natural when it comes to offense than Slavin is. Also, with Faulk and Hanifin, I don't see Slavin ever getting much PP time on Carolina other than being sent out at the end of a PP as he was this year.

Hopefully, as you said, Rielly is able to be used in a more balanced role this year as I think he can be a solid 40+ point defenseman. I'm not sure how I feel about him being paired up with Hainsey.

 

[GoldiFox]

Slavin being better than Rielly is a myth. He had a better season. Doesn't mean he's a better player.

- Rielly was playing against a higher Quality of Competition than Slavin. Despite that, Slavin's possession impact is minimal over Reilly's. When you actually adjust, Rielly is the better possession player.
- Rielly got minimal powerplay time last season. Considering the success of the Leafs powerplay, had he been on it, his point totals would have been higher, likely higher than Slavin's.
- Morgan Reilly's primary points/hr is higher, while shot impact/hr is on par (Rielly better generation, Slavin better suppression, not adjusted for QOC)
- Slavin's PDO was at 101.0, which suggests he's due for a slight regression, while Reilly's PDO was down at 97, which suggests he's due for quiet the bounce back season.


Jacob Slavin is good, had a terrific season, however Rielly is at worst on par, and looking at analytics is superior despite the down season.

I'll take the younger d-man who has played over 300 NHL games, and is now on a playoff teams top pairing and the kid who put up 61 points in his 20 year old season and may transition to Center

You are still digging after that age gaffe? "Younger D Man", taken in the same draft, of which experts have said Slavin is the #1D. Maybe you could just admit you don't know much about Slavin? Rielly is a couple tiers below Slavin.

 

[KlefDown]

Slavin being better than Rielly is a myth. He had a better season. Doesn't mean he's a better player.

- Rielly was playing against a higher Quality of Competition than Slavin. Despite that, Slavin's possession impact is minimal over Reilly's. When you actually adjust, Rielly is the better possession player.
- Rielly got minimal powerplay time last season. Considering the success of the Leafs powerplay, had he been on it, his point totals would have been higher, likely higher than Slavin's.
- Morgan Reilly's primary points/hr is higher, while shot impact/hr is on par (Rielly better generation, Slavin better suppression, not adjusted for QOC)
- Slavin's PDO was at 101.0, which suggests he's due for a slight regression, while Reilly's PDO was down at 97, which suggests he's due for quiet the bounce back season.


Jacob Slavin is good, had a terrific season, however Rielly is at worst on par, and looking at analytics is superior despite the down season.

Slavin >> Rielly. Not even a discussion, even most leafs fans see this.

also, good players tend to have high PDO while bad ones have low PDO

 

[The Winter Soldier]

NO.

Adding the talent of Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Brown specifically to career seasons from Kadri and Gardiner did though.

Rielly's passing ability is easily tops on our defense. His slapshot is nothing to write home about, but his wrister gets through and on net pretty consistently. And his release isn't particularly slow as you claim.

Stats and the facts say yes. You can assume taking Zaitsev or Gardiner off would not have had an impact on the Leafs PP last year, but the fact is they were both very good on it. So knowing rather than maybe is a stronger case right now. Rielly's career average is 31 points over 82 games in a 312 game sample. Don't you think his offence would have surfaced by now? His shot or lack of an efficient shot may be what is keeping him from this. I think most unbiased Leafs fans will admit it is a weakness in his game.

 

[Cor]

Actually, you stand corrected on their ages (you said Rielly was younger), OA TOI (you said Rielly played more minutes), and PP TOI. It's not a big deal, but your posts lose some credibility when you have some basic facts wrong. It also indicates (maybe incorrectly) that you haven't watched Slavin much and are going simply off of stats.



Point being, Slavin still faced very tough competition in all situations and did fantastic against it so it does compare. I watched both players extensively as the Leafs are my 2nd team and I'm a big Rielly fan. Slavin, is a superior player defensively. He's almost robotic in that he rarely makes a mistake and every decision defensively is the right one. Rielly just isn't as good defensively as Slavin is, competition or not.

That said, I think Rielly is better offensively and has more offensive potential than Slavin and do agree that if he was used in a more offensive role, he'd outproduced Slavin. The same way defense comes naturally to Slavin, Rielly is more natural when it comes to offense than Slavin is. Also, with Faulk and Hanifin, I don't see Slavin ever getting much PP time on Carolina other than being sent out at the end of a PP as he was this year.

Hopefully, as you said, Rielly is able to be used in a more balanced role this year as I think he can be a solid 40+ point defenseman. I'm not sure how I feel about him being paired up with Hainsey.

I already said Slavin is the better defensive player. However, Rielly is the better possession and offensive player.

Also, no, Rielly played against insane competition, it affects numbers, it's a fact. When Rielly switched with Gardiner near the final 10 games or so, Rielly's CF% skyrocketed to the 54-55% range. I'm not arguing that Slavin didn't play tough QOC, however it doesn't compare to the QOC Rielly faced, which is why when you adjust the numbers, Rielly, overall, was the more effective player, despite it being one of, if not his worst season thus far in the NHL.

Either way, I'm not going to get into a dick measuring contest with Canes fans. I love Slavin, I love Rielly. I take Nylander over Aho, so that's the difference.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Good poll.

Nylander>Aho
Slavin>Rielly

canes for me, although I love Rielly and Nylander the gap between Nylander and aho is smaller than the gap between Slavin and Rielly.