Doesn't ****ing matter. You hit my MVP, I'm hitting the 1st guy that comes to the plate. End of discussion.
Blue Jays Discussion: Meaningful Baseball Continues
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Doesn't ****ing matter. You hit my MVP, I'm hitting the 1st guy that comes to the plate. End of discussion.
The Yankees don't like the Jays allegedly celebrating a little too much. Oh, and the Rangers didn't like a bat flip at the most pivotal moment of the season last year (while they have a player who loves take out slides and actually socked one of our guys in the face). Meanwhile you have the Royals head-hunting constantly, and Jung-Ho Kang using a fake tag that resulted in an injury to Bryce Harper. Forgive me if I don't buy the agenda you're pushing of the Jays being a menace.
absolutely agreed. Being HBP comes with the territory though. Even if its unintentional. When you crowd the plate, sometimes you get hit when they pitch you in. Sometimes the ball gets away. It happens.
Rizzo gets hit a ton because he crowds the plate, he is on Josh Donaldsons level, I don't see the cubs retaliating when he gets hit unintentionally. It happens to every single teams good players. Retaliating for a nothing play and having key guys get hurt is the dumbest thing you can do. Stand up for your guys, no question, I would do the same thing, if it was warranted, but it wasn't.
Leaftors
Registered User
I've been a baseball fan since I was brought to my first game when I was 8, in 2002. You having a different opinion than me is perfectly fine, however your claiming to have not only factual proof based on your own assumptions, but some sort of greater knowledge as well. Which is where I'm not agreeing.
Jung Ho had his leg broken from a slide that ended his season, that mirrored what Jose did, which is why he got punched in the face. It wasn't because of the flip, it was the slide. You look at posts in here advocating beaning guys on purpose but when it happens to you, you freak out. I know that is sports but its okay to look at both sides of the story, fan or not.
I'm not defending Ventura, he is a donkey too. I have no problem with teams retaliating for legitimate HBP that were done on purpose. This wasn't one of them. The bottom line is, this hurts your team more than it brings it together. With both the optics from other teams around the league, and the injuries that happened to the guys in the pen.
I never said I had greater knowledge. All I said was its easy to tell, from the situation and watching the play, that it wasn't intentional. It barely grazed his elbow. How is that intentional? It wasn't.
Eyedea
The Legend Continues
Cubs, Pirates, and Cards have routinely been among the leaders in HBPs. I don't know how much of them are unintentional, but I know in the Pirates/Cards cases they will retaliate.
You know Coghlan slid way out of the base path and made knee-on-knee contact with Kang, right? And that Bautista went straight at the base and kept his legs/feet down?
Yeah, I do know that. Legs and feet down don't matter. You can still break someones legs by starting to slide a few feet from the bag at full speed. Knees only bend one way.
Jose's spikes were down on that slide, there was little chance of injury. If you think the punch was for the slide, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. Furthermore, look at Odor's history and he has done worse slides himself.
Again, you have no way of knowing if this HBP was intentional or not. The players on the field thought it was, and if we're making a call either way based on appeal to authority, their "expert" opinion holds much more water than yours. And every other team in the league would have reacted the same way. So "optics of other teams around the league" is laughable. There were several brawls around the league apart from this one this week alone. Unfortunately, the 1% thing happened and there was an injury.
Diamond Joe Quimby
A$AP Joffrey
Amazing that an entire 25 man roster would somehow take offense to such a thing that was blatantly obvious to be an unintentional act.
Please, tell me more, Michael Kay.
Eyedea
The Legend Continues
Yeah if you think it's easy to tell that JD's HBP was unintentional then you should probably find it easy to figure out that the slide wasn't the primary reason for the punch. We all know the animosity was still there (hence why Bautista was even on base to begin with).
I'm a big fan of the Jays retaliating. If it's intentional, of course, it is warranted. Good teams always have some toughness to them.
I don't believe they hit him intentionally.
I do believe they intended to throw aggressively up and in to try to back him off the plate and were willing to hit him with the pitch. Once you decide to intentionally throw near someone, there's a very fine line between that and intentionally hitting him.
I do believe they intended to throw aggressively up and in to try to back him off the plate and were willing to hit him with the pitch. Once you decide to intentionally throw near someone, there's a very fine line between that and intentionally hitting him.
Injuries in brawls are set at 1 percent?
I guarantee if you ask any baseball fan that is a non jays fan whose fault this was, they side with the Yankees here every single time. If he was told to intentionally hit Donaldson he sure made it look like he didn't mean to. It barely grazed him, on his pad. But it was intentional? The evolution of a brawl, when it actually happens, is to defend your team mates regardless of it being right or wrong. You think the royals want to defend Ventura all the time for being an idiot? Probably not, but they do it because that's what team mates do. So it doesn't matter how they all felt about it, they rushed in to protect their guys.
And no, every other team would not have. It was a nothing play. Like I said earlier, I'm all for defending your guys. You have to. But doing so in this situation is no Bueno.
Yes I agree with that. You are allowed to throw aggressively inside to brush him off the plate. It just so happens he came too far inside, by accident. I honestly cant believe most people think it was on purpose.
If Jose didn't slide like that he wouldn't have got punched in the face. Pretty simple concept. The animosity was there sure. Reason he got beaned was for the flip. He got punched in the face for the slide.
Diamond Joe Quimby
A$AP Joffrey
He got punched in the face because the Rangers second baseman is a psychopath with a history of violence.
I don't think he came too far inside by accident, though. I think he wanted to make Donaldson move and he just didn't get out of the way quickly enough.
So if you are standing in a stationary position and I'm running at you full tilt and slide at your legs with my feet down and legs down, I have zero chance to hurt you? Your legs wouldn't buckle and your knees wouldn't bend the way the good Lord didn't intend for them to go? Good to know.
Yeah, if that's literally any other 2B in baseball, nothing happens. Maybe a bit of shouting.
Leaftors
Registered User
Of course it is, I was clearly citing a scientific fact there...but of the tens of brawls per year, how many injuries have we seen? And major ones like this? I guarantee you the number is pretty close to 1%.
Your second paragraph directly contradicts your first paragraph. Every other team would have done it, because every other team defends their teammates when they think one has intentionally been hit. And the Jays probably did (of course I can't say for certain it was intentional, I'm not foolish enough to think I can make a factual statement for something I wasn't involved in personally), or else why didn't they retaliate or clear the benches when Donaldson was hit the other 7 times this year?
I think you meant Bush hahah. Yeah Odor does stupid things. But the punch was deserved. Jose had it coming for awhile. He is not innocent in what led up to everything that happened. Texas isn't either. If nothing else it will be a fun series to watch if it happens, and that's what baseball is all about.
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