Kopitar vs J. Staal

[RightKinger]

That's why I was wondering why there is a thread comparing Kopitar to Jordan Staal. It's like having a thread comparing Sidney Crosby to Jason Chimera.

That's about the gap between Kopitar and J Staal.

Dude please stop posting stuff like this. Your making Kings fans look bad. Kopitar is great and he might be on the level of Crosby, Ovechkin, etc. but Staal is no slouch either. I watched the Pens games this season and he has also looked impressive. Not as impressive as Kopitar but the gap between them is not as big as you think. Now if Kopitar keeps scoring at this pace...

 

[Peter James Bond]

Dude please stop posting stuff like this. Your making Kings fans look bad. Kopitar is great and he might be on the level of Crosby, Ovechkin, etc. but Staal is no slouch either. I watched the Pens games this season and he has also looked impressive. Not as impressive as Kopitar but the gap between them is not as big as you think. Now if Kopitar keeps scoring at this pace...

Okay. I've only seen Staal play one game this season. He looked okay, but he's not controlling the play on the ice, as Anze is. I can't recall seeing a 19 year old control the play at 19 on the ice the way he has, do all the little things on every shift, and ooze hockey sense except for Crosby and Ovechkin the last decade. Not even Thornton, Staal or Spezza were controlling the play on the ice at 19. I was actually holding reservation until I saw Anze the first two games. They are only two games, but if you've seen his every shift in those two games, you've witnessed a player that is exceptional in every facet and situation he's faced. He's been double teamed and still got an assist on that play, he's beaten Pronger, he's beaten Giguere in tight by being patient, he's been in the crease, in the corners, killed penalties, won key faceoffs and has stood out every shift. 7 shots on goal in his first game.

Anze isn't just racking up points on the PP. 4 of his 5 points are even strength. He is tied for first in the NHL with 4 even strength points.

4 ESP (even strength points)

http://www.nhl.com/nhlstats/app?fet...=page&sort=evenStrengthPoints&viewName=points

I was just baffled as to the top ten Calder candidates thread awhile ago and several didn't even have Kopitar on their list...and several who did had him 7th or
8th. He is clearly a special talent. It's not just me that was saying stuff that was considered outlandish. An NHL scout called Anze a "more talented Joe Thornton"
Former GM Jack Ferreria said that Anze was just as talented as Kariya at 19.
Yet unless your a King fan on HF Anze isn't that special.

 

[Ryan Van Horne]

Yet unless your a King fan on HF Anze isn't that special.

Howdy there. Not a Kings fan, but a huge Kopitar fan. I drafted him two years ago in my keeper pool in the sixth round. Pretty happy now, though I know it's still early. I think the lack of respect comes from his background. He's from an unknown hockey country, but what few people realize is he tore up the Swedish junior league as a 17-year-old and played very well in their Elite league at 18. Also, has done very well in international play, including last spring at Worlds.

So, despite this, people still think of him as hockey's answer to the Jamaican bobsledder. A big fish from a very small pond. He'll have to prove a lot of people wrong, I guess. I'd say he's off to a good start.

 

[FlameofTheWest]

I started this thread before Kopitar or Staal had both played their 1st games. Just because I know Staal is a name everyone knows but I knew in my heart there wasnt really a comparison to be made. Im not trying to bash Staal at all, I think hes going to be a very good power foward and help the pens alot. I think Kopitar is something completely different though, Kopitar possess the overall game to play on the PP and PK now at 19. Take into consideration that hes playing under a coach like Crawford and you understand how special this kid is. Crawford isnt some first year boob of a coach, this guy knows talent and knows what hes doing. You have to believe that he knows what hes doing with this kid and not just throwing him out there. Ive been waiting on kopitar since before he slid to 11, but my gosh i didnt know he had the kind of skating ability hes shown thus far. Skating was pointed out as one of his weakness as I remember. To see him get by Pronger like that at his size was awe inspiring. Remember its not like Kopitar is surronded by a bunch high level talent. Frolov is a great pairing and they are developing a great chemistry. But its getting to the point when Kopitars line comes out he drawing the other teams shut down players. Great start for a potentially great young player

 

[Randall Graves*]

Okay. I've only seen Staal play one game this season. He looked okay, but he's not controlling the play on the ice, as Anze is. I can't recall seeing a 19 year old control the play at 19 on the ice the way he has, do all the little things on every shift, and ooze hockey sense except for Crosby and Ovechkin the last decade. Not even Thornton, Staal or Spezza were controlling the play on the ice at 19. I was actually holding reservation until I saw Anze the first two games. They are only two games, but if you've seen his every shift in those two games, you've witnessed a player that is exceptional in every facet and situation he's faced. He's been double teamed and still got an assist on that play, he's beaten Pronger, he's beaten Giguere in tight by being patient, he's been in the crease, in the corners, killed penalties, won key faceoffs and has stood out every shift. 7 shots on goal in his first game.

Anze isn't just racking up points on the PP. 4 of his 5 points are even strength. He is tied for first in the NHL with 4 even strength points.

4 ESP (even strength points)

http://www.nhl.com/nhlstats/app?fet...=page&sort=evenStrengthPoints&viewName=points

I was just baffled as to the top ten Calder candidates thread awhile ago and several didn't even have Kopitar on their list...and several who did had him 7th or
8th. He is clearly a special talent. It's not just me that was saying stuff that was considered outlandish. An NHL scout called Anze a "more talented Joe Thornton"
Former GM Jack Ferreria said that Anze was just as talented as Kariya at 19.
Yet unless your a King fan on HF Anze isn't that special.

Staal isn't nearly as NHL ready as Kopitar.

as for the more talented Joe Thornton quote..yeah Kopitars more talented than a future HOF'er

 

[FuTMaR*]

Staal isn't nearly as NHL ready as Kopitar.

as for the more talented Joe Thornton quote..yeah Kopitars more talented than a future HOF'er

thornton wont be in the HOF if he cant score a playoff goal

 

[Static]

thornton wont be in the HOF if he cant score a playoff goal

If he replicates last season a few times he will.

 

[jurtur]

Staal isn't nearly as NHL ready as Kopitar.

as for the more talented Joe Thornton quote..yeah Kopitars more talented than a future HOF'er

The scout didnt say he is more talented version of Joe Thornton at the moment , but they projected him in the near or far future to become a more talented version of Joe Thornton (better speed and shot)

 

[Randall Graves*]

The scout didnt say he is more talented version of Joe Thornton at the moment , but they projected him in the near or far future to become a more talented version of Joe Thornton (better speed and shot)

And I say that is ridiculous, Thornton despite his chokeability is still probably the 2nd or 3rd most offensively gifted player in the league. Mark Bell is going to have a career year..and it ain't because of Cheechoo.

 

[Haik]

Staal isn't nearly as NHL ready as Kopitar.

as for the more talented Joe Thornton quote..yeah Kopitars more talented than a future HOF'er

A few good seasons don't get you in the hall of fame.

 

[jurtur]

And I say that is ridiculous, Thornton despite his chokeability is still probably the 2nd or 3rd most offensively gifted player in the league. Mark Bell is going to have a career year..and it ain't because of Cheechoo.

So is Frolov and it ain't because of Willsie .

 

[dabeechman]

So you find it amusing to say kopitar couldnt possibly be compared to a HOF'er? Is it because he's only played two nhl games at a 2.5ppg pace playing AGAINST HOF d-men, or because your a duck fan?

 

[jfont]

And I say that is ridiculous, Thornton despite his chokeability is still probably the 2nd or 3rd most offensively gifted player in the league. Mark Bell is going to have a career year..and it ain't because of Cheechoo.

i agree...

if i'm going to build a team around a player, that would be thornton...

 

[RightKinger]

Kopitar with another point tonight. He didn't play as good as he did the first two games but he still got a point and the Kings won. That's 6 points in 3 games for Kopitar!!

 

[touchbelini]

Kopitar with another point tonight. He didn't play as good as he did the first two games but he still got a point and the Kings won. That's 6 points in 3 games for Kopitar!!

He looks like an elite centermen. Right up there with Crosby, staal, and spezza. I know it's been 2 games, But Crosby got all that hype coming in to last year, even before he put his skates on. At least Kopitar has a few NHL goals. They didn't make him the first line center for no reason.

 

[Chimaera]

If you compare the two right now, in the short run Kopitar is the better player. Obviously he is more ready to be an NHL player, whereas J. Staal needs another year or two of seasoning, filling out and polish.

Down the road, if you look at projections, one might make a solid case for taking J. Staal of the two. Kopitar could fizzle out, could face added pressure, could hurt himself, etc. I don't know if that is the case, but it could happen. He could also never reach his potential, or various other courses of his progression. Right now, Kopitar looks pretty good, and could keep improving and become a dominant player in the league.

But I wonder if both hit potential, which would be more important? Kopitar has more dynamic ability, and down the road might put up more points (he probably will) but will he have the physical defensive game Staal already shows signs of having some of?

The problem with Staal's draft status is this... a good portion of it is based on the potential that he will develop into something of an Eric Staal clone in a similar amount of time. Certainly, he might, but that is a RISKY gamble. Especially for a team that needs to address other areas down the road. Now shifting him to the wing that even makes the pick more questionable. You don't take a guy who is projecting as a physical, point scoring (but defensively able) centerman and shift him to the wing... That could stunt his growth considerably. It could pay off, but it is a risk that is somewhat tricky... Maybe the Pens figure they can move the worst out of Malkin/Staal and Crosby for whatever position of need they want down the road.

From what I've read and seen of J. Staal so far, I think he has a chance to end up like Eric, but he still is a LONG way from that end. He might get there, or he might end up like a Patrick Stefan or worse. Hopefully he doesn't take nights off or just kinda coast when he should dominate. His numbers in Juniors this year should be telling about his eventual progression.

 

[#66]

If you compare the two right now, in the short run Kopitar is the better player. Obviously he is more ready to be an NHL player, whereas J. Staal needs another year or two of seasoning, filling out and polish.

Down the road, if you look at projections, one might make a solid case for taking J. Staal of the two. Kopitar could fizzle out, could face added pressure, could hurt himself, etc. I don't know if that is the case, but it could happen. He could also never reach his potential, or various other courses of his progression. Right now, Kopitar looks pretty good, and could keep improving and become a dominant player in the league.

But I wonder if both hit potential, which would be more important? Kopitar has more dynamic ability, and down the road might put up more points (he probably will) but will he have the physical defensive game Staal already shows signs of having some of?

The problem with Staal's draft status is this... a good portion of it is based on the potential that he will develop into something of an Eric Staal clone in a similar amount of time. Certainly, he might, but that is a RISKY gamble. Especially for a team that needs to address other areas down the road. Now shifting him to the wing that even makes the pick more questionable. You don't take a guy who is projecting as a physical, point scoring (but defensively able) centerman and shift him to the wing... That could stunt his growth considerably. It could pay off, but it is a risk that is somewhat tricky... Maybe the Pens figure they can move the worst out of Malkin/Staal and Crosby for whatever position of need they want down the road.

From what I've read and seen of J. Staal so far, I think he has a chance to end up like Eric, but he still is a LONG way from that end. He might get there, or he might end up like a Patrick Stefan or worse. Hopefully he doesn't take nights off or just kinda coast when he should dominate. His numbers in Juniors this year should be telling about his eventual progression.

Thats a great post but IMO Staals game will come around to be more like Jeff Carter than Eric. I'll go with an Eric Staal comparison for Toews.

As for a Kopitar vs. Staal comparison, I think it will be very close in the long run. Kopitar has some very good offensive sense and a great pair of hands. Staal's advanced defensive game and underlining skill should make for a very high end, two-way power center in the near future. IMO the player that you see now isn't even close to being the finished product, in Staals case. He has some very correctable skating flaws and has the character to take care of them.

 

[Redwingsfan]

If you compare the two right now, in the short run Kopitar is the better player. Obviously he is more ready to be an NHL player, whereas J. Staal needs another year or two of seasoning, filling out and polish.

Down the road, if you look at projections, one might make a solid case for taking J. Staal of the two. Kopitar could fizzle out, could face added pressure, could hurt himself, etc. I don't know if that is the case, but it could happen. He could also never reach his potential, or various other courses of his progression. Right now, Kopitar looks pretty good, and could keep improving and become a dominant player in the league.

But I wonder if both hit potential, which would be more important? Kopitar has more dynamic ability, and down the road might put up more points (he probably will) but will he have the physical defensive game Staal already shows signs of having some of?

and this cant happen to staal it looks like some of you are trying to make a desperate case for staal. i dont know why because kopitar has clearly proven that right now he is the better player and prospect. and will probably be in the future to. i picked him #2 overall in my pool(malkin was #1 and Thornton#3). and everyone said i made a very good pick.

The problem with Staal's draft status is this... a good portion of it is based on the potential that he will develop into something of an Eric Staal clone in a similar amount of time. Certainly, he might, but that is a RISKY gamble. Especially for a team that needs to address other areas down the road. Now shifting him to the wing that even makes the pick more questionable. You don't take a guy who is projecting as a physical, point scoring (but defensively able) centerman and shift him to the wing... That could stunt his growth considerably. It could pay off, but it is a risk that is somewhat tricky... Maybe the Pens figure they can move the worst out of Malkin/Staal and Crosby for whatever position of need they want down the road.

From what I've read and seen of J. Staal so far, I think he has a chance to end up like Eric, but he still is a LONG way from that end. He might get there, or he might end up like a Patrick Stefan or worse. Hopefully he doesn't take nights off or just kinda coast when he should dominate. His numbers in Juniors this year should be telling about his eventual progression.

and this cant happen to staal?? it looks like sme of you are trying to make a desperate case for staal. and i dont understand why. kopitar has clearly shown that he is the best player and prospect and will be in the future. i picked kopitar #2 in my pool(malkin#1 and thornton#3)

 

[Metallian*]

Thank god you're not the GM of any NHL team.

there were ten guys picked before kopitar in the 05 draft

and kopitar > staal

so its not that far off


personally, i wouldnt have drafted staal in the top 5 for sure, 10 might be stretching it with this years lineup

 

[ArchieIsGod]

and this cant happen to staal?? it looks like sme of you are trying to make a desperate case for staal. and i dont understand why. kopitar has clearly shown that he is the best player and prospect and will be in the future. i picked kopitar #2 in my pool(malkin#1 and thornton#3)

you picked kopitar over joe thornton???

 

[Redwingsfan]

you picked kopitar over joe thornton???

yes i did and im happy i did it. thornton will definitely produce, but im going with a young team. its not that thornton is old, but i want younger guys. and its a keeper league btw. my team right now is

forwards
kopitar
brule
havlat
erat
kesler


d-men
barker
seabrook
weber
green

goalie
raycroft

and im picking another young guy in the 8th round today.

 

[Redwingsfan]

there were ten guys picked before kopitar in the 05 draft

and kopitar > staal

so its not that far off


personally, i wouldnt have drafted staal in the top 5 for sure, 10 might be stretching it with this years lineup

nice to see someone agree with me on this. people allways think the players drafted # 1, 2, and 3 will be the best players and that never happens.

 

[backofthenet]

I want to try to put this all in prospective for the guys that are not Kings fans.

For the longest time we have gone through medicroty. A severe bout of mediocrity.

We had guys like Berg, Storr, Steckle and so on in the first round.
We trade Jokinen for Palffy because we were going to run for the Cup.
Allison quit on us. Deadmarsh got hurt. Pallfy left.

Our teams were let downs, our coaches and GM's were boring. Our play on the ice was uninspired. Hell, we looked to Avery as our fan favorite.

In one year, things have changed. A lot. Things are actually looking up and we are getting nods from other true NHL fans.

We now have a respected GM and head coach. There are all new faces behind the bench and in the front offices.

O'Sullivan is on track, Brenier is signed already, Lewis got out of the gates very quickly and our big center Boyle that we drafted BEFORE Corry Perry was off the board is now the captain of Boston U. and put up 5 points in the opener.

Then, on our big club, we have Cammy that has not lost his scoring touch, Frolov who seems may have been shaken awake in the offseaon and Lubo who started right where he left off.

Then we add Jack Johnson. JACK JOHNSON! And he said that he wants to play with Blake! He will be here next season.

Sure, Brown looks a little out of place and Cloutier let in two softies, but overall...

Then, there is Kopitar. A guy we were cautious about. There were even some Kings fans that wanted to trade him last year at the deadline because he was not proven. Now he is tearing it up. He is scoring and skating and smiling. He is having fun, the team is having fun and the fans are starting to come out. We FINALLY have something to brag about.

We have a Calder Cup hopeful.

It is finally feeling pretty good to be a Kings fan. There is actually light at the end of the tunnel and the tunnel seems to be getting shorter.

So, sorry for getting so hyped, but it does feel good. Kopitar is the real deal and we are stoked.

 

[Crazyhorse]

When he played in Sweden, ive allways figured he would play in the NHL one day. He where a leader back then too, but his teammates wherent so good.
The most positive thing about this, in my book, is that this is a guy, coming out from one of the smallest countrys in europe, putting up great points, in a great league, in a great sport.
Hopefully, this can send some signals to other places where hockey is growing. In the longterm, this could mean much to Slovenia. These are countrys that are urging for recognition, and by creating this kind of players, they realize they are on the right track.

 

[Randall Graves*]

So you find it amusing to say kopitar couldnt possibly be compared to a HOF'er? Is it because he's only played two nhl games at a 2.5ppg pace playing AGAINST HOF d-men, or because your a duck fan?

Yeah that's exactly it, because Kopitar is a King i'm saying it's ridiculous that he's a 'more talented' Joe Thornton.

and please quit putting so much weight into stats after 2-3 games.. OMG KYLE WELLWOOD IS GOING TO SCORE 160 POINTS!