NHLPA/Saskin Email Controversy (Saskin fired)

Discussion in 'The Business of Hockey' started by stormtracker, Mar 8, 2007.

  1. stormtracker

    stormtracker Registered User

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    There is a police investigation going on in Toronto over allegations that NHLPA top officials looked at players' emails. There has been a conference call made for this weekend from which NHLPA head Ted
    Saskin has been excluded. Speculation has it that he could be fired.

    I liked the job that Saskin did on the negotiations in that he recognized that the owners were not going to back down and he cut a deal that does not appear to be as bad for the players as made out to be (example, the rush to sign free agents). Where he may have a shortcoming is underestimating the strength of the Chris Chelios group of dissidents who were raising questions about the propriety of the
    firing of Bob Goodenow and his appointment. He in hindsight should have stepped back and let the players sort out their affairs. Having tried to keep his position by various means makes him look Nixonian.

    What do you think (if you have an opinion) about how the NHLPA has been running its affairs and what do you think should be done?

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=2791722
     
    Last edited by moderator Ronnie Bass: Mar 8, 2007
  2. Fugu

    Fugu Guest

    Here are a couple of good links from the Globe & Mail. Once on their pages, look in the left margin if you want more links to this story.




    In the end it could be that Saskin's greatest enemy was his own paranoia.
     
  3. WhiteWash*

    WhiteWash* Guest

  4. Fugu

    Fugu Guest

    Per TSN:



     
  5. Weary

    Weary Registered User

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    It's interesting that despite their statements neither Saskin nor Goodenow actually denied reading players' e-mails.
     
  6. Fugu

    Fugu Guest

    Actually Goodenow states that the accusations made against him are false. To quote:

    "The allegations made by Ted Saskin against me regarding player e-mails are false," Goodenow said in a statement through his lawyer Jane Milburn.


    Saskin says:

    I plan to address the board on Sunday night and the board will learn that Bob Goodenow had instructed NHLPA employees to review player e-mail accounts and this occurred during the lockout and I was not aware of this until much later," Saskin told The Canadian Press on Thursday.

    I'm surprised he admits to "knowing" about e-mail tampering even if it is much later. Regardless of when he knew about it, he admits knowing it was happening.
     
  7. FlyerFan

    FlyerFan Registered User

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    You're looking at a desperate fool at the end of his pitiful rope.
     
  8. Ziggy Stardust

    Ziggy Stardust Master Debater

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    Looks like the lockout has broken apart the PA. Where is Wetcoaster to offer his input in this matter?
     
  9. Fugu

    Fugu Guest


    Or like someone took advantage of a difficult situation for personal gain. A breach of trust any way you slice it.
     
  10. Ziggy Stardust

    Ziggy Stardust Master Debater

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    That seems very likely, as Saskin was the next person to turn to after Goodenow's departure. The lockout caused major rift in the ranks as the players wanted Goodenow replaced, and I guess not all PA members were involved in the 'voting' of ejecting Goodenow and electing a new leader. But didn't the official release state that Goodenow stepped down, he wasn't forced out? Either way you cut it, they are at each others throats because of Goodenow's incompetence throughout the lockout. The PA appears to be a disorganized mess now.
     
  11. Fugu

    Fugu Guest

    I don't buy into the rhetoric that Goodenow was incompetent. Did he fail to assess what his constituency would be able to commit to in taking the stance they did? Absolutely. As the union leader, he had a philosophical opposition to salary caps, especially with linkage. As the lockout went along, the masses became restless and demanded a resolution. I think Linden became involved directly, and certainly Saskin was involved at that point. Wasn't it Daly and Saskin who met to carve out the basics of what turned out to be an agreement? Goodenow agreed to stay as long as it took to work out the details. So... was he forced out? No, however he was unwilling to move off of his position and then was swept aside by the executive committee. The appointment of Saskin however is where a lot of this started, with the dissident group claiming procedure was not followed. [I think that is an accurate statement.] Later the issues of the Side Letters came up and who had the right to see these, and how much these were related to the actual agreement. The question being-- did the players and their reps get all the facts. Now the e-mail scandal is being called SaskinGate, replete with comparisons to Nixon and his paranoia!

    On a related note, Ken Kim has been asked to take an official leave of absence by union counsel, Stu Grimson.

    NY Post link here, scroll to the bottom of the story on Simon.

     
  12. Irish Blues

    Irish Blues Still on hiatus

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    You can say that Goodenow wasn't incompetent, but voluntarily offering a 24% rollback on player salaries was a huge negotiating blunder, especially if (as the comments from more than a handful of players after the NHLPA's December 2004 proposal indicate) most of the NHLPA didn't realize it was going to get put on the table. Yeah, I know - some people swore then (and probably still do) that it was a PR ploy, nothing more ... but the owners happily accepted it, knowing that they had been given a major bargaining chip unprompted, and began asking for more knowing that Goodenow had backed the players into a corner with that move.

    Even if you want to say it was a PR stunt, you never make a major concession when trying that tactic because it will always be accepted and considered a sign of weakness from your position ... and nothing good from your POV can come as a result. It wasn't necessarily incompetence, but it was certainly piss-poor negotiating on his behalf.
     
  13. Ziggy Stardust

    Ziggy Stardust Master Debater

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    Goodenow wouldn't move from his philosophical stance because he felt that the owners would cave in and buckle just as they did in '94. That is where he failed his union.

    He underestimated the will of the executives this time around and that was the start of his downfall. He dug a hole that the PA couldn't crawl out of, they were left to pretty much submit many concessions in favor of the owners.

    Now look at the aftermath, aside from the instability of the PA, the owners are still spending and the cap hasn't negatively affected the wages of the players.

    Now if Saskin is found guilty for illegally monitoring/altering messages, what is to happen if he is removed or voluntarily decides to step down? Are they going to go back to Goodenow? That seems unlikely to happen. Will they turn to a former player, perhaps Bobby Orr?
     
  14. Wetcoaster

    Wetcoaster Guest

    Goodenow was very clear with all the players that in the event of a lockout the players would have to be prepared to be out for up to 2 years if they wanted to prevail. He stated clearly that it would be the prospect of second lost season that would bring pressure to bear on the owners.

    He spent alot of time pre-lockout travelling from team to team encouraging players to get their finances in order so that they would be able to survive that long a period of time.

    His mistake was believing that he had a majority of the players on the same page.
     
  15. jamiebez

    jamiebez Registered User

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    Good idea.

    Either Allan Maki or David Shoalts suggested Steve Larmer in this morning's Globe and Mail. He'd be another good choice.
     
  16. GSC2k2*

    GSC2k2* Guest

    I think Anton Thun and/or Rich Winter have other ideas, IMO.
     
  17. Wetcoaster

    Wetcoaster Guest

    Last week appearing on Toronto’s the Fan 590, Kypreos suggested by the time the dust clears on Block’s investigation of Saskin the truth that will be revealed will imply the actions of Ted Saskin are so bad they will make the days Allan Eagleson was in charge of the NHLPA seem like a walk in the park.
     
  18. GSC2k2*

    GSC2k2* Guest

    THe two years was a public stance. It is common knowledge that Goodenow had privately confirmed to the players that it would never ever ever take two years. Wettie is spouting a myth. None of the players signed on to the two year idea because they had been assured it would never come to that.

    As someone who does deals for a living, I can feel confident stating that Goodenow's performance was complete amateur hour. IMO.
     
  19. Wetcoaster

    Wetcoaster Guest

    No myth. It has been widely reported. He briefed palyers and agents.

    You are engaging in revisionist history.
     
  20. Irish Blues

    Irish Blues Still on hiatus

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    The players kicked in money to build a war chest to keep them going for 2 years. Yes, Goodenow had told them getting their deal wouldn't take 2 years - but the fund they established was designed to last 2 years.
     
  21. GSC2k2*

    GSC2k2* Guest

    No, you are. That is your MO.

    My views were proven right by the lockout. Why would I need to engage in revisionist history? You, on the other hand ...
     
    Last edited by moderator : Mar 9, 2007
  22. Ziggy Stardust

    Ziggy Stardust Master Debater

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    I think Orr's experiences as an agent (and his past with Eagleson in particular) might make him a strong candidate. He has the respect of everyone in the hockey world. Not sure if he is a shrewd dealer, but I think during these times, the PA is looking to earn some respectability and leadership which Bobby Orr can provide. They should also look into staffing some PR. They have been hit hard and shredded apart by the media since the lockout.
     
  23. itshomerdoh

    itshomerdoh Registered User

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    This is a mess, and I don't really trust anyone. Goodenow seems like a great guy, just based on the fact that he's wasted more than a second defending his friend David Frost, not to mention his handling of the lockout. I don't know much about Saskin, but he seems like a weasel too. It'll be hard for the truth to come out on what's going on here, as most in the game seem to be 'Goodenow guys' or 'Saskin guys'. Funny Sportsnet just ran a story about it, then had Kypreos and Watters ripping Saskin afterwards. At the end Watters admits Saskin sued him about something before, and Kypreos says something about his buddy Steve Larmer (who quit the PA over the whole Goodenow/Saskin thing), yeah real objective guys. Can I get a national forum to rip my enemies too?

    They need to nuke the PA and start over, but I'm sure they'll just throw out Saskin and put some Goodenow crony in his place.
     
  24. Wetcoaster

    Wetcoaster Guest

    Goodenow gave interviews and there were published reports that he clearly told the players to be prepared for two years.

    If you have asource that says otherwise please direct me to it because everything I have seen was two years.
     
  25. Wetcoaster

    Wetcoaster Guest

    Maybe Steve Larmer was right......

    “This organization has taken a giant step backwards, back to the days of Eagleson where a select few made decisions for the group.†— taken from a letter Larmer put out after his resignation from the NHLPA in November 2005.
     

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