Post-Game Talk: Laine Gets 40 Not Enough - Flyers 2 Jets 1

[AWSAA]

Don't want Toby back next year unless he's taking an 80+% cut in pay and is okay with sitting in the pressbox. Niku deserves a fair look next season.

 

[Easternbull]

I think it is time for a few of my fellow finns to be a bit more objective and be less patriotic.

Little and Enstrom have had their ups and downs this season, but we will need their experience now and especially during the playoffs.

Just because it says "suomi finland" on your passport does not make you a better player then the next guy.

Patty has had many games when hes looked unmotivated, slow and lost boardbattles, Armia is NOT a tops six forward IMHO, Niku can not possibly be ready for the playoffs based on what you have seen in the sm-liiga.

Calm down guys, I'm proud too but ultimately performance is all that counts not nationality.

 

[antiqueslivers]

I really hope at next seasons rookie camp Niku makes it impossible to say no.

 

[Ippenator]

I think it is time for a few of my fellow finns to be a bit more objective and be less patriotic.

Little and Enstrom have had their ups and downs this season, but we will need their experience now and especially during the playoffs.

Just because it says "suomi finland" on your passport does not make you a better player then the next guy.

Patty has had many games when hes looked unmotivated, slow and lost boardbattles like a little girl, Armia is NOT a tops six forward IMHO, Niku can not possibly be ready for the playoffs based on what you have seen in the sm-liiga.

Calm down guys, I'm proud too but ultimately performance is all that counts not nationality.

Sorry to disappoint you but it has nothing to do with any patriotism, at least with me. I value players for only what they do on the ice. I don’t for example see Barkov as a top 10 center in the league, I don’t see Armia as a top 6 player unless there is difficulties with injuries, and I don’t see Kapanen mistreated with him having most of his career in the minors so far. I also don’t see Teemu Pulkkinen having an NHL career in any team that the NHL has. I think a real patriot would most probably see all these things differently. But I might think a bit out from the box compared to what are the mainstreams in hockey nowadays. And that means that I value offence and offensive talent much more than defence and mostly defensive players.

I do believe that you can win both ways, with defensive style and with offensive style, as long as both ways are balanced well enough. But if I can choose, I will choose the offensive way any time, as sports are still supposed to be entertainment. And if every coach and team chooses the nihilistic and overly defensive playstyle, then this sport becomes a goddamn brainless entertainment, which I probably will not want to even keep following. My hope is in these offensively very talented players that can play ok defense and be defensively responsible enough, but still not on the expense of using their offensive skills efficiently.

 

[Ippenator]

By the way I was not exactly talking about replacing Toby this season, unless he will be injured for the rest of the season. But with his constant injuries I just can’t see any point in keeping him still for next season, unless he takes a serious cut to his salary. With the problems that his constant injuries cause to the team balance, he just is not simply worth of his present salary.

 

[Halberdier]

I think it is time for a few of my fellow finns to be a bit more objective and be less patriotic.

Little and Enstrom have had their ups and downs this season, but we will need their experience now and especially during the playoffs.

Just because it says "suomi finland" on your passport does not make you a better player then the next guy.

Patty has had many games when hes looked unmotivated, slow and lost boardbattles like a little girl, Armia is NOT a tops six forward IMHO, Niku can not possibly be ready for the playoffs based on what you have seen in the sm-liiga.

Calm down guys, I'm proud too but ultimately performance is all that counts not nationality.

I do think that the over excitement towards Niku (and Vesalainen) is totally Canadian thing among the Jets fans. Haven't seen Finnish fans rooting that much for them. I for example saw how in speculation some Canadian friends were not signing Buff (our best D by a mile ATM) but adding Niku to the lineup next season for a big role. I'm more than happy if Niku or Vesalainen ever makes it into NHL, but I have no reason to expect more than possibly #4 D and middle-6 or quality bottom-6 F respectively for them.

Armia gets some special love by some Finnish and Canadian fans and obviously sir professor doesn't count as he is not a real person but an imposter of an idiotic Finn. (I don't think he is even a Finn really.) I also value Armia high, but not that high. I would probably try him on a supportive role on top lines to see if he can make those defensively sound as CSW has not been defensively sound. But I don't think he will be a high scoring winger in NHL, even though he has a lot of talent and good hands.

I don't think that the "hate" towards Little is that Finnish thing either. He has long history of being underrated in NHL (I think I had a thread about this last season or at least many posts) and now when he has not exactly been great for this season, that is only exaggerated a lot. If speaking about unfair criticism towards the Jets player, it was actually Laine that got most of that unwarranted crap during the early season, from both Finnish and Canadian fans.

 

[10Ducky10]

I have seen only two games that Niku played this season in the Moose. He was pretty good in those games at least. Some things for sure still need to become better. Some more intensity with his defending mostly. And sure he could use some more strength. But he was really even surprisingly good with his defending in those games.

And no, I havent said that Toby has been bad this season, although he was pretty much awful last season, but as we all know the whole Jets were worse defensively last season. But on the other hand even if Toby has been quite ok or even occasionally good this season, I don’t still see him as somekind of an amazing defensive player. He is not really irreplaceable, and as I have already mentioned I at least believe that Niku is not as far behind him defensively as some of you seem to believe. I havent though claimed that Niku is necessarily at his level yet, but just not too far away. And I believe that Niku could already offer much more with his offensive skills than what Toby can do offensively. What I just mean is that Niku could probably cover the slight difference with the defensive skills with his better offence.

I do understand that some of you long time Jets fans have unquestionable love for your vets, but when time passes they will not be always as good as you got used to, and there can be young promising guys coming that can already replace some vets with their own strengths. They dont need to be always exactly the same strengths that the vets used to have, if they can offer something else that can seriously help the team.

I would say that Little and Toby should probably be first on the line to be replaced, although they both can offer some good things still, but they have clear weaknesses too. For Toby his biggest weakness is being so damn injury prone, and for Little it is his lack of offence and playmaking for a 2nd line center. He sure can defend well and so can Toby, but they both are way too expensive for the weaknesses that they put on the table. There are younger guys whom could give better value for their salaries, so I’m just really trying to think of what would be best for the team honestly.

Wow, you've seen Niku play twice in the AHL and you can tell he is better than Enstrom!!!
Either he played spectacularly or you are some kind of super-scout ........................................................................................... or you're wrong.

 

[Ippenator]

Wow, you've seen Niku play twice in the AHL and you can tell he is better than Enstrom!!!
Either he played spectacularly or you are some kind of super-scout ........................................................................................... or you're wrong.

Did I say he is better than Toby? I just said the he is not as far defensively, as some of you think, and that he is offensively better, which I’m absolutely sure of anyway. And the most important thing is still that Toby is so much injured that he is pretty much a waste of cap space, with the salary that he has at the moment.

 

[HannuJ]

Did I say he is better than Toby?/QUOTE]
i am pretty sure that, a few pages back, you literally say he's as good as Toby.

 

[10Ducky10]

Did I say he is better than Toby? I just said the he is not as far defensively, as some of you think, and that he is offensively better, which I’m absolutely sure of anyway. And the most important thing is still that Toby is so much injured that he is pretty much a waste of cap space, with the salary that he has at the moment.

If Niku is pretty close to Enstrom defensively, he would be playing with the Jets. I mean seeing as he is so much better offensively...
If you ask me, Niku would be lucky to end up as good, defensively, as Enstrom.
As far as reading your posts, I do but some of them don't make any sense in English. Post #300 for example.

 

[Ippenator]

If Niku is pretty close to Enstrom defensively, he would be playing with the Jets. I mean seeing as he is so much better offensively...
If you ask me, Niku would be lucky to end up as good, defensively, as Enstrom.
As far as reading your posts, I do but some of them don't make any sense in English. Post #300 for example.

Things don’t go in fact like you say now with a veteran loving coach like Maurice. At least if the players are pretty close in quality. Also Maurice wants in these close call situations to school European players a bit to the North American ways better. And honestly I don’t even see anything wrong about it for about a season or so, when it is clearly more like a close call situation like it has anyway been with Niku.

And still I was talking really about next season or pretty much near future anyway. I haven’t really been praising Niku here much at all. It has been in my opinion mostly North American fans here posing very positive things about him.

I’m really more just thinking of options to replace in the near future these declining veterans that Little and Enström are quite clearly in my opinion. It’s really surpising how strong veteran love some of you seem to have here. Just refusing to admit that some of your long time hero’s have started to decline and shouldn’t really be a part of a real cup contender that the Jets could be if the cap space is cleared to keep the much more skilled and dynamic players that the Jets will need to be real cup contenders on an annual basis.

Little and Enström will be both a problem if they get to continue for the Jets still after this season. Especially if it happens with the salary that they have at the moment, or even with salary quite close to it.

 

[YWGinYYZ]

Since this thread now resembles 10 other threads rather than being a place to discuss the results of last game, I think it's time to move on.

Aavco's posted a pre-game for the next shindig.

Closed.