Message sent to Season Ticket Holders from Kevin Lowe

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The Rage

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Obviously because Lowe couldn't land such players in the deal he wanted for Pronger. Lowe was looking for a young and promising Defenceman and a goal-scorer. His best return in his mind was what he got in Smid and Lupul.

It's pretty easy to say stuff like "why didn't Lowe get Luongo, Hossa or Heatley for Pronger" or "why didn't Lowe get so-and-so for Smyth." Trades in the NHL are not as easy as you think.

I'm sorry, but when you an asset that won a Hart trophy, dominated the playoffs from start to finish, and is signed for four years for 2 million dollars a year under market value (if Chara is 7.5, then Pronger is atleast 8), you have options. You don't think Florida would have taken Pronger over Bertuzzi? You don't think there was ONE team ready to give up somehing big for one of the best and most underpaid players in the NHL?

Why some of you people think it's so easy to land these all-star NHL players all the time is quite shocking.

Losing them seems easy enough.

The Pronger and Smyth trades are all part of Lowe's plan apparently. Let's hope it works out for the best, soon.

Some plan.

Lowe's willing to spend the money on the right players.

Didn't happen last year, and now look where we are.
 

gr8haluschak

Registered User
Jul 25, 2004
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Forgive me if you've already addressed this but do you really feel that Pronger would have garnered one of Luongo, HOssa, Heatly or Havlat? Luongo is a possibility but I don't think the others would be a good fit for their respective teams. Honestly, I thought the return we got for pronger was pretty decent.

no he never addressed how we could get one of those guys because he is one of those people that think because they made a trade in NHL 07 Lowe should be able to do the same.
 

barrel_master

Amber Heard
Dec 15, 2004
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Yeah, let's rebuild instead, and it'll take us another 15 years to lose in the Stanely Cup Finals. Lowe kept saying we were building for the post-CBA era, and now that we're there, we are rebuilding again? Somebody messed up, and you can't blame it all on Pronger. He didn't trade himself for scrubs.

Did he say we where building for the post CBA era? I recall that he said he was building the team to make it to the CBA but I don't remeber him saying that he was specificly building the team to win a cup imediately after the new CBA was ratified.
 

Hemsky is a gangsta

Hemsky is a gangsta
Jun 23, 2004
2,485
53
the Oilers have to do something this summer like they did in 2005. if next year is a rebuilding year alot of people will give up on the team
 

alanschu

Registered User
Aug 12, 2005
8,659
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Edmonton, Alberta
Forgive me if you've already addressed this but do you really feel that Pronger would have garnered one of Luongo, HOssa, Heatly or Havlat? Luongo is a possibility but I don't think the others would be a good fit for their respective teams. Honestly, I thought the return we got for pronger was pretty decent.

Not only that, but were Hossa and Heatley even available?
 

The Rage

Registered User
WOW and I though you had to have a clue to be a mod but I am wrong. I laugh at why did we not get so and so and I am so sick of posting the link on who was available and who was in the running I am not even wasting my time because it is clear that people here ignore facts. While we are at it why did we not get Crosby or Ovechkin ? As well could you tell me how offering 7 mill to get Chara was not spending money ?

You can offer as much you want. If you don't actually get the guy, you're not spending the money. It's not like Chara was the only guy out there.
 

gr8haluschak

Registered User
Jul 25, 2004
3,269
113
I'm sorry, but when you an asset that won a Hart trophy, dominated the playoffs from start to finish, and is signed for four years for 2 million dollars a year under market value (if Chara is 7.5, then Pronger is atleast 8), you have options. You don't think Florida would have taken Pronger over Bertuzzi? You don't think there was ONE team ready to give up somehing big for one of the best and most underpaid players in the NHL?
.

DO us all a fabor and read this

http://fantasyhockey.usatoday.com/content/player_news.asp?sport=NHL&id=309&line=37672

tell us who is giving up what we wanted.
 

barrel_master

Amber Heard
Dec 15, 2004
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the Oilers have to do something this summer like they did in 2005. if next year is a rebuilding year alot of people will give up on the team

I don't know if this means anything, or if it's important or not. I just feel that I have to say this. I won't give up on this team, esp. if I can see something coming in the long term.
 

gr8haluschak

Registered User
Jul 25, 2004
3,269
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You can offer as much you want. If you don't actually get the guy, you're not spending the money. It's not like Chara was the only guy out there.

good thing you are not a GM because this team would be so screwed it would not be funny. Yes it was Lowes fault that Chara did not sign here and took 250k more, added to that is that a smart use of money no it is not. As well can you tell us who the hell else was available ? Seems that Redden and Lidsrtom we already signed but obviously facts like that don't matter to you, oh I know Jay Mckee right, because after all that contract worked out so well.
 

The Rage

Registered User
DO us all a fabor and read this

http://fantasyhockey.usatoday.com/content/player_news.asp?sport=NHL&id=309&line=37672

tell us who is giving up what we wanted.

A fantasy sports page? That's your mighty factual argument to slam me over the head with? C'mon. It's Chris Pronger. Better than Chara, as good as Lindstrom. In other words, a 7.5 to 8 million guy signed for four years at 6 million. In a cap world, people would kill to have an asset like that, an underpaid superstar. And again, even if you were going to simply dump his salary, there were many, many other places to spend the surplus.
 

barrel_master

Amber Heard
Dec 15, 2004
2,922
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Win a cup? How about make the playoffs?

Fine, to be honest the cup point doesn't matter. My main point is that I don't recall the org saying they where rebuilding specificly for post CBA sucess.

I do recall Guy, on the pipeline show, saying something about how lowe expected the team "competing" post CBA but I've never heard or read any specific points about when we'd compete.

Fair enough, you may think that these moves are counter to a team that is building towards cup dreams but I don't feel that way. I think the deals have been good and that we are headed into the right direction.
 

Soundwave

Registered User
Mar 1, 2007
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I would take Luongo over Heatly, Havlat, or any of those guys mentioned.
 

Towmater14

Registered User
Sep 17, 2005
3,870
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OIL COUNTRY
I have 4 sets of seasons tickets and personally if the Oilers would have resigned Smyth for what he wanted, I would have reconsidered tickets for next year. JMO I am actually kind of excited about next year.....unless of course they make no changes.
 

The Rage

Registered User
good thing you are not a GM because this team would be so screwed it would not be funny. Yes it was Lowes fault that Chara did not sign here and took 250k more, added to that is that a smart use of money no it is not.
Never said Chara was a good signing. I said that just offering him money is not the same as spending it.

As well can you tell us who the hell else was available ? Seems that Redden and Lidsrtom we already signed but obviously facts like that don't matter to you, oh I know Jay Mckee right, because after all that contract worked out so well.

If you can tell me where I said sign McKee, let me know. Luongo was available; Havlat was available. You think Florida would prefer Bertuzzi to Pronger? You think Ottawa would rather have Redden than Pronger? You think there was not one team that would have given up a serious talent to land Pronger, to trade a player they wouldn't have normally traded?
 
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McGoMcD

Registered User
Aug 14, 2005
15,688
668
Edmonton, AB
Yeah, let's rebuild instead, and it'll take us another 15 years to lose in the Stanely Cup Finals. Lowe kept saying we were building for the post-CBA era, and now that we're there, we are rebuilding again? Somebody messed up, and you can't blame it all on Pronger. He didn't trade himself for scrubs.

Well I do blame pronger. K lowe's hands were tied, the way the market was, no team wanted to swap locked up super star for locked up super star, there wasn't, as there almost always is, a marked for that. The market was to team making a run for the cup, they would be willing to part with young talent. Anahim offred the most, it doens' t matter how good a GM you are, you can't predict that Lupul would be a dud.

With pronger we had the super star we needed to get into the playoffs. Despite some might say this team this year wasn't as far from competing as you would think. WE had a lot of injuries, and some bad breaks. Add pronger we are in the playoffs, then Lowe makes a trade at the deadline, and suddenly we are like last year, ready to make a run. Pronger was the domino that got it all going, you will look at me like I am illogical, and just want to hate CFP, the truth is I don't, the fact remains he had a huge influence on the team this year.
 

alanschu

Registered User
Aug 12, 2005
8,659
914
Edmonton, Alberta
In a cap world, people would kill to have an asset like that,

Then those GMs would have been on the phone calling Kevin themselves, and we would have heard more rumours of suspected trade proposals.

Pronger also came with question marks. There were rumours he had a list of teams that he'd accept being traded to, and you can't just say "Pfft, he didn't have a no trade clause." Look at the Jake Plummer situation in the NFL. Trade rumours popped up, and he stated an intention of retiring should he be traded, so his value plummetted. Turns out it was for good reason, since upon being traded to Tampa Bay, he retired shortly afterwards.

Didn't the same thing happen with Doug Weight? He wasn't under contract, but he told the Oilers he'd only accept a trade to a legitimate contender. I'm pretty sure, as an RFA, he wasn't even allowed to have a NTC in his contract, but he was still able to pick a spot where he wanted to go.

Do you trade a player that's been a royal pain in the ass about his intentions to sign (Luongo) for a player that has recently become a royal pain in the ass and seems intent on not honouring the final 4 years of his contract, and perhaps doesn't want to play in Flordia either?
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
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Hiking
A fantasy sports page? That's your mighty factual argument to slam me over the head with? C'mon. It's Chris Pronger. Better than Chara, as good as Lindstrom. In other words, a 7.5 to 8 million guy signed for four years at 6 million. In a cap world, people would kill to have an asset like that, an underpaid superstar. And again, even if you were going to simply dump his salary, there were many, many other places to spend the surplus.
Yep. Great player. Great contract. Long contract. Cap world.

I would think maximum value represented there. Pronger was THE top asset in the league immediately available there. This represented leverage for other teams to rethink much of their position on *availability* of their assets.

It doesn't appear bargaining went anywhere beyond what teams were immediately willing to give up.
 

hemmingway

Registered User
Aug 6, 2006
471
0
Yeah, let's rebuild instead, and it'll take us another 15 years to lose in the Stanely Cup Finals. Lowe kept saying we were building for the post-CBA era, and now that we're there, we are rebuilding again? Somebody messed up, and you can't blame it all on Pronger. He didn't trade himself for scrubs.

I tend not to spend my time looking for someone to blame.

Pronger was likely traded for 5 players - three of whom haven't even been picked yet.

Fact - They weren't a great team last year. Lucky, yes. Great, no.

Adding Luongo for Pronger would give us how many more wins than we had with Roloson? Five? It's not like goaltending is the real issue.

Trading Smyth for Hossa/Heatley/Havlat, etc. (if we could get them) would get us, what, 3 more wins?

Putting the team on pace for 8-10 more wins, or 16-20 more points over the course of a season. Good for around 95-105 points. Would this win Edmonton a cup? Perhaps, if they got lucky.

Then - while Edmonton's team just gets older - we could try and fill in the holes with UFA's - cause we all know that they're cheaper. Luongo at 7, Havlat at 7, what - a defenseman at 4? Yeah - not any closer to winning a cup - but at least they would make the playoffs.

At least some of the time.
 

The Rage

Registered User
read the sources you fool, you know it amazes me that some people ignore facts I mean what does the Miami Herald know right ? because you clearly know more and added to that the exact same thing was published in the Journal right after the trade as well TSN said the exact same thing about what we wanted from Toronto but yeah you are right it is bull. I am done wasting my time with a bozo that clearly refuses to acknowledge facts and reality.

Luongo was traded far before Salei was signed. You have no argument other than calling me a bozo.
 

grego

Registered User
Jan 12, 2005
2,390
97
Saskatchewan
It's an interesting game of chicken. I know my roommate and I were on the season ticket waiting list, and if they become available, there's a good chance we'll get them. If fans wait to hold back on renewals, they may lose their spot. As with most things, it's a gamble. If you wait, and Lowe makes fantastic moves in the offseason, then you are suddenly at the end of the season ticket waiting list, rather than getting preemptive access to things like playoff tickets and next year's season tickets.


I agree it is a gamble to give up your tickets and assume that it sends a message to the Oilers over the Ryan Smyth issue, and lack of Dman aquired for the year ( I think the dman should be the big issue if people had one )

As long as someone is on the list to take any ticket that is not renewed, the only loser is a fan, if the Oilers make a change and suddenly they can't get in to the games when things pick up.

With sports it could be next year that we move up quickly if they get a great dman and make a few changes or it could take a few more years. But to get to the top of a season ticket list, and most importantly to the sections that you want take time.
 

Gusher

Registered User
Jan 1, 2007
2,442
0
and about willing to spend the money on the right players.. to me ryan smyth was the right player.. you think about the oilers.. you think about ryan smyth.. to not spend on him is a huge marketing error.. a huge hockey error.. and a huge business error.. you lose fan support.. you lose jersey revenues.. you lose the ability to attract free agents.. you lose team identity and you lose any kind of chance of taking this team to respectibility any time soon..
while you were willing to spend 2 mil on oates.. 2 mil on dopita.. 4 mil on peca.. doesn't sound like spending the money on the right players to me..

Lowe didn't think Ryan Smyth was the right player. I have to agree with Lowe on this one. Yes, Smyth was a fan-favorite for a lot of Oilers fans, but not every fan. With Ryan Smyth here in his 12 years the Oilers got to the Cup Finals once, missed the playoffs all-together 3 or 4 years while he was here and they would have missed them this year even if he was still an Oiler. Is Smyth the only reason why the Oilers scrape by year after year? No. Could be be part of the reason? Yes.

If you lose fan support for one guy getting traded than the Oilers don't need those fans do they? The support should come from dedicated fans, fans who aren't just fans of one player on the Oilers but fans of the Oilers as a whole. The Smyth supporters can leave if they want, there will always be more Oilers fans next in line to support this club.

Smyth isn't the kind of player you build a franchise around. If you did you would have a bunch of players who play with heart but not much skill. You would have lots of pluggers. That doesn't win you championships or keep your team competitive year after year. People wonder why the Oilers struggle every year to make the Playoffs. Perhaps this new direction Lowe and Co. are willing to take will change that.
 

Gusher

Registered User
Jan 1, 2007
2,442
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I'm sorry, but when you an asset that won a Hart trophy, dominated the playoffs from start to finish, and is signed for four years for 2 million dollars a year under market value (if Chara is 7.5, then Pronger is atleast 8)

You are obviously forgetting the fact that the Oilers traded and signed Pronger 2 years ago at that $6million price tag. The salaries have gone up since then. The most anyone was making at the time of the Pronger trade was $7million. Way to try and use false info.
 
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