Confirmed with Link: Leafs sign LW/C Patrick Marleau (3 years, $6.25 AAV, NMC) - Part II

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LEAFANFORLIFE23

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You wouldn't believe the indignation I was met with in the Marleau thread three weeks ago, when I said we would have to trade Rielly or Gardiner in order to keep our big three. Now, Gardiner is suddenly a "replaceable player". People are coming around....

I didn't see those posts, that said keeping the big 3 won't cost Gardiner or Rielly not a chance
 

saltming

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This thread made me realize why Steve Simmons has a job

Ouch!!
tenor.gif
 

Kiwi

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I didn't see those posts, that said keeping the big 3 won't cost Gardiner or Rielly not a chance

It may cost Gardiner

We have LD on the way up so it's probably not in our best interests to give Gardiner his next UFA deal even though he's a good candidate to age pretty well
 

LEAFANFORLIFE23

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It may cost Gardiner

We have LD on the way up so it's probably not in our best interests to give Gardiner his next UFA deal even though he's a good candidate to age pretty well

We can't let everybody go as soon as they hit their final year, people want to do that with JVR, Bozak, Komarov and now Gardiner at some point you have to keep somebody you can't let everybody go.
 

hullsy47

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We can't let everybody go as soon as they hit their final year, people want to do that with JVR, Bozak, Komarov and now Gardiner at some point you have to keep somebody you can't let everybody go.

I just wanna win a cup ...not be like san jose and keep players for 19 years and just tease .
good players win cups ,the more u have at the right time ,the better .
doughty .tavaras ,bring em all in.
if deals can be made make them ,or we are gonna end with another sundin era with a couple of stars and the rest over priced Toronto hyped players .
any body who wouldn't do a nylander for tavaras deal is just wearing blinders ,and the fact the islanders would want way more .
 

Gary Nylund

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Oct 10, 2013
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We can't let everybody go as soon as they hit their final year, people want to do that with JVR, Bozak, Komarov and now Gardiner at some point you have to keep somebody you can't let everybody go.

If we end up not being able to resign Gardiner because we are on the hook for year three of Marleau, I would not be pleased. Let's hope it doesn't come to that.
 

Muston Atthews

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Yes we should all go with the usual "management knows best" or "justification" of the day that usually gets thrown around when the Marleau deal gets brought up critical thinking be damned.

No one said that. I said you've posted this on basically every page in this thread and have brought it up over and over again in other threads. We get it, you don't like the contract because it could be bad. Why don't we wait it out and see how bad it'll be
 

ACC1224

Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
Aug 19, 2002
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I know right?

Why plan anything? Retirement? Mortgage? Saving for a vacation? Running a business with a 5 year plan?

Close your eyes and live on impulse. I'm sure that's a sure fire way to have long term success.

:laugh: ok, thanks. I'll start to worry more about Marleau, I would like to retire one day.
 
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LEAFANFORLIFE23

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Jun 17, 2010
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I just wanna win a cup ...not be like san jose and keep players for 19 years and just tease .
good players win cups ,the more u have at the right time ,the better .
doughty .tavaras ,bring em all in.
if deals can be made make them ,or we are gonna end with another sundin era with a couple of stars and the rest over priced Toronto hyped players .
any body who wouldn't do a nylander for tavaras deal is just wearing blinders ,and the fact the islanders would want way more .

I wouldn't touch that deal JT is a UFA
 

Bluelines

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There was a good discussion on Overdrive, the guys seem to think Nylander will be asking for Draisaital money, 8+ mil range,where they believe he is more worth Tarasenko type money at 7ish mil per year.

If Nylander is getting 7ish to 8ish mil per year, Matthews is easily worth 9 to 10 mil per year.

I could see a scenario where we have 26 to 30 mil locked up in 3 players. Not a lot of cabbage to go around for the rest of them.
 
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Daisy Jane

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Yes we should all go with the usual "management knows best" or "justification" of the day that usually gets thrown around when the Marleau deal gets brought up critical thinking be damned




Okay Daisy in the name of constructive argument how is this a decent contract?

no one is saying that 'management knows best".
but i do believe they are doing what they think is best to take advantage of a unique window of competitiveness WITH cap flexibility that not a lot of teams (maybe Edmonton?) have. i don't know why that's "justification" - that's fact. if the team finished (healthy) where Buffalo did - i'd totally understand what you are holding on to. but the team has determined they are ready to go - why that's not worth investing in is beyond me.

and quite frankly i've stated how this is decent so many times now i'm pretty sure you can find one of my posts on it.
 

ToneDog

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There was a good discussion on Overdrive, the guys seem to think Nylander will be asking for Draisaital money, 8+ mil range,where they believe he is more worth Tarasenko type money at 7ish mil per year.

If Nylander is getting 7ish to 8ish mil per year, Matthews is easily worth 9 to 10 mil per year.

I could see a scenario where we have 26 to 30 mil locked up in 3 players. Not a lot of cabbage to go around for the rest of them.

O'Dog also mentioned that if Pastrnak asks for Draisaitl money he tells him to go to hell. Pastrnak with 34G and 70 points last year (and Ehlers 25 goals and 64 points last year) are both more proven than Willie (22 goals and 61 points last year) at this point but I see Willie in the same ballpark as the two. Ehlers could get a bit more to stay in WinterPeg.

Sam Bennett is also holding out. That could influence what Willie gets as well.

Ardvidsson is also from the same draft and he signed a pretty cap friendly deal with Nashville but I think Willie will ask for Pastrnak money if Pastrnak can pry it loose from the Bruins.
 
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LEAFANFORLIFE23

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O'Dog also mentioned that if Pastrnak asks for Draisaitl money he tells him to go to hell. Pastrnak with 34G and 70 points last year (and Ehlers 25 goals and 64 points last year) are both more proven than Willie (22 goals and 61 points last year) at this point but I see Willie in the same ballpark as the two. Ehlers could get a bit more to stay in WinterPeg.

Sam Bennett is also holding out. That could influence what Willie gets as well.

Ardvidsson is also from the same draft and he signed a pretty cap friendly deal with Nashville but I think Willie will ask for Pastrnak money if Pastrnak can pry it loose from the Bruins.

No it can't Sam Bennett wishes he was William Nylander
 

ToneDog

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Not sure why. 61 points in 81 games vs. 26 in 81 games.

Agree Willie's future looks brighter after last year but like Dreger said in the TSN interview Bennett is going to argue last year was an anomaly. He was also the #4 pick in the draft and is a C if that is worth anything in the negotiations with Calgary.
 

ToneDog

56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
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No it can't Sam Bennett wishes he was William Nylander

You might be right but you are basing that on one year. Will be interesting to see if Calgary gives in to his demands and how he and Willie stack up after this season. Obviously if Bennett has another bad year and Willie has a good one, Willie will command a lot more than Bennett.
 

Bluelines

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Agree Willie's future looks brighter after last year but like Dreger said in the TSN interview Bennett is going to argue last year was an anomaly. He was also the #4 pick in the draft and is a C if that is worth anything in the negotiations with Calgary.

Agreed Bennet is no position to argue dollars, heck Johnny Gaudreau had to holdout to get paid, so what in Sam Dickens is Bennet thinking? Bennett is playing chicken with the wrong management group. I think in the end he will take a bridge deal.
 

Erndog

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O'Dog also mentioned that if Pastrnak asks for Draisaitl money he tells him to go to hell. Pastrnak with 34G and 70 points last year (and Ehlers 25 goals and 64 points last year) are both more proven than Willie (22 goals and 61 points last year) at this point but I see Willie in the same ballpark as the two. Ehlers could get a bit more to stay in WinterPeg.

Sam Bennett is also holding out. That could influence what Willie gets as well.

Ardvidsson is also from the same draft and he signed a pretty cap friendly deal with Nashville but I think Willie will ask for Pastrnak money if Pastrnak can pry it loose from the Bruins.


Not a single one of those guys had a rookie season as good as Willy's. Not one.

What happens if Willy gets 70-75 pts this year?

He would have all the right to ask (and probably receive) Draisaitl type money.
 

Trapper

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Not a single one of those guys had a rookie season as good as Willy's. Not one.

What happens if Willy gets 70-75 pts this year?

He would have all the right to ask (and probably receive) Draisaitl type money.

Then like Babcock said about Kadri, make us pay you.
“It (Kadri’s million-dollar raise up to $4.1 million) is a home run for him. He gets to come in, have a heck of a year and put the screws to us (in his long-sought extended deal). Why wouldn’t he? If I’m him, I’m going to come in and have the best year of my career, training the way I should, living the way I should.

I don't have a problem paying legitimate stars money.
Legit isn't 1 season however. Nylander had a great rookie season but his career just doesn't stop after the one year. Yeah, you are super elite now. Take a break kid. No. You need to be the complete player and what the organization needs you to be.
A core piece that gels and makes the team elite. Not just yourself. Do that, and you'll get paid. Someone else will get traded to make room.
 

Kamiccolo

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One thing I am not seeing mentioned, maybe I am missing something.

Considering what the team has shown they are willing to do, can't they just ship Marleau to Robidas island in his third year and LTIR his cap hit? Then he doesn't need to move, get's paid, etc.
 

Erndog

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Then like Babcock said about Kadri, make us pay you.
“It (Kadri’s million-dollar raise up to $4.1 million) is a home run for him. He gets to come in, have a heck of a year and put the screws to us (in his long-sought extended deal). Why wouldn’t he? If I’m him, I’m going to come in and have the best year of my career, training the way I should, living the way I should.

I don't have a problem paying legitimate stars money.
Legit isn't 1 season however. Nylander had a great rookie season but his career just doesn't stop after the one year. Yeah, you are super elite now. Take a break kid. No. You need to be the complete player and what the organization needs you to be.
A core piece that gels and makes the team elite. Not just yourself. Do that, and you'll get paid. Someone else will get traded to make room.


Yeah, I agree with everything you said.

My point is just, if Nylander comes in and gets 70-75 pts, hes going to be making around Draisaitl money. That's almost a guarantee.

- He was drafted 8th overall (Draisaitl 3rd).
- He dominated (PPG) the Swedish league as a teenager (his pt total comparables are mostly super elite players)
- He was PPG in the AHL
- 61 pts as a rookie
- 70-75 pts as a sophomore
(due for a new contract)


You're right, make us pay you. But like I said, if he scores at that rate this year, there is NO DOUBT he's going to be requesting Draisaitl money. He has every reason too and will likely get something comparable.
 

Jack Bauer

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May 30, 2007
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If we end up not being able to resign Gardiner because we are on the hook for year three of Marleau, I would not be pleased. Let's hope it doesn't come to that.

It's never that simple.

It's a $70 mil cap. No 1 contract prevents you from keeping any other 1 player. The system doesn't work that way.

A Gardiner only leaves if we don't pay him market value. We could have the most cap space in the league and we may still walk if we don't agree with his belief in his value.

But 1 contract or a few mil in dead cap space doesn't force him out. There's too many ways around cap issues, as we've proven over the past few years, to worry about things that likely never happen anyway.
 
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