Player Discussion McDavid Trade Value

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MaxR11

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Mar 28, 2017
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A realistic discussion about an absurd hypothetical. OK sure.



LMAO wut



I'm as pessimistic as anyone and a three-four year rebuild is preposterous to me. I don't think they turn it around completely next year but they should be in a better spot in about two years time with further cap increases. Dump a couple of bad deals (Lucic and Russell) and there's a lot more room to work with. Plus you'll have McDavid and Drai hitting their primes at that point. The GM just has to stop losing trades and rewarding character veterans with overstuffed deals.



He hasn't even played a single game under his new deal; perhaps you can see why people would think this discussion is grossly premature.

Is it just Edmonton fans that think players will bail at the first sign of adversity? Is this PTSD from Pronger?

Stamkos made the playoffs once in his first five years. Same with Tavares. Taylor Hall was part of a losing team here and was gutted to leave. If anything, most hockey players, especially stars, are loyal to a fault. So what's the point of even speculating?

It better not be another 3-4 yr rebuild. Hopefully this year was a bit of a stall and that the team not only adds a little bit in the offseason and gets everyone playing a lot better and more consistent as a team. Fortunately, I believe, intangibles can really make a team a lot better because it'll be hard to improve the talent on this team very much unless guys like yamamoto or pooly come out of nowhere and take an enormous step forward. We HOPE Drai learns to be a good dominant consistent player (on his own away from Connor) in the next year or two but we'll have to see. I'm not fully sold on him. Great talent when on his game but he's looked a bit of a shell of himself too often this year.
 

WaitingForUser

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It better not be another 3-4 yr rebuild. Hopefully this year was a bit of a stall and that the team not only adds a little bit in the offseason and gets everyone playing a lot better and more consistent as a team. Fortunately, I believe, intangibles can really make a team a lot better because it'll be hard to improve the talent on this team very much unless guys like yamamoto or pooly come out of nowhere and take an enormous step forward. We HOPE Drai learns to be a good dominant consistent player (on his own away from Connor) in the next year or two but we'll have to see. I'm not fully sold on him. Great talent when on his game but he's looked a bit of a shell of himself too often this year.

Drai is on pace for 70 points this year. He is over 50% on the draw and only has 2 pp points. Show me another 21 year old with that upside to his game. Everyone complained about Lucic scoring all his points on the PP last year. But all I hear this year is that Drai needs more PP points to make his contract worth it. So which is it? Do we only count PP points or EV? Can’t have it both ways.
 

WaitingForUser

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Drai is on pace for 70 points this year. He is over 50% on the draw and only has 2 pp points. Show me another 21 year old with that upside to his game. Everyone complained about Lucic scoring all his points on the PP last year. But all I hear this year is that Drai needs more PP points to make his contract worth it. So which is it? Do we only count PP points or EV? Can’t have it both ways.

Also of all the players to play with Mcdavid over the last two years only one guy has made him better. Can you guess who it is?
 

MaxR11

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Drai is on pace for 70 points this year. He is over 50% on the draw and only has 2 pp points. Show me another 21 year old with that upside to his game. Everyone complained about Lucic scoring all his points on the PP last year. But all I hear this year is that Drai needs more PP points to make his contract worth it. So which is it? Do we only count PP points or EV? Can’t have it both ways.

Can't get caught up in strictly points. I don't even bother looking at that for the most part. its great he's collecting points but it's also obvious he's been out of sorts this year and has been playing a lot of poor games or long stretches of games where he's poor. Cheating, poor puck decisions and passes, lack of effort etc. He's talented enough that he'll get his points but that's whole heck of a lot different than getting points AND playing well. He's seemingly had a lot of points where he just happened to have touched the puck on the scoring play and didn't really make the chance happen at all. one of those "nothing" assists. And probably a few gimme goals Connor set him up on. Basically I'm saying points can be deceiving. Heck even the organization has come out and said drai has not looked himself or essentially quite good. he hasn't been awful for the most part but I'd say not very good overall. he's definitely had games and stretches where he has looked quite awful though and nowhere near a 8.5 mil player.

I never said he didn't have great upside. I actually said he has the potentially to be a good and dominant player. maybe a poor man's malkin or maybe on a similar level. I'm just not sold on his consistency and his mental strength yet.
 

yababy

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Jun 26, 2015
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Your fallacy is: begging the question.



Ha ha good lord. If the Oilers are forced into trading McDavid, there's no way they get anything close to this or even fair value. A couple of decent roster players and a gaggle of picks and prospects seems most likely. Maybe you get one lesser "star" player in return, but beyond that...

There are some markets that need what the Oilers have...Sold out arena and a mediocre hockey team.
Think Florida Carolina Columbus etc
 

Laineux

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Aug 1, 2011
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Every team in the league would make space for McDavid if he was available. Every team.

Ridiculous bullshit narrative that his salary would hurt teams.
 
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Little Fury

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There are some markets that need what the Oilers have...Sold out arena and a mediocre hockey team.
Think Florida Carolina Columbus etc

Crap like Barkov and Ekblad isn't making the Oilers a better hockey team.

You can't win a cup without a superstar player unless you get incredibly lucky like Carolina did in 2006.
 
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rboomercat90

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Every team in the league would make space for McDavid if he was available. Every team.

Ridiculous bull**** narrative that his salary would hurt teams.
Of course every team would want him. He is a marketing golden ticket. Just ask the Oilers. Pretty much any team would trade for him if given the chance. Nobody is even saying his salary would hurt teams. What has been said though is that teams would have to clear $12.5 million in salary to get him. That would cost them their best players and put McDavid in exactly the same situation he’s in here. That’s why it’s highly unlikely he’s asking for a trade any time soon. It’s nobodys fault but your own that you and the op can’t understand this.
 
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Stoneman89

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Tavares is going to be making some big money next year. I guess the Islanders should move him because they're out of the playoffs now and he'll make too much.:laugh:
 

CycloneSweep

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Crap like Barkov and Ekblad isn't making the Oilers a better hockey team.

You can't win a cup without a superstar player unless you get incredibly lucky like Carolina did in 2006.
I wouldn't move McDavid but calling Barkov and Ekblad crap?
Barkov is a very good defensive center that has 40 points in 42 games. He is a positive player on a team that has a lot of negatives.
And Ekblad is a very good right shot defenseman.
Saying they aren't worth McDavid fine, but saying they are shit and wouldn't help us?
 

Stoneman89

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I wouldn't move McDavid but calling Barkov and Ekblad crap?
Barkov is a very good defensive center that has 40 points in 42 games. He is a positive player on a team that has a lot of negatives.
And Ekblad is a very good right shot defenseman.
Saying they aren't worth McDavid fine, but saying they are **** and wouldn't help us?


I think it is more to the idea that it is crap than the actual players.
 

sepHF

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Feb 12, 2010
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I wouldn't move McDavid but calling Barkov and Ekblad crap?
Barkov is a very good defensive center that has 40 points in 42 games. He is a positive player on a team that has a lot of negatives.
And Ekblad is a very good right shot defenseman.
Saying they aren't worth McDavid fine, but saying they are **** and wouldn't help us?

Barkov has been amazing this season, really starting to realize his potential
 

Little Fury

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I wouldn't move McDavid but calling Barkov and Ekblad crap?
Barkov is a very good defensive center that has 40 points in 42 games. He is a positive player on a team that has a lot of negatives.
And Ekblad is a very good right shot defenseman.
Saying they aren't worth McDavid fine, but saying they are **** and wouldn't help us?

They are crap compared to McDavid.

Barkov is a slightly younger RNH. Ekblad is good but he's injury prone.

And at the cost of 97 they certainly don't make the team much better. It's like a bigger, worse version of the Hall trade, swapping out talent for a perceived need and that kind of deal never works out in the favour of the team giving the best player away.
 

CycloneSweep

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They are crap compared to McDavid.

Barkov is a slightly younger RNH. Ekblad is good but he's injury prone.

And at the cost of 97 they certainly don't make the team much better. It's like a bigger, worse version of the Hall trade, swapping out talent for a perceived need and that kind of deal never works out in the favour of the team giving the best player away.
Barkov is a slightly younger RNH? Wtf are you smoking?
Nuge has 296 points in 441 games 0.671 ppg (55 points average)
Barkov 211 points in 294 games and has a 0.717ppg (59 points average)
Barkov is also a better goal scorer and one of the best young defensive forwards.

I'm not saying its a good trade but calling Barkov a "slightly younger RNH" is insulting to Barkov. And I like Nuge.
 

Trafalgar Sadge Law

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McDavid's trade value is massive. However, Chiarelli is probably negotiating with Garth Snow right now to trade him for Matt Barzal.

Peter Chiarelli is the best Islanders GM since Bill Torrey.
 
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yababy

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Crap like Barkov and Ekblad isn't making the Oilers a better hockey team.

You can't win a cup without a superstar player unless you get incredibly lucky like Carolina did in 2006.

You don't need an Art Ross trophy winner to win a cup. Top 10 will do.
And Toews Kane Doughty are only superstars because the won cups. Otherwise they may as well be Sedin, Benn, Weber or Burns
 

yababy

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Jun 26, 2015
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I wouldn't move McDavid but calling Barkov and Ekblad crap?
Barkov is a very good defensive center that has 40 points in 42 games. He is a positive player on a team that has a lot of negatives.
And Ekblad is a very good right shot defenseman.
Saying they aren't worth McDavid fine, but saying they are **** and wouldn't help us?

You forgot the 1st round pick I proposed to come along with Barkov and Ekblad
 

McShogun99

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Of course every team would want him. He is a marketing golden ticket. Just ask the Oilers. Pretty much any team would trade for him if given the chance. Nobody is even saying his salary would hurt teams. What has been said though is that teams would have to clear $12.5 million in salary to get him. That would cost them their best players and put McDavid in exactly the same situation he’s in here. That’s why it’s highly unlikely he’s asking for a trade any time soon. It’s nobodys fault but your own that you and the op can’t understand this.

12.5 million is a bargain for owners compared to what he brings back in revenue. The only bad thing about his cap hit is the percentage it takes from the cap. I doubt any owner cares when he’s probably making a lot of profit from Mcdavid.
 

rboomercat90

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Mar 24, 2013
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12.5 million is a bargain for owners compared to what he brings back in revenue. The only bad thing about his cap hit is the percentage it takes from the cap. I doubt any owner cares when he’s probably making a lot of profit from Mcdavid.
I agree with this completely. I don’t think there’s any question almost any owner would jump at the chance to acquire McDavid. The problem is what adding that salary would do to his existing lineup. It’s a cap league now, it wasn’t when Lindros was traded. You can’t just stockpile talent anymore. Acquiring McDavid means giving up $12.5 million of good talent. He’d be playing on another team with a depleted lineup, just like here.

The op suggested McDavid will eventually ask to be traded because he doesn’t feel the Oilers will ever be good enough to win. My question is which team can he go to where his $12.5 million cap hit doesn’t put him in the exact situation he’s in now? I don’t see one. If his hypothetical issue is just winning then there’s no real benefit to him asking to go somewhere else. I think we can assume he’s okay with playing in Edmonton itself as he just signed an eight year extension six months ago.
 

MaxR11

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I agree with this completely. I don’t think there’s any question almost any owner would jump at the chance to acquire McDavid. The problem is what adding that salary would do to his existing lineup. It’s a cap league now, it wasn’t when Lindros was traded. You can’t just stockpile talent anymore. Acquiring McDavid means giving up $12.5 million of good talent. He’d be playing on another team with a depleted lineup, just like here.

The op suggested McDavid will eventually ask to be traded because he doesn’t feel the Oilers will ever be good enough to win. My question is which team can he go to where his $12.5 million cap hit doesn’t put him in the exact situation he’s in now? I don’t see one. If his hypothetical issue is just winning then there’s no real benefit to him asking to go somewhere else. I think we can assume he’s okay with playing in Edmonton itself as he just signed an eight year extension six months ago.

Well, if the situation doesn't improve in the next couple of years to his liking he might just feel that he wants a fresh start elsewhere. Maybe he would have lost faith in the organization to make it work and maybe he thinks some other organization can get it done. Yes, it's speculation but the point is I don't think he'll be looking at it in the way you say... that his cap hit would keep him in the same situation elsewhere as he is here. He'll look at it more like... maybe some other organization can do a better job working around my cap hit. and that maybe he'll want to head back east closer to home.

Really, is it that farfetched that he would think that this oilers org has been a pure joke for the last 10 plus years (with a one year aberration) and that maybe almost ANY other organization could get him closer to potentially building towards a cup. Seriously... we had better be in a much better position and at MINIMUM playoffs by 2019-20 or this Connor wanting to leave is a real issue. It's very doable... but the track record of the team doesn't leave me feeling confident. We'll see.
 

MaxR11

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also, how can we be certain that Chia/the organization, upon trying to quickly improve the team, doesn't sink the team further with poor moves..... leading to Connor eventually saying "f%&( this s%*t! get me out!"
 

rboomercat90

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Well, if the situation doesn't improve in the next couple of years to his liking he might just feel that he wants a fresh start elsewhere. Maybe he would have lost faith in the organization to make it work and maybe he thinks some other organization can get it done. Yes, it's speculation but the point is I don't think he'll be looking at it in the way you say... that his cap hit would keep him in the same situation elsewhere as he is here. He'll look at it more like... maybe some other organization can do a better job working around my cap hit. and that maybe he'll want to head back east closer to home.

Really, is it that farfetched that he would think that this oilers org has been a pure joke for the last 10 plus years (with a one year aberration) and that maybe almost ANY other organization could get him closer to potentially building towards a cup. Seriously... we had better be in a much better position and at MINIMUM playoffs by 2019-20 or this Connor wanting to leave is a real issue. It's very doable... but the track record of the team doesn't leave me feeling confident. We'll see.
He just signed an eight year extension six months ago for god’s sake. He knew what this organization was all about before he signed that deal. Nothing has fundamentally changed during that time inside the organization. The team from top to bottom is having a bad year. They happen, especially after some success. It will inspire everybody to do better next year. As we saw last season, the talent is here if everybody can get on the same page, that’ll be the challenge next year.

Some of you guys aren’t happy unless you’re running around yelling about the sky falling.
 
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MaxR11

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He just signed an eight year extension six months ago for god’s sake. He knew what this organization was all about before he signed that deal. Nothing has fundamentally changed during that time inside the organization. The team from top to bottom is having a bad year. They happen, especially after some success. It will inspire everybody to do better next year. As we saw last season, the talent is here if everybody can get on the same page, that’ll be the challenge next year.

Some of you guys aren’t happy unless you’re running around yelling about the sky falling.

He was naïve. He figured last season was probably going to be the norm going forward and signed the deal. I, on the other hand, saw this coming from Jan/Feb 2017. Sorry to be a pessimist but I could see the team was well overachieving and getting a ton of luck and that this was not going to be sustainable. It's like that player who shoots 18% shooting percentage one year and gets a career high 30 goals but is normally a 15 goal a year guy. Maybe I'm wrong and next year and the following years will be fine, but I wouldn't hold my breath. They can finish off great this year but given what has transpired this year it's not unrealistic that if they get off to a rocky start in 2018-19 that we'll have the same first half of the season as this year and we got that perpetual suck that has been here for the last 10 plus years.
 

McShogun99

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I agree with this completely. I don’t think there’s any question almost any owner would jump at the chance to acquire McDavid. The problem is what adding that salary would do to his existing lineup. It’s a cap league now, it wasn’t when Lindros was traded. You can’t just stockpile talent anymore. Acquiring McDavid means giving up $12.5 million of good talent. He’d be playing on another team with a depleted lineup, just like here.

The op suggested McDavid will eventually ask to be traded because he doesn’t feel the Oilers will ever be good enough to win. My question is which team can he go to where his $12.5 million cap hit doesn’t put him in the exact situation he’s in now? I don’t see one. If his hypothetical issue is just winning then there’s no real benefit to him asking to go somewhere else. I think we can assume he’s okay with playing in Edmonton itself as he just signed an eight year extension six months ago.

If Mcdavid and Draisaitl were more concerned about winning then padding their bank account then they would have took a little less. Next season at 12.5 million, Mcdavid needs to be the best player in the league. Draisaitl is overpayed.
 
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