Player Discussion Marner Talk - Fresh, insightful comments are welcome

[hamzarocks]

Kaprizov belongs with the first group. He most certainly is better than Marner. Kaprizov, in just his 4th season, had 46 goals and 96 points in 75 games. The next best player on wild had 69. Marner relies way to much on his teammates for him produce. He can hardly crack 96 points with a stacked roster with linemates breaking 100 points.

He had a down year last season so didnt put him in tier 1

Also had a shit playoffs that year

He can move up if he plays again great and if wild makes playoffs and he doesnt suck

 

[Legion34]

ok is his gramma calling him out on twitter???!!!

 

[Antropovsky]

He had a down year last season so didnt put him in tier 1

Also had a shit playoffs that year

He can move up if he plays again great and if wild makes playoffs and he doesnt suck

Kaprizov had 108 points in just his second season... over 20 points more than any teammate. He also had 7 goals in 6 playoff games. That's more than even Matthews has produced in one season.

Marner would be lucky to produce 70 points on Minneostas roster.

The other players in your tier one have much more support offensively. Rantanen has Mackinnon. Kucherov has Stamkos, Point, Hedman.

I would take Kaprizov over Rantanen.

 

[hamzarocks]

Kaprizov had 108 points in just his second season... over 20 points more than any teammate. He also had 7 goals in 6 playoff games. That's more than even Matthews has produced in one season.

Marner would be lucky to produce 70 points on Minneostas roster.

Marner will be a 80-90 pt player in minny

He produced last year when matthews stunk and he played with Tavares (a 3rd line center at EVS)

Marner will always dominate regular season hockey. He cant produce in the playoffs which is why he has to go

 

[57 Years No Cup]

I’m thinking he isn’t going into the season unsigned.

My bet (if he wants to stay)

8/93 million.

He gets 11.625 per year. Slight raise. More than Willy. Gets his junior number. Makes some fans back.

.

No, you're not.

I think it is the most reasonable outcome.

That would be about 12.5% of the cap in a 93 million cap. What would you possibly think a 95 pt 1st team all star selke nominated winger would ask for?

About 14% is pretty standard for his stats.

That would be about 13.

He gets his money. He gets a small raise. More than Willie. It’s fair

No, you don't.

 

[Superstar]

Marner will be a 80-90 pt player in minny

He produced last year when matthews stunk and he played with Tavares (a 3rd line center at EVS)

Marner will always dominate regular season hockey. He cant produce in the playoffs which is why he has to go

He'll get his regular season points, but 80-90 points is really not dominating regular season though...100 assists by McDavid and Kucherov is dominating regular season hockey.

 

[saffronleaf]

offer him 8 years at league minimum

 

[PanniniClaus]

ok is his gramma calling him out on twitter???!!!

Well it is from last year...

 

[Gabriel426]

Well it is from last year...

I take it as a joke by some troll on X last year.

 

[SquidNasty]

ok is his gramma calling him out on twitter???!!!

After going through the account, this is either the most dedicated troll job I’ve ever seen or it’s actually her.

 

[leafs in five]

nice I was hoping we would start discussing more members of his family

 

[centipede2233]

“Stop f***ing crying bro” is what needed to be said to him in like his sophomore season when Babs put him on the 4th line.

His camp seems toxic as hell.

I think nylander has held his tongue for so long seeing marner’s entitled crybaby routine, game 4 when he said stop crying bro is basically he had enough and had to let some steam off

 

[Arzak]

What teams would realistically afford Marner and he would make sense on their roster?

I don't see a trade happening.

Here is why:
Trading Marner is Leaf's own admission, no team can win the Cup with Mitch Marner. No contender is trading assets for Mitch, plus they would have to get rid of a solid player or two to accommodate his cap. Not happening.

That leaves teams that are trying to rebuild. GM trying to rebuild would have to be dumb to spend picks and prospects so he can overpay Marner.


If you are Utah GM, are you bleeding your assets to get Mitch now and help the Leaf ? Why not just overpay him - the way we did JT ?

I really don't get it, contenders don't need him, and the rest don't need him year sooner for the cost of their future.



Remember what the Islanders got for JT ? That's our return

 

[WilliamInLondon]

As I've stated several times, I personally think Marner will not waive his NMC, and will re-sign with Toronto at the $10.5M-$11M range over 8 years with a 10-15 team NMC clause. This gives him a year at redemption while being public enemy #1 among the fans - if he puts up a 100 point season and gets the team deep into the playoffs next year, I'm 99% sure all will be forgiven haha.

Now having said that, let's assume that he agrees to a sign and trade come July 1st.

To LA:
- Mitch Marner ($11M)
- 2026 3rd Round Pick
- William Villeneuve

To TOR:
- Adrian Kempe ($7M)
- Michael Anderson ($4.125M)

Why does Toronto do it?
- Gives Marner a fresh start and in return gets a solid 1st line winger with term in Kempe and on the right side of 30.
- Gets a solid LD Top 4 defenceman with an incredible 8-year term
- Fills out the roster by adding defensive depth in addition to a front-line player.

Why does Los Angeles do it?
- I think this could actually work for LA - they're basically a less tragic version of Toronto in that they have some amazing young talent (Byfield) along with solid, aging veterans (Kopitar and to a lesser extent Doughty). They have a solid support cast (Moore, Fiala, Danault) but have gone all in on Dubois who did not have a great season
- Kempe is very good, but he's not a game buster in the same way that Marner is when the latter is locked in. The sheer vision and playmaking skills that Marner has is lacking in LA and would open up Dubois' and Byfield's game in a way that few other players can. Similarly, having big, bruising 6'4, 6'5 forwards to play alongside Marner would open up a lot of space for him to do his magic in both the regular season and potentially the playoffs.

Good trade? Dumb trade? haha, come at me....

 

[Shooter2x]

It doesn't matter what any of you want. No NHL exec is trading Marner when JT is off the books soon.

No point getting in an argument with me when deep down in your stomach you know this too.

Imagine the stain on your resume being the GM who couldn't just wait out JTs last year when your team is still a top 5 contender by doing absolutely nothing this off season besides bringing back the exact same team

 

[BrannigansLaw]

It doesn't matter what any of you want. No NHL exec is trading Marner when JT is off the books soon.

No point getting in an argument with me when deep down in your stomach you know this too.

Imagine the stain on your resume being the GM who couldn't just wait out JTs last year when your team is still a top 5 contender by doing absolutely nothing this off season besides bringing back the exact same team

“Top 5 contender”

 

[Shooter2x]

“Top 5 contender”

Contender is determined in the regular season to predict the cup winner based on regular season performance.

Add a top 4 mobile D to go with our new goals + hits leading style and what's the issue? Boston came down to next goal wins

 

[Dayjobdave]

It doesn't matter what any of you want. No NHL exec is trading Marner when JT is off the books soon.

No point getting in an argument with me when deep down in your stomach you know this too.

Imagine the stain on your resume being the GM who couldn't just wait out JTs last year when your team is still a top 5 contender by doing absolutely nothing this off season besides bringing back the exact same team

It would be an arguably worse example of impatience than giving Carolina the Seth Jarvis pick to take a year of Marleau. But regaining the cap room would have some value for sure.

I’m not sure Mitch can survive in this market, but if he does, there has to be some sniff of a concession on his next deal.

In fairness to Mitch, he was clearly not recovered from the ankle sprain, and there was no room on the ice for anyone in that series.

It will be interesting to see if the Friday suit boys defend him and his game.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Contender is determined in the regular season to predict the cup winner based on regular season performance.

Add a top 4 mobile D to go with our new goals + hits leading style and what's the issue? Boston came down to next goal wins

We have never been in the conference finals so we can fairly objectively say we're not a top 5 contender. Losing a series by a goal in round 1 doesn't put us at the same tier of Colorado and Florida. Do you think after Dallas, New York, and Edmonton we are the next best team and we're all equals? What about Vegas and the Jets? We are not even close. Every team would can say they're a top 4D from some measure of improvement.

The issue is the team loses the same way for 8 years straight and two of the core four will be paid 6M more next year. The one who produces the least amount of goals with the worst performance wants 12M.

 

[WilliamInLondon]

Contender is determined in the regular season to predict the cup winner based on regular season performance.

Add a top 4 mobile D to go with our new goals + hits leading style and what's the issue? Boston came down to next goal wins

I do agree with you.

Run it back with a (healthy) Woll, a 1B/backup, Pesce, a re-signed Lyubushkin and Domi, and organic growth from Knies, Robertson, and Minten, and you could argue that this is still a Top 5-7 team on paper.

 

[Arzak]

I do agree with you.

Run it back with a (healthy) Woll, a 1B/backup, Pesce, a re-signed Lyubushkin and Domi, and organic growth from Knies, Robertson, and Minten, and you could argue that this is still a Top 5-7 team on paper.

We are goalie and 1D away from almost beating the worst Boston iteration in the last 10 years.

I don't get the contender talk. We are so far away it's laughable.

 

[WilliamInLondon]

We are goalie and 1D away from almost beating the worst Boston iteration in the last 10 years.

I don't get the contender talk. We are so far away it's laughable.

Key word for me is 'on paper'. I think in terms of pure talent, this team - in spite of a few gaps - is easily Top 5 in the league in my books.

It's what's between their ears and within their chest that I think is holding this franchise back. Like in life, determination, grit, and resiliency will beat out natural ability in almost everything 10 times out of 10.

In a lot of ways, pure talent alone almost works against you when trying to build a sustainable, successful organisation.

 

[TorMapleJays]

.. so Marner is acting like the government.

 

[Shooter2x]

We have never been in the conference finals so we can fairly objectively say we're not a top 5 contender. Losing a series by a goal in round 1 doesn't put us at the same tier of Colorado and Florida. Do you think after Dallas, New York, and Edmonton we are the next best team and we're all equals? What about Vegas and the Jets? We are not even close. Every team would can say they're a top 4D from some measure of improvement.

The issue is the team loses the same way for 8 years straight and two of the core four will be paid 6M more next year. The one who produces the least amount of goals with the worst performance wants 12M.

Keep in mind the main context of my post though. My contender sentence was plucked out and stripped the context.

The logistics aren't there to trade Marner. He's a career Leaf.

Worst case scenario if we run Marner next season , we are contenders by definition even though subjectively we can't agree.

It's not good team building to lose marner when the main problem (JT cap hit) is 1 year out.

Couple main problem with worst case and it's obvious no gm is trading marner.

 

[Racer88]

I don't see a trade happening.

Here is why:
Trading Marner is Leaf's own admission, no team can win the Cup with Mitch Marner. No contender is trading assets for Mitch, plus they would have to get rid of a solid player or two to accommodate his cap. Not happening.

That leaves teams that are trying to rebuild. GM trying to rebuild would have to be dumb to spend picks and prospects so he can overpay Marner.


If you are Utah GM, are you bleeding your assets to get Mitch now and help the Leaf ? Why not just overpay him - the way we did JT ?

I really don't get it, contenders don't need him, and the rest don't need him year sooner for the cost of their future.



Remember what the Islanders got for JT ? That's our return

So basically nobody want Marner

Keep in mind the main context of my post though. My contender sentence was plucked out and stripped the context.

The logistics aren't there to trade Marner. He's a career Leaf.

Worst case scenario if we run Marner next season , we are contenders by definition even though subjectively we can't agree.

It's not good team building to lose marner when the main problem (JT cap hit) is 1 year out.

Couple main problem with worst case and it's obvious no gm is trading marner.

Marner at 7-8 mill works but Marner at 11-12 is a recipe for disaster