Marc Bergevin " So your telling me there's a chance" edition

[lo striver]

I can't remember who said it, by I remember a guy in hockey media saying that (paraphrasing) the way to be a good GM is to make trades with bad GMs. Seems apt.

that explains why Bergevin is "always on the phone". every other GM wants to talk to him every day.

 

[NotProkofievian]

He's good there's no denying that........maybe he can propel Chicago into the actual playoffs with that stacked team.

Nah, only #TRUEPLAYOFFWARRIORS can do that. Like what Andrew Shaw's doing right now.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

still have no centres

Which would be the only missing piece rather than the absolute quagmire we are going through.

 

[Hannibal]

Apparently Bergevin will meet his staff after the all-star break to set the plan...

What the fawk? He was with his staff all week long and the plan is not finalize?

They better not think we have a shot if we beat Carolina tonight.

 

[David Suzuki]

Apparently Bergevin will meet his staff after the all-star break to set the plan...

What the fawk? He was with his staff all week long and the plan is not finalize?

They better not think we have a shot if we beat Carolina tonight.

the plan per every single source we've seen is retool

 

[WeThreeKings]

the plan per every single source we've seen is retool

And a retool to them probably involves dumping Galchenyuuk, trading Pleks at the deadline and then continuing to build their shitty iteration of a hockey team. A vision that even if executed to the best of their ability would not yield a successful team.

 

[Runner77]

Apparently Bergevin will meet his staff after the all-star break to set the plan...

What the fawk? He was with his staff all week long and the plan is not finalize?

They better not think we have a shot if we beat Carolina tonight.

A plan to make a plan, that might have been the plan. Bergevin is not exactly comfortable with planning anything.

Reminds me of Jean Chrétien's famous line: "A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven."

 

[Habsfan18]

Apparently Bergevin will meet his staff after the all-star break to set the plan...

What the fawk? He was with his staff all week long and the plan is not finalize?

They better not think we have a shot if we beat Carolina tonight.

Remember this is the same guy who took weeks to work out a trade for John f***ing Scott.

 

[Runner77]

Shawzie is a player like many before him that got an inflated contract because of the winning team he played on. There can be no way that this can be disputed after seeing him in a habs uni for several years. If anyone denies this they are simply trolling because they have nothing else to go on.

Shawzie is what happens when you pay for achievements mostly attributable to the team he happened to be on.

And when you can't let go of your Chicago days.

Also, when you end up paying for what he's done with someone else, when that someone else is smart enough to unload him just before they have to open their wallet.

 

[Runner77]

that explains why Bergevin is "always on the phone". every other GM wants to talk to him every day.

Bergevin is in the proverbial room where he can't tell who the idiot is.

 

[David Suzuki]

Shawzie is what happens when you pay for achievements mostly attributable to the team he happened to be on.

And when you can't let go of your Chicago days.

Also, when you end up paying for what he's done with someone else, when that someone else is smart enough to unload him just before they have to open their wallet.

I still think getting Shaw isnt a bad move it's really just how much money they gave him that is the bad move. Shaw at even 3 million per is a decent contract.

 

[Runner77]

I still think getting Shaw isnt a bad move it's really just how they gave him that is the bad move. Shaw at even 3 million per is a decent contract.

I think they didn't need to hand out the two high 2nd rounders that Bergevin consented. The Hawks had their backs against the wall, they couldn't afford Shaw's contractual demands, they needed to get rid of him. Bergevin overpaid in the circumstances.

Second, it was also a matter of the term that Bergevin agreed to. Too long for a third liner.

Third, he's overpaid relative to the type of player he is. He's a third liner at best who plays a style that is not suited to his body-type/ endurance level, with the result that he's often injured and more importantly, has already suffered multiple concussions. He's undersized but tries to take on players bigger than him and he can't handle them.

Fourth, from a pure asset mix point of view, the team already had Gallagher who provides a similar style of play but who is a better scorer. He wasn't needed. He's just a Bergevin nostalgia infatuation -- a guy he scouted and that was drafted while he was with the Hawks. This move was made for all the wrong reasons.

 

[Belial]

Shawzie is what happens when you pay for achievements mostly attributable to the team he happened to be on.

And when you can't let go of your Chicago days.

Also, when you end up paying for what he's done with someone else, when that someone else is smart enough to unload him just before they have to open their wallet.

Shaw's production didn't drop after the trade.

 

[Runner77]

Shaw's production didn't drop after the trade.

Did anyone say it did or didn't? I don't know where you're getting that.

He's remained the putrid 30-point range producer that he was with Chicago. Plus, concussion and injury-prone.

 

[Belial]

Did anyone say it did or didn't? I don't know where you're getting that.

He's remained the putrid 30-point range producer that he was with Chicago. Plus, concussion and injury-prone.

Well after reading your post it's the impression I got... It's like he was great in Chicago and now he sucks...

Wasn't that your point?

He's been doing the same thing here... Just not winning the cups yet.

 

[LaP]

Shaw's production didn't drop after the trade.

We did not pay for that kind of production though. You don't pay two high 2nd round picks the same year for a 30 points guy. There's no reality where it's a good trade. One of those pick was 39th. 1st round this year will end with pick 31st ... also it was a deep draft year. Had we given those in a crappy draft fine but it was not a crappy draft at all.

 

[Runner77]

Well after reading your post it's the impression I got... It's like he was great in Chicago and now he sucks...

Wasn't that your point?

He's been doing the same thing here... Just not winning the cups yet.

No, it was about his intangibles and how Bergevin overvalued Shaw's two Stanley Cup rings and paid a high price for it. He was supposed to be this warrior who lifts the team to new heights. Where was he was the GM was saying the answer is in the room? Bergevin assembled a team ass-backwards. Rather than expend resources on players who can actually produce offensively, he lunged for a player whose output is a mere 30 point average, while the team continues to mired in an offensive quagmire. And while the team already had on its roster, an undersized gritty player with a better scoring clip than Shaw.

That's my point.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Does Belial actually defend the shaw trade?

 

[Runner77]

Does Belial actually defend the shaw trade?

Hummmm ... only 14 messages, huh? You're in for a few surprises.

Welcome to the forum, btw.

 

[Andrei79]

Did anyone say it did or didn't? I don't know where you're getting that.

He's remained the putrid 30-point range producer that he was with Chicago. Plus, concussion and injury-prone.

Your point was well expressed and precise. Everyone likely understood it, but one, who's struggling with the concept of overpayment even after two explanations, maybe three, we'll see.

 

[Belial]

We did not pay for that kind of production though. You don't pay two high 2nd round picks the same year for a 30 points guy. There's no reality where it's a good trade. One of those pick was 39th. 1st round this year will end with pick 31st ... also it was a deep draft year. Had we given those in a crappy draft fine but it was not a crappy draft at all.

Draft picks are a crapshoot, I will take established NHL players over draft picks any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

No, it was about his intangibles and how Bergevin overvalued Shaw's two Stanley Cup rings and paid a high price for it. He was supposed to be this warrior who lifts the team to new heights. Where was he was the GM was saying the answer is in the room? Bergevin assembled a team ass-backwards. Rather than expend resources on players who can actually produce offensively, he lunged for a player whose output is a mere 30 point average, while the team continues to mired in an offensive quagmire. And while the team already had on its roster, an undersized gritty player with a better scoring clip than Shaw.

That's my point.

And how exactly do you measure what you're talking about? Maybe Shaw is doing what he's paid for but some other players on the roster are not?

I mean this is so subjective... You've been on the fence since the beginning, you will probably never embrace this guy.

Does Belial actually defend the shaw trade?

Belial defends everything related to this club.Get used. Welcome.

 

[cphabs]

Only Scherbak and Juulsen imo. I hope he isn't planning to trade those guys for a late push.

Don't forget our 1st rounder... LMFAO

We are doomed.

 

[David Suzuki]

I think they didn't need to hand out the two high 2nd rounders that Bergevin consented. The Hawks had their backs against the wall, they couldn't afford Shaw's contractual demands, they needed to get rid of him. Bergevin overpaid in the circumstances.

Second, it was also a matter of the term that Bergevin agreed to. Too long for a third liner.

Third, he's overpaid relative to the type of player he is. He's a third liner at best who plays a style that is not suited to his body-type/ endurance level, with the result that he's often injured and more importantly, has already suffered multiple concussions. He's undersized but tries to take on players bigger than him and he can't handle them.

Fourth, from a pure asset mix point of view, the team already had Gallagher who provides a similar style of play but who is a better scorer. He wasn't needed. He's just a Bergevin nostalgia infatuation -- a guy he scouted and that was drafted while he was with the Hawks. This move was made for all the wrong reasons.

I mean theres a reason they offered 2 high seconds. I doubt negotiations started there to be fair.

Maybe another team offered a high 2nd and a low 2nd or a third?

 

[LaP]

Draft picks are a crapshoot, I will take established NHL players over draft picks any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

I'll take good picks in a good draft before a 30 points guy any day of the week without any hesitation at all. No question.

And before you tell me Shaw is a 40 points guy in career he is producing at a pace of 35 points every 82 games.

 

[Belial]

I'll take good picks in a good draft before a 30 points guy any day of the week without any hesitation at all. No question.

And before you tell me Shaw is a 40 points guy in career he is producing at a pace of 35 points every 82 games.

You clearly don't understand what a guy like Shaw brings to the table so there's no point in this discussion. Cheers.