Recalled/Assigned: Delete

[Micklebot]

"We need to take our time and develop our prospects properly!"
"We need to give our prospects more NHL ice time sooner!"

Alternatively, we could give guys who are ready the icetime the deserve, and not overplay guys that aren't ready. Personally, I think White has shown that he can handle NHL mins, and in a bigger role than he was played in the other night. I think the best situation for him at the NHL level is probably 3rd line duties with 2nd unit time on both special teams. He's, imo, not best served on the 4th line with no special teams, so I'd rather him in the AHL getting big mins than up here getting limited role and mins, but I can't see much of an argument for him not being ready for third line duties.

 

[BonkTastic]

No we aren't. We don't need to "showcase" Dumont or Paajarvi. They're both waiver fodder or at best, a 7th round pick.

Nobody's trading for Gaborik and Smith will get minutes regardless of White, same with Brassard, Hoffman and Dzingel.

Dumont and Pajaarvi need to clear waivers to get sent down. White doesn't.

If the team thinks we will need those two after the deadline as healthy bodies because a few guys are on the way out (Brass, Smith, etc...), then it makes sense.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

His usage at ES wasn't too far from Paguea's; one got around 8:45, the other got ~9:50. The difference was White lost any PP time he had to Gaborik, and didn't kill penalties. If he's going to be up with the big team, we should be trying to play him on the special teams, so I don't really mind the move to Belleville, but frankly, I think playing with Dzingel and Shore could easily be a better situation than whoever he ends up with in Belleville, at least for the ES toi.

Tough enough call.. That is a concern of mine in Belleville as well.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

"We need to take our time and develop our prospects properly!"
"We need to give our prospects more NHL ice time sooner!"

If I am reading between these lines.. It seems you are trying to point out a dichotomy.. I think these two concepts can coexist. It depends on the player and the situation.

 

[OD99]

Seems bad
Only Dumont is worse without White than with him.

I'm on my phone so tough to see...are you saying everyone but Dumont is better or worse when playing with White?

 

[starling]

I'm on my phone so tough to see...are you saying everyone but Dumont is better or worse when playing with White?

Yeah, everyone but Dumont plays better away from White according to this metric at least (5-on-5 shot% with and without player). Obviously it doesn't give you full picture just one of the ways to look at things.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Yeah, everyone but Dumont plays better away from White according to this metric at least (5-on-5 shot% with and without player). Obviously it doesn't give you full picture just one of the ways to look at things.

Damning

 

[HSF]

I think there are a few things to understand here.

1. Playing White on the top line in the NHL is not 'development'. Development is actually seeing him improve or making things happen when given that chance. I think most people would say White has looked decent on the top. Sometimes good, Sometimes bad and sometimes just there. So sending him down the lineup shouldn't have anyone outraged its part of growing up and playing in different situations.

2. Ottawa is building towards next year. A large part in why we weren't that great this year was the lack of chemistry perhaps white was given a chance to see what he can do with Duch and Hoffman and now Ottawa feels like its someone elses turn to see what they have and if they can build chemistry.


3. White has a much better chance of getting prime PP PK and playing mins against competition around HIS skill level and not against top NHL defenders. You can't say I rather have him play top mins in the NHL rather than the AHL cause they are both completely different places with different skill level. Its just a blanket statement which doesn't work with all prospects. If white was ripping the AHL perhaps thats another story

Lets remember that this is White's first pro year and the way he plays the game imo takes time to develop he isn't a purely offensively gifted player. I think Ottawa giving him a chance on the top line in the NHL is a great indicator that they have high hopes for him its just going to take some development

 

[BonkTastic]

I think there are a few things to understand here.

1. Playing White on the top line in the NHL is not 'development'. Development is actually seeing him improve or making things happen when given that chance. I think most people would say White has looked decent on the top. Sometimes good, Sometimes bad and sometimes just there. So sending him down the lineup shouldn't have anyone outraged its part of growing up and playing in different situations.

2. Ottawa is building towards next year. A large part in why we weren't that great this year was the lack of chemistry perhaps white was given a chance to see what he can do with Duch and Hoffman and now Ottawa feels like its someone elses turn to see what they have and if they can build chemistry.


3. White has a much better chance of getting prime PP PK and playing mins against competition around HIS skill level and not against top NHL defenders. You can't say I rather have him play top mins in the NHL rather than the AHL cause they are both completely different places with different skill level. Its just a blanket statement which doesn't work with all prospects. If white was ripping the AHL perhaps thats another story

Lets remember that this is White's first pro year and the way he plays the game imo takes time to develop he isn't a purely offensively gifted player. I think Ottawa giving him a chance on the top line in the NHL is a great indicator that they have high hopes for him its just going to take some development

I would have posted something this long and good along these same lines if I weren't on mobile and hate my phone.

Agreed.

 

[OgieO]

I'm cool with this. I would like to see White develop a bit more and not worry about mistakes. I just hope/expect he'll get lots of time in Belleville. Hopefully a bit of success in Ottawa gives him a boost and he kicks ass and takes his game up another level.

 

[Sensung]

I think there are a few things to understand here.

1. Playing White on the top line in the NHL is not 'development'. Development is actually seeing him improve or making things happen when given that chance. I think most people would say White has looked decent on the top. Sometimes good, Sometimes bad and sometimes just there. So sending him down the lineup shouldn't have anyone outraged its part of growing up and playing in different situations.

Playing him on the top line provides the opportunity for development, but is only one of the many options available.

2. Ottawa is building towards next year. A large part in why we weren't that great this year was the lack of chemistry perhaps white was given a chance to see what he can do with Duch and Hoffman and now Ottawa feels like its someone elses turn to see what they have and if they can build chemistry.

I think this has more to do with pumping up Gaborik's value on the longshot chance they could move him along. 1 goal and an assist was a good start. Hopefully, he can stay hot through the remainder of the season.

3. White has a much better chance of getting prime PP PK and playing mins against competition around HIS skill level and not against top NHL defenders. You can't say I rather have him play top mins in the NHL rather than the AHL cause they are both completely different places with different skill level. Its just a blanket statement which doesn't work with all prospects. If white was ripping the AHL perhaps thats another story

Not sure his skill level has been so clearly determined at this point. He certainly did not look too out of place on the top line.

Lets remember that this is White's first pro year and the way he plays the game imo takes time to develop he isn't a purely offensively gifted player. I think Ottawa giving him a chance on the top line in the NHL is a great indicator that they have high hopes for him its just going to take some development

Agreed. I'm fine with them exploring a wide variety of developmental options, just so long as getting limited minutes on the 4th line is not one they choose.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Boucher: White sent down so he can get proper minutes and keep his confidence
The headline says it all... no comments on his play.. down for a bit get more minutes , more situations
Liked Gaborik's play on the boards.. recognizes its not a strength of the team
McCormick ... not mentioned .. not asked ..
Starting to think its just noise ... Open mouth produce noise .. see ya tomorrow

 

[Korpse]

Young guys are stapled to 3rd and 4th line roles, while the vets like Jimmy O'Brien and Tyler Randell get the prominent roles. This organization is broken.

No. White and Chlapik are often among TOI leaders. Both are out on the top PP unit, and white also gets some SH time. Gagne and Perron can be a bit of a mixed bag but for those two consistency is more of an issue. Both still recieve PP time as well. White is going to go down their and play close to 20 minutes a night.

 

[HSF]

I agree with what you are saying 100%, however, we are sending him to a situation where the coach plays players the exact same way GB does. Young guys are stapled to 3rd and 4th line roles, while the vets like Jimmy O'Brien and Tyler Randell get the prominent roles. This organization is broken.

Hopefully we will begin to see this "renewed commitment to development" play out here.

fake news as usual

 

[BatherSeason]

No. White and Chlapik are often among TOI leaders. Both are out on the top PP unit, and white also gets some SH time. Gagne and Perron can be a bit of a mixed bag but for those two consistency is more of an issue. Both still recieve PP time as well. White is going to go down their and play close to 20 minutes a night.

Here are some quick snippets from someone who watches every B-Sens game. Not sure how great this "development path" will be for our young players. Any of this sound familiar? This must be the "renewed commitment to development"

"There were various Kleinendorstian oddities in the game–Tyler Randell (he of the 1 real goal in 40 games) was inserted on the PP for some reason (the last time this happened was December 28th, but his last time as part of the regular rotation was a two-game experiment back in early December). Naturally this did nothing to help the powerplay (the team has scored zero PP goals with Randell on the ice), which also included McCormick (whose limited effectiveness on the powerplay I’ve gone over before–those numbers have only gotten worse, incidentally). Speaking of special teams, I’m not clear on why Harpur has been relegated to the second unit in favour of Murray–Harpur has much better numbers on the powerplay."

"I mentioned the dumb penalties and this is a season-long trend by the BSens–the players guilty of taking them are all “leaders”–Blunden, McCormick, O’Brien, etc. These are undisciplined, selfish plays and there have been no consequences from the coaching staff whatsoever. This approach is something we saw from Luke Richardson as well (vets could do whatever they wanted). There’s no excuse for this–there ought to be even less tolerance for veterans."

"The Chris Kelly experiment recurred, as he signed a new PTO coming off winning the Spengler Cup. His second chance kept him in shape prior to his Olympic appearance, but he again failed to deliver. Kleinendorst, unlike the first round of Kelly, inexplicably put him on scoring lines most of the time (which was a disaster)."

"Perron has no points in his last six and hasn’t scored in fifteen (admittedly with minimal PP time and mostly playing on the fourth line)"

 

[Korpse]

Here are some quick snippets from someone who watches every B-Sens game. Not sure how great this "development path" will be for our young players. Any of this sound familiar? This must be the "renewed commitment to development"

"There were various Kleinendorstian oddities in the game–Tyler Randell (he of the 1 real goal in 40 games) was inserted on the PP for some reason (the last time this happened was December 28th, but his last time as part of the regular rotation was a two-game experiment back in early December). Naturally this did nothing to help the powerplay (the team has scored zero PP goals with Randell on the ice), which also included McCormick (whose limited effectiveness on the powerplay I’ve gone over before–those numbers have only gotten worse, incidentally). Speaking of special teams, I’m not clear on why Harpur has been relegated to the second unit in favour of Murray–Harpur has much better numbers on the powerplay."

"I mentioned the dumb penalties and this is a season-long trend by the BSens–the players guilty of taking them are all “leaders”–Blunden, McCormick, O’Brien, etc. These are undisciplined, selfish plays and there have been no consequences from the coaching staff whatsoever. This approach is something we saw from Luke Richardson as well (vets could do whatever they wanted). There’s no excuse for this–there ought to be even less tolerance for veterans."

"The Chris Kelly experiment recurred, as he signed a new PTO coming off winning the Spengler Cup. His second chance kept him in shape prior to his Olympic appearance, but he again failed to deliver. Kleinendorst, unlike the first round of Kelly, inexplicably put him on scoring lines most of the time (which was a disaster)."

"Perron has no points in his last six and hasn’t scored in fifteen (admittedly with minimal PP time and mostly playing on the fourth line)"

Can you point to where it says young guys are stapled to the bench?

 

[BatherSeason]

Can you point to where it says young guys are stapled to the bench?

OK, you gone on believing that our farm club is in good hands with Randy Lee and coach KK then....

For future reference, maybe read eyeonthesens.com every once in awhile and maybe even follow the guy on Twitter. He actually watches all the games.

 

[Korpse]

1. OK, you gone on believing that our farm club is in good hands with Randy Lee and coach KK then....

For future reference, maybe read eyeonthesens.com every once in awhile and maybe even follow the guy on Twitter. He actually watches all the games.

I haven’t said a word about KK or Randy Lee.

Personally I’d rather watch the games myself and draw my own conclusions. I’ve read his stuff from time to time and do follow him on Twitter. I acklowdged that, at times Perron and Gagne don’t see the ice as much and to be quite honest at times they’ve struggled. Especially Perron, I’m not sure there’s much there to be honest. White and Chlapik have played a lot and are going to continue to play a lot, whatever you’ve been lead to believe with White’s usage, you are either misunderstanding or being mislead.

 

[BatherSeason]

Personally I’d rather watch the games myself and draw my own conclusions

I apologize for jumping to conclusions. You go to a lot of games? Your feedback is definitely welcomed and very much appreciated.

White and Chlapik have played a lot and are going to continue to play a lot, whatever you’ve been lead to believe with White’s usage, you are either misunderstanding or being mislead.

I do really hope that these guys are used properly.

Once again, I am truly sorry, this darn organization gets me so worked up lately...lol. Being a fan of this team for over 25 years and seeing how this once proud franchise is now being run to the ground by is killing me.

As for Randy Lee and coach KK, I don't think there is anything anyone can see to change my opinion on them

 

[aragorn]

OK, you gone on believing that our farm club is in good hands with Randy Lee and coach KK then....

For future reference, maybe read eyeonthesens.com every once in awhile and maybe even follow the guy on Twitter. He actually watches all the games.

I'm of the opinion that Randy Lee is no more than an administrative assistant when it comes to Belleville & when he is interviewed he gives the party line on players or what PD & the scouts/coaches tell him about the players. He's clearly involved but from what I have seen at camps he isn't as much of a hockey expert as Dorion, Boucher, Crawford & a number of other hockey experts/scouts in the organization.

Coach KK on the other hand is a hockey guy & knows his stuff regardless of how he is viewed on here by some who don't know his history. He is a very well respected hockey guy, very knowledgeable about the game & has a history of developing young players & has won a Calder Cup for this organization. He can only work with the players he has been given & he has been given a number of vets who I don't think should be there, but they are & he has no choice but to play them occasionally. There is a responsibility from the organization towards the players they sign as well. Don't sign them if you don't have the intention of playing them. they have a career they need to protect too.

Putting Randell on one PP is not that big a deal, maybe it was a message to the other players to go to the net & screen the goalie, who knows but it's one time, big deal, it doesn't mean he sucks as a coach. We are in a time with social media that every detail is scrutinized to the millionth degree it seems. The team sucks as a whole & he doesn't have much to work with to begin with & that IMO is on PD. This though doesn't mean that maybe a change is required in Belleville but it could also mean that whoever is signing these vets need to do a much better job of bringing in better ones to work with the younger players/prospects. My guess is that some vets are brought in with the hope that they are or could be injury replacement players.

And is some instances there are players that we hope work out but never do & there is a long list of those players from Da Costa to Petersson to Locke to Prince to Randell. Perron seems to be the latest guy we thought would be much better & doesn't seem to be working out. Eyeonthesens watching every game doesn't make him a hockey expert either nor do I think he has the insight or access to know everything that KK is doing & why. He's another fan who watches a lot of hockey, it's another fan's perspective, that's all.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Alternatively, we could give guys who are ready the icetime the deserve, and not overplay guys that aren't ready. Personally, I think White has shown that he can handle NHL mins, and in a bigger role than he was played in the other night. I think the best situation for him at the NHL level is probably 3rd line duties with 2nd unit time on both special teams. He's, imo, not best served on the 4th line with no special teams, so I'd rather him in the AHL getting big mins than up here getting limited role and mins, but I can't see much of an argument for him not being ready for third line duties.

I think that he's been fine, he's shown good flashes, and mediocre play. I think in terms of development he's been given a solid taste of the NHL, and while we head into the deadline and beyond I don't have a problem with him heading back to the AHL for big minutes and bigger responsibility. I don't see it as a demotion, and I doubt he does either. More like the young guys come up, play in all kinds of situations, see what the NHL is like, get feedback on what improvements have been made, and what still needs work, and then they head back down to put in some more development time.

White wasn't lighting the league on fire, or even close, this all part of developing his play in my opinion. Could he play on the team for good, sure, but is that the best way to help him fulfill his potential? I'm not so sure. I'm not ready to play the guy as a 3rd line centre when he can play as a first line centre against men and potentially grow.

Personally I just see the complaining as I laid it out. Right now, there is not a single move the team makes that goes unpunished. Rather than wait and see how his development goes, everyone wants to be a pro and a contrarian (not saying you necessarily). I have no doubt he'll be up permanently next season, but we really don't need or want to be rushing prospects right now.

 

[Tundraman]

Apparently Dzingel is away from the team on a personal family matter and won't be available tomorrow. Dumont is reactivated from ir to fill the spot so White could have played at least another NHL game before the Sens had too many forwards and one had to sit out. Instead the Sens sent White down and brought up McCormick. It appears that they could have easily delayed this move.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

Go get 20 mins a night for a few weeks, White.

Whatever. We don't need him to win us games at the NHL level. Spending a few weeks playing top line minutes will be fine for him. This is ok.

I'd rather have McCormick playing 8 mins a night than White.

I'd rather have White playing 14 minutes a night with good players than play on a horrible team with bad players.

This makes no sense to me.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

If I am reading between these lines.. It seems you are trying to point out a dichotomy.. I think these two concepts can coexist. It depends on the player and the situation.

The difference is when you make an argument you consider the facts at hand, and give your honest opinion. When he does it he's mostly trying to get a rise out of someone or being straight-up facetious.

Yes, of course with some players it's better to play them in the minors and not overwhelm them in the NHL, but White has looked solid overall, and considering he's not a teenager, seems mature enough to handle the big league. Not saying that he'll regress with Belleville, but imo he's the kind of player that can learn and adjust quickly so why wouldn't you want him up here with great players instead of burying him on a terrible team where he'll lose most of the time?

So like you said, it depends on the player and the situation, and here we have a situation where we can give a 20 year-old a chance to develop quicker in the NHL with very little downside, but choose to play Gaborik instead. The canned reasoning of "he'll get more icetime in the minors therefore that's the best approach" doesn't mean anything here because he could very well get plenty of it with Ottawa if only our coach wasn't so stuck on old men.

I'm honestly a little baffled that so many posters are agreeing with Boucher when just before they were complaining that he didn't trust the kids.

 

[Ice-Tray]

If I am reading between these lines.. It seems you are trying to point out a dichotomy.. I think these two concepts can coexist. It depends on the player and the situation.

No, I'm making a statement that for many here what ever management does the opposite is the right decision. I mean, there are guys here that actually think that their assessment of what is right for White is better than the coaching staff, as though they're dealing with the same set of information, or that as fans watching from their couch they have a better take than those who benefit most from the player's positive progression.

For the negative poster around here, it's not about what's best for the player, it's about arguing that whatever management does it's the wrong decision.

To hear some grumpy posters it's like Chabot has progressed really nicely this year in spite of Boucher rather than because of his deployment and development. Same with White, Boucher is stubbornly holding him back, which is infuriating to the armchair GM/coach.

Oh L'Avy, have your potshots, if it makes you feel a little better I'm ok with it.