Message from Trevor Linden

[NHLFanSince2020]

http://www.nhlpa.com/Content/Feature.asp?contentId=3472

Non-apology not accepted, finger pointing m'er f'er.

 

[NJD Jester]

Extorted, you mean, from the paying public who pays the salaries through rapidly escalating tickets, and the owners who put up the money.

Oh, and before you fire up the old "Who would not accept the salaries" blah blah, I can tell you that when I am negotiating deals I often take less than I could, in order to accomplish certain other matters. Any halfway experienced dealmaker will do so.

Extorting? Operating within the system the owners gave them.

Are you saying that, for the good of the game, the players shouldn't have taken the money the owners were more than willing -- even with their financial hardship -- to give them?

 

[NJD Jester]

I don't blame the players for the financial state of the league. However I do blame them for the lockout which was about addressing that state. It took them a year to finally accept a solution that would work, most of which time they spent obstinately shouting solidarity from the rooftops and holding onto meaningless anachronistic ideals instead of working with what was the obvious solution.

That's if you think the cap is an obvious solution, which the PA did not.

 

[Crazy_Ike]

That's if you think the cap is an obvious solution, which the PA did not.

If the PA could have pointed to any other sports league as an example of what the NHL should aim for without a cap, maybe that position wouldn't have been as laughable as it turned out to be.

The NHL had no problems with the reverse, however.

 

[Seachd]

You want to talk about the lockout let's talk about the lockout. The owners are the only one responsible. Not the players. If the owners are to stupid the managed their team and make money without a cap how is that the players fault? Brian Burke said it the best when he said I had a cap fot the last five years in Vancouver is called a budget.

And that's last time I am talking lockout. I've been talking lockout for the last 10 months and I am sick of it.

Do you really believe any of what you just said? You weren't paying very close attention to the whole lockout situation then.

 

[AM]

Ci

Give the guy a break. The lockout is over, it's senseless to put blame as both sides were equally responsible for the lockout . You know what? It's over now, let's all move on.

isnt the one putting blame on anyone.

It's Linden. After reading the letter its obvious why the season was lost.

 

[nyr7andcounting]

If the PA could have pointed to any other sports league as an example of what the NHL should aim for without a cap, maybe that position wouldn't have been as laughable as it turned out to be.

The NHL had no problems with the reverse, however.

Huh? Sure they did. The bottom line is none of the major, or minor, sports are like the NHL is. The other sports all have different kinds of owners, players, fans and in soccer's case, competition outside the US.

In fact, the only league with individual ownerships who all opperate under the same restrictive cap, like the NHL was looking for, is the NFL...a league whose success has been built on extensive revenue sharing for years...something the owners wanted no part of and managed to keep to a minimum in any deal they proposed. (If you saw the press conference, Bettman STILL doesn't want to talk about revenue sharing)

Anyway, there's no comparison to other leagues here. The NHL and NFL are not similar in any way other than that they both play from October-February.

 

[Hoss]

Well, I must say, the letter is an improvement over a previous comment by Linden, who said if fans can't afford tickets, then "they can just take their kids to the park, instead."

'Cause the league is so successful you can afford to be flippant....

Imagine that, promoting spending time with your family. When ticket prices come down in Vancouver by 24% let me know.

 

[Timmy]

Imagine that, promoting spending time with your family. When ticket prices come down in Vancouver by 24% let me know.

In Vancouver, at least, ticket prices are supply and demand, regardless of what players' salaries were. As long as the Garage keeps selling out, owners have little incentive to lower ticket prices. If nobody bought beer at the game, how long do you figure the owners would take to reduce prices to the point where people actually started buying beer again?

Linden could have pointed that out, rather than implying that just because you got to go see games as a kid doesn't mean yours will, so don't question what a player makes.

It was a Pejorative Slured comment, and he could've handled the question with more class.



And as a Canadian, since when is watching hockey with your son and/or daughter not considered quality family time, like American football on Thanksgiving?

 

[nyrmessier011]

And yet, Linden still could not bring himself to apologize for his union's part in the cancellation of the season.

waaaahhhhhhhhhhh

 

[Icey]

There was a full page APOLOGY in today's Dallas Morning News. It read:

We're Sorry.
From now on, we'll keep the fight where it belongs.
On the ice.
And we'll prove it with lower ticket prices
and exciting fan perks all season long.
All of us at The Dallas Stars want to sincerely apologize to you, our fans.
While the league and the players' union were fighting, you were the ones who had to sit in the penalty box. But we're ready to make it up to you with lower prices, a faster-than-ever game and a better all-around hockey experience.
So get ready for hockey. And remember, the best part of fighting is making up!

That's what every team should be doing. Say what you want about the Stars and Tom Hicks, but in the end they are a classy team.

BTW - I hope it was okay to post the entire ad, but since it was an ad and not an article/story, I thought it would be okay.

 

[mr gib]

There was a full page APOLOGY in today's Dallas Morning News. It read:

We're Sorry.
From now on, we'll keep the fight where it belongs.
On the ice.
And we'll prove it with lower ticket prices
and exciting fan perks all season long.
All of us at The Dallas Stars want to sincerely apologize to you, our fans.
While the league and the players' union were fighting, you were the ones who had to sit in the penalty box. But we're ready to make it up to you with lower prices, a faster-than-ever game and a better all-around hockey experience.
So get ready for hockey. And remember, the best part of fighting is making up!

That's what every team should be doing. Say what you want about the Stars and Tom Hicks, but in the end they are a classy team.

BTW - I hope it was okay to post the entire ad, but since it was an ad and not an article/story, I thought it would be okay.

i wish we had those ticket prices here in vancouver - 10 to 35 bux - man thats sweet

 

[Icey]

The $10 seat suck. I know why they are doing it, but seriously they are center ice at the top. The $35 seats aren't bad. They are putting their money where their mouth was. I appreciate that as a fan. They kept their word.

 

[SJeasy]

The statement takes into account the feelings of the players who have been in an adversarial relationship versus the owners for decades. It is better to let these feelings die quietly than antagonize the group that we expect to perform at peak levels. Bettman knew that the players were going to have a hard time shifting gears.

The PA leadership, the league and the individual teams should go very lightly with any public statements. There are a couple of individual teams (Chicago, Boston)heading the list that may suffer this season because of the team's public stance in the lockout regardless of the quality players they have on the ice.

 

[GSC2k2*]

You want to talk about the lockout let's talk about the lockout. The owners are the only one responsible. Not the players. If the owners are to stupid the managed their team and make money without a cap how is that the players fault? Brian Burke said it the best when he said I had a cap fot the last five years in Vancouver is called a budget.

And that's last time I am talking lockout. I've been talking lockout for the last 10 months and I am sick of it.

Last time you are talking lockout?

Good.

Now if we can just find out a way for this to work for you on all other topics ...

 

[mr gib]

The $10 seat suck. I know why they are doing it, but seriously they are center ice at the top. The $35 seats aren't bad. They are putting their money where their mouth was. I appreciate that as a fan. They kept their word.

that is pretty cool - for the first time i'm gonna get a cable package -

 

[RLC]

Ok, so saying that it was an owner lockout and it them that done it not us. We the NHLPA were willing all along to continue play ( of course under the old cba and have the NHL lose money every year, after all it was not our money being lost and it was not the fans money either )

Ok, if all player contracts had a clause that if the league lost money the players had to chip in, just how fast the NHLPA would have gone on strike so the players stop loseing money.

The players had a great CBA for themselves, when the league started to actualy lose money the NHL wanted to open up the CBA the players said no way. IF the players are now claiming that "for the good of the game we made tons of consessions for the fans" then, then using the exactly same logic why the players did not refuse all that money in order to have the league NOT lose money to start with.

The health of the league was of no concern to the players. Maximizing there old CBA advantage was.
Even when the league wanted to show the books the NHLPA refused.

We all spent a year without hockey because the NHLPA wanted to continue as much as possible to mearly tweek the old cba and give up the least as possible. ( remember that great 50 million cap but with a few consession on the NHL side.) or was that 52 million !

 

[Crows*]

Linden is simply amazing!

The silver Lining of the 9-2 loss and bert's hit was him getting the all time record, what an amazing moment to witness. AS soon as "tre" came from JOhn ashbridge the entire arena was giving him a standing ovation. Spine tingling I tell ya!

 

[Renholder]

Well, see, a lot of people DON'T think "both sides were equally to blame". some people want to see players own up to their responsibility. It STILL has not happened.

You, however, have the option to avoid the "Business of Hockey" portion of the HF Board.

I don't need anyone giving me advice for what I can and cannot do, or say in a message board. I'm fully conscious that you don't need to share my opinion. What I don't understand is why you had to go on making fun of me infront everyone like that? Are you implying that i'm a simpleton hockey fan that cannot discuss any business or lockout related issues regarding something we have all been involved in one way or another throughout the past year? I also noticed you attacked another hockey fan that didn't share your opinion on this issue and you replied to him in a similar , rude manner. That's not cool man, we can all act like civilised adults and treat each other with respect. It's all I ask for. I'm not trying to provoke you. I'm just trying to understand.I happen to enjoy the business section of this site. It is the place I frequent the most, but what I dont' need is people who think they are morally superior to everyone who doesn't share their opinion on a matter that shouldn't concearn us anymore. Nothing personal, unless you want to make it personal which is something I don't want.

I"m all for arguing on things that might have gone differently in this lockout. Although, I still stick to my opnion that the blame should be put on both sides I have to concede that neither sides have been very tactfull during negotiations and they have been less than stellar in how they treated their fans during this whole ordeal. You got to give credit where it's due, these hard headed individuals are atleast trying to mend the wounds they have instilled upon us. It will take time for the whole story to come out.

 

[ginner classic]

Well as usual, it seems the children step to the fore again and show their lack of class.

Ripping Trevor Linden. Brilliant.

I am sorry if the lament of the hard-done-by fan does not play with me anymore. Perhaps it should. I mean without the fans Trevor Linden would not be a good draw at the Children's Hospital in Vancouver. And without the fans hard spent cash, Canuck Place would not be built. All those charity golf games...never happen without the fans putting these players on a pedestal. These players clearly owe us. They owe us an apology for making us spend time with family. For making us spend money on vacations instead of beer in bars. Really it's not fair that they make more than the average per capita wage...it's just a game after all. And we should be allowed to see them play, and bring each of our respective families. I mean, watching hockey is a right.

You small minded fools. Is this the way you see the world? What have you done in your lives that equates to the efforts one of the true ambassadors of sport in his community? How much time do you spend with the less fortunate? How much money did you raise for charities last year? You think hockey is a right...it's freaking entertainment, and it is a business. Stop painting the world in your rose coloured naiviety. You think you have been hard done by? Get a grip.

 

[bling]

Evidently, 90% of fans, 87% of players, and 100% of the owners don't agree with you, ...

....and just because a majority of red neck christian evangelists and greedy coporate shills did not agree with me and re-elected George Bush does not make it a good decision ...

 

[Renholder]

....and just because a majority of red neck christian evangelists and greedy coporate shills did not agree with me and re-elected George Bush does not make it a good decision ...

hahah, Dude you might have opened a whole new can of beens. Wait, that's not how it goes does it?

 

[GSC2k2*]

I don't need anyone giving me advice for what I can and cannot do, or say in a message board. I'm fully conscious that you don't need to share my opinion. What I don't understand is why you had to go on making fun of me infront everyone like that? Are you implying that i'm a simpleton hockey fan that cannot discuss any business or lockout related issues regarding something we have all been involved in one way or another throughout the past year? I also noticed you attacked another hockey fan that didn't share your opinion on this issue and you replied to him in a similar , rude manner. That's not cool man, we can all act like civilised adults and treat each other with respect. It's all I ask for. I'm not trying to provoke you. I'm just trying to understand.I happen to enjoy the business section of this site. It is the place I frequent the most, but what I dont' need is people who think they are morally superior to everyone who doesn't share their opinion on a matter that shouldn't concearn us anymore. Nothing personal, unless you want to make it personal which is something I don't want.

I"m all for arguing on things that might have gone differently in this lockout. Although, I still stick to my opnion that the blame should be put on both sides I have to concede that neither sides have been very tactfull during negotiations and they have been less than stellar in how they treated their fans during this whole ordeal. You got to give credit where it's due, these hard headed individuals are atleast trying to mend the wounds they have instilled upon us. It will take time for the whole story to come out.

Yeesh!

I am implying nothing of the kind. Nor do I see my original post as "making fun of you".

I tok your original post as an attempt to stifle what some people still consider to be a valid topic to debate. I am not for that. If that was not your intent, that is a good thing and you could ignore my original post.

To me, anyone who wishes to stifle such a debate does not have the right to do so, since that is the reason of the board in the first place, I assume. Right now, there are a number of pro-PA apologists (not knowing whether you are or not, as you name is unfamiliar to me) who want to stymie the discussion in view of the way things have turned out (that is, not like they expected at all). If someone has taken a postion throughout the lockout, they should be able to have their views held up for scrutiny once all is said and done.

Again, if such was not your intent, I have no issue.

 

[canuckerfan]

....and just because a majority of red neck christian evangelists and greedy coporate shills did not agree with me and re-elected George Bush does not make it a good decision ...

 

[Renholder]

Well maybe I owe you an apology then. I probably overreacted somewhat. I dont' think I need to awnser your questions but I'll do them anyways. I'm not a pro-pa Apologist. I'm not even pro-owner groupie .I hate taking sides because you have to explain and defend all the stupid mistakes that side makes. I am ready to explain my opinions further if that's what you ask me.

The reason you're not familiar with my name is because I don't post much on this board because I don't think my opinion will be very well received or even necessary to advance the ongoing discussions. I"m very moderate, neutral and passive. I have been lurking around these boards for a long time but I only decided to join here when I thought the lockout was about to end. I was right. I look at the broader picture and all I'm worried about now is how this whole mess will affect the whole industry and its fans.

Again, I wasn't trying to start a fight, thanks for understanding.