Now when Lidstrom got his 5th norris, how far can he climb?

Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by SChan*, Jun 15, 2007.

  1. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    Here are a couple of questions regarding Lidstrom.

    1) Can he reach Doug Harvey's 7 Norris Trophies?
    2) Can he actually become the 2nd best defenseman alltime? (after Orr)
    3) Can he become the best european player ever in the NHL

    1) If Lidstrom play 5 more seasons he might do it.
    2) If Lidstrom win 1 more cup, maybe a hart and a couple of more norris, then this is a yes.
    3) Yes he can.
     
  2. The Top 3 of Orr, Harvey and Shore (with the order of the last two up for debate) is set.

    I also don't believe that Lidstrom was as good a defenseman as Potvin or Larry Robinson.

    I have Lidstrom in the late single digits all time, somewhere around #8 or #9.
     
  3. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    I dunno but what kind of arguement is that. It is already set? So you're saying that if lidstrom won like 3-4 Norris Trophies, one more cup, a hart it wouldn't matter? We compare players by accomplishments don't we? Or else stats and awards are totally meaningless. It is hard to argue against, especially in the modern competitive type of NHL.

    I'd say Lidstrom is ranked maybe 5th best D-man alltime right now looking at his accomplishments.
     
  4. It's kind of sounding like you're not really asking people to post their opinion...you're asking them to agree with you. :dunno:

    Sure, if Lidstrom wins 3-4 more Norris trophies, one more Cup and a Hart he'd rise up the lists. But that's an awfully big "if." I'm looking at what he's done to the present time, and based on that I have him 8th or 9th.

    If you're asking people to speculate, you're going to get a lot of varied answers.
     
  5. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    no I am just saying that your canadian gods can be beaten despite having bias for them. 9th is kinda ridicilous considering only 2 defenseman have more Norrises than him. Add 3 cups, 1 olympic gold, 1 conn smythe and it sure gets interesting.
     
  6. NOTENOUGHBREWER

    NOTENOUGHBREWER Registered User

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    Q1: Can he reach 7 Norris trophies?

    A: Depends on his competition. If Pronger cant stay healthy and the younger guys like Bouwmeester cant take the next step soon enough then sure.

    Q2: Can he become the second best defenseman of all time?

    A: No.

    Q3: Can he become the best European ever?

    A: If he changes his name to Dominic Hasek people might mistake him for it.
     
  7. pitseleh

    pitseleh Registered User

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    Norris Trophies aren't the be all and end all. Competition plays a large role in the number of Norrises a player has.
     
  8. I'm American, big guy. Try again.
     
  9. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    okay North American then. It's the same thing. You all have a bias for North American players.

    Competition is way tougher today than it was in the past.

    And your arguement is? He is european?
     
  10. :biglaugh:

    You seem to know a lot about me, rookie. I'm known throughout these boards for my massive hatred of Europeans. Anything else?

    I disagree.
     
  11. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    instead of just disagreeing, how about explaning why you think so? Lidstrom has played his hockey during 90s and 00s, easily the most competitve era of NHL. Don't tell me that the 50s when Harvey played was more competitive.
     
    Last edited by moderator : Jun 15, 2007
  12. redwingsdude

    redwingsdude Registered User

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    1. Nick isn't Chelios, I think he plans on playing a few more years as long as he can be a top player, so he's only got 2 or 3 years left to win 2. He isn't going to tarnish his legacy by playing into his 40's. He might win one more, and will be a finalist another few times. Also, Nick should already have 6+ Norrises according to a lot of people. Blake over Lidstrom was a terrible decision IMO. Being a finalist for the award 8 times is pretty amazing in itself.
    2. He'll have a top 10 career when the dust settles, but the second best of ALL-TIME? No.
    3. I don't think so, but best Euro d-man? Yes. He might win another Norris or two, but if he hasn't won a Hart by now, it's just not going to happen at this point.
     
  13. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    Top 5 easily imo. I can't see 9 defeseman that were better than him when Nick is done.
     
  14. NOTENOUGHBREWER

    NOTENOUGHBREWER Registered User

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    Exactly. He'd already be the number 2 if he wasnt European. Every Canadian player gets 4 free Hart trophies to start their career. So he's got Harvey beat.
     
  15. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    harvey played for the unstoppable canadians in the 50s. No one can argue that the 50s were more competive than the 90s or 00s
     
  16. NOTENOUGHBREWER

    NOTENOUGHBREWER Registered User

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    Good point. Ron Francis who just became the NHL's all time leading scorer agrees.
     
  17. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    anyway, the 50s NHL isnt up to par for todays standards. sorry. Lidstrom is easily better than him.
     
  18. V-2 Schneider

    V-2 Schneider Registered User

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    He's already in the top 10 D.AFAIC, he's surpassed Brad Park.
     
  19. NOTENOUGHBREWER

    NOTENOUGHBREWER Registered User

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    Good point. And since guys who played in the 50's were great in the 70's, then it's obvious the 70's NHL wasnt up to todays standard. So Lidstrom is easily the best defenseman of all time.
     
  20. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    70s? His last season was 69. And he won the majority of his norrises in the 50s.

    and I think Orr is easily the best all-time, I am not debating that. But I think the 2nd spot is very debateble.
     
  21. Bring Back Bucky

    Bring Back Bucky Registered User

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    YOu might get a few raised eyebrows with that power statement, huckleberry.;)
     
  22. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    yea because the NHL were more competitive with 6 teams, no euros and poor equipment and conditioning of the players :sarcasm:

    NHL didn't expand to 12 teams until 1967
     
  23. Bring Back Bucky

    Bring Back Bucky Registered User

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    Chooch????
     
  24. 5H4RK5

    5H4RK5 Registered User

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    If Chelios can play until he is 50 and Lidstrom can come close watch out. :D
     
  25. 19nazzy

    19nazzy Registered User

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    Last I checked, the United States isn't the only country in North America.
    Nice sweeping generalization.
     

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