GDT: Knights @ Canes, Rage!

tarheelhockey

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Feb 12, 2010
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What I find perplexing is that we had a really specific issue with Eddie Lack as a goalie who liked to play deep in his crease, which supposedly was a concern under the Peters system of defense, and yet everything I've seen of Darling suggests he has the same style. So I'm kind of stumped as to why the front office thought Darling would be a better fit, given that he's such a similar goalie on a number of levels.
 

GoCanes2015

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Oct 14, 2017
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There's at least a bit of blame to go with Peters' system, given how generally poorly the Canes have been executing the pinch - pass to the middle, rush approach. How many games have our D-men (sometimes forwards) fail on a pass in the defensive zone, giving it right up to an opponent in front of the net? I think Faulk had 2 against VGK that I recall. The other truth is that the Canes are not an exceptionally skilled team, soup to nuts. Many guys have "a" skill - a shot, speed, good stick, good skating. How many of them have 2 or 3 of those skills at the same time? Aho? We know where he is, counting red and green m&ms and reciting fairy tales in german for a few more days/weeks. Who's left?

Skinner can skate as long as he doesn't touch the puck at the same time. His shot is okay but he floats around the outside.
Staal is a great defensive center and decent linemate, but has zero touch.
Williams grinds hard and handles the puck decently, but even he won't do much more than that.
Nordstrom, McGinn, PDG, all love to skate really fast, and then turn the puck over or lose it on the boards.
Lindholm is trying, there may be hope for him.
Stempniak was off for almost a year, but is a good playmaker for Skinner (see his notes above)

I'm always struck and the gap in quality of stick-to-stick passes, laser-sharp puck cycling, airing on passes, all the little things that make a team better and give any goalie a bit more confidence and comfort with a team's "rhythm"

We just don't have the quality we need yet. We can get it (Mr. Dundon) but it's not here this year. We have a game where they tease with what could be, and then throw up a stinker (revert to the norm?) that shows what this team truly is.
 

geehaad

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What I find perplexing is that we had a really specific issue with Eddie Lack as a goalie who liked to play deep in his crease, which supposedly was a concern under the Peters system of defense, and yet everything I've seen of Darling suggests he has the same style. So I'm kind of stumped as to why the front office thought Darling would be a better fit, given that he's such a similar goalie on a number of levels.
It makes me wonder if that particular bit of analysis ever made it to the 4th floor of PNC Arena.
 

tarheelhockey

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It makes me wonder if that particular bit of analysis ever made it to the 4th floor of PNC Arena.

I wonder if they even perceived crease depth to be the core problem with Lack. That "make a ****ing save" comment wasn't exactly the sound of a guy who thinks there's a technical issue going on. Between the way they treated Lack and the contract they gave Darling, it sure seems like the front office believes that big deep-crease goalies can be successful under Peters.

It's just a really strange disconnect that I find very puzzling. Makes me wonder what the heck is going on behind the scenes as they try to figure this stuff out. Do we simply lack someone who's capable of scouting a goalie correctly? Are we just getting really unlucky with headcases?
 

geehaad

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I wonder if they even perceived crease depth to be the core problem with Lack. That "make a ****ing save" comment wasn't exactly the sound of a guy who thinks there's a technical issue going on. Between the way they treated Lack and the contract they gave Darling, it sure seems like the front office believes that big deep-crease goalies can be successful under Peters.

It's just a really strange disconnect that I find very puzzling. Makes me wonder what the heck is going on behind the scenes as they try to figure this stuff out. Do we simply lack someone who's capable of scouting a goalie correctly? Are we just getting really unlucky with headcases?

To be fair, Kevin Woodley's interview comments came after Peters' outburst...they were the result of the outburst, in fact. [EDIT: But I get your point, that outburst didn't sound like he was aware of the technicalities involved.] Were Woodley's comments simply one man's opinion, or conventional wisdom for those who know the goaltending position? He sure made it sound as if it was a plainly obvious issue.

Btw, this sheds a little light on why I have little patience when people in this forum talk about something as if it is a fact, and when I say "that's your opinion", they say something like "of course it's my opinion", as if it's ridiculous to point that out. Making definitive statements without any acknowledgement that it's your opinion can lead others who are perhaps ignorant to accept it as common knowledge. It's not ridiculous point out the controversy. I think it's far more ridiculous to speak of a highly subjective matter without tempering your thoughts whatsoever.
 
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bleedgreen

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Sending him down is not trying to humiliate him. It’s to let him play regularly/work through his horrendous technique and awful attitude without sinking this team even further than he already has. He’s making his money regardless of where he plays so his salary should mostly be an afterthought. I already acknowledged why it would take balls to do this (neither goalie down there is good enough either) and why I can understand he won’t do it.

Enough making excuses for Francis and Darling. These are grown men being paid very well to do their jobs, or in our case, not do their jobs.
Awful attitude?

Cmon man. Gimme a break.

As far as his play in Chicago. It looked pretty similar to be honest. He was very scrambly, and at his best stayed deep and played patient. The second he got pulled out of position he was flopping like a fish. He didn’t look any more graceful.
 

Ole Gil

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May 9, 2009
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Who else was there? Raanta? A 37 year old Ryan Miller?

Maybe, in hindsight, that was the way to go. Get two confirmed meh goalies. So even though you don't have a shot of getting Vezina goaltending, you also don't end up in a position where you take an L anytime the backup is going in.

At this point, it's not that the team needs a great goaltender. Okay would be a hell of a thing.
 

garnetpalmetto

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it could simply be francis struck out on fleury and bishop, and since the narrative was, the canes missed the playoffs because of horribad goaltending, he had to do something.

Who else was there? Raanta? A 37 year old Ryan Miller?

Your UFA/RFA goalies at the close of last season and where they went:

UFA
Jonathan Bernier (ANA)
Reto Berra (FLA)
Jean-Francois Berube (NYI)
Ben Bishop (LAK)
Sam Brittain (FLA)
Scott Darling (CHI)
Brian Elliott (CGY)
Magnus Hellberg (NYR)
Chad Johnson (CGY)
Steve Mason (PHI)
Ryan Miller (VAN)
Anders Nilsson (BUF)
Matthew O'Connor (OTT)
Ondrej Pavelec (WPG)
Jeremy Smith (COL)

So of the UFAs, Bernier went to Colorado, Berra and Miller went to Anaheim, Berube to Chicago, Bishop to Dallas, Brittain stayed in Florida, Darling and Smith came here, Elliott went to Philly, Hellberg went to HC Kunlun Red Star in the KHL, Johnson went to Buffalo, Mason went to Winnipeg, Nilsson went to Vancouver, O'Connor to Nashville, and Pavelec to the Rangers.

RFA
Jon Gillies (CGY)
Philipp Grubauer (WAS)
Connor Hellebuyck (WPG)
Robin Lehner (BUF)
Anthony Stolarz (PHI)
 

Canes

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Oct 31, 2017
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Awful attitude?

Cmon man. Gimme a break.

As far as his play in Chicago. It looked pretty similar to be honest. He was very scrambly, and at his best stayed deep and played patient. The second he got pulled out of position he was flopping like a fish. He didn’t look any more graceful.
Do you see his reactions whenever he gives up a goal? Almost every single time he looks like a complete mental case waiting to go off. I've never seen anything like it. Something's clearly not right with him.

This franchise has no idea how to identify goalie talent. It's laughably bad.
 

bluedevil58

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Oct 19, 2017
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Do you see his reactions whenever he gives up a goal? Almost every single time he looks like a complete mental case waiting to go off. I've never seen anything like it. Something's clearly not right with him.

This franchise has no idea how to identify goalie talent. It's laughably bad.

Arturs Irbe

#NeverForget
 

bleedgreen

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Do you see his reactions whenever he gives up a goal? Almost every single time he looks like a complete mental case waiting to go off. I've never seen anything like it. Something's clearly not right with him.

This franchise has no idea how to identify goalie talent. It's laughably bad.
Feeling the pressure is different than having an "awful attitude". The guy clearly wants to live up to his hype. Awful would be if he didn't seem to care.
 

bleedgreen

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As far as Bishop goes, why is this on the table for discussion still? Why would he choose us over Dallas? He’s clearly in win the cup right now mode, not to mention the contract - which we wouldn’t have ever signed. Especially under old management.

He wasn’t a good fit for this team. We’re growing towards the playoffs, not fighting for the cup immediately.
 

bluedevil58

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Oct 19, 2017
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As far as Bishop goes, why is this on the table for discussion still? Why would he choose us over Dallas? He’s clearly in win the cup right now mode, not to mention the contract - which we wouldn’t have ever signed. Especially under old management.

He wasn’t a good fit for this team. We’re growing towards the playoffs, not fighting for the cup immediately.

Judging by our signings or lack there of. I would say we are not growing towards the playoffs.
 

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