Speculation: Jets General Rumour, Trade, Free Agent and Waiver Speculation 16-17 Part XVII

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Aavco Cup

"I can make you cry in this room"
Sep 5, 2013
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This assumes we live in a world where once a mistake is made, we are locked into that mistake and need to kick rocks for half a decade waiting for the mistake to fix itself.

Of course, that also assumes, our organization can recognize a mistake when they made one. Last summer, PoMo was talking about Stuart as a potential captain. Two years ago Chevy was puffing out his chest after Pavelec's fluke season and said he was just coming into his prime.

For me it's just time to move on. Pavelec is gone forever.
 

Whileee

Registered User
May 29, 2010
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The market price for replacement goaltenders and depth players is late round picks and/or less than $2M in free agency but keep pretending that the only option we ever had was the path that Chevy has been bumbling his way down.

The Jets were not a replacement goalie away from contending. I don't know why that's even considered an option. They had hot goaltending in 2014/15, kept UFAs (Frolik) and went out and got depth via picks, and were swept in the first round.

I would have strongly objected if the Jets had decided to do even more to build a mediocre team by trading off picks and picking up UFAs instead of sticking with the plan of building a highly talented and deep young core through trading vets for prospects and picks and through the draft. I much prefer where this franchise stands now to where it would stand if they had taken that route.
 

Blue Shakehead

because lol Jets
Mar 18, 2011
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Sure, could've done that. You wouldn't have Ehlers or Laine or trouba though. And you wouldn't ever win a cup that way.

Actually, we were debating whether the only options Chevy had to address depth and goaltending were to trade away our 1sts or overpay free agents? Turns out there were other options.

Now you are starting a new hypothetical, which incorrectly assumes that the 2017-18 Jets were put together through Chevy's intelligent design....that somehow he hatched a plan in 2011 that started by overpaying Pavelec for 5 years which was just enough time to stink for long enough that we could finish 24th place 2016 which just so happened to be the correct combination of ping pong balls to draft Patrik Laine with all the while scooping up other goodies along the way.

And if you believe all of that, I'm sure TNSE has some land on the moon to sell you for fair market value plus a nominal moon seat deposit, ticketmaster's gravitational surcharge, lunar convenience fee and an egg management fee.
 

Blue Shakehead

because lol Jets
Mar 18, 2011
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The Jets were not a replacement goalie away from contending. I don't know why that's even considered an option. They had hot goaltending in 2014/15, kept UFAs (Frolik) and went out and got depth via picks, and were swept in the first round.

I would have strongly objected if the Jets had decided to do even more to build a mediocre team by trading off picks and picking up UFAs instead of sticking with the plan of building a highly talented and deep young core through trading vets for prospects and picks and through the draft. I much prefer where this franchise stands now to where it would stand if they had taken that route.

Find me where I said we were a replacement goalie away from contending and I will change my avatar to Chevy. Nobody said that. You are the only person saying it and its an obvious misdirection and moving of the goalposts.

We could have replaced Pavelec every single year from 2012-2016 with better and cheaper options and the absolute worst place we'd have been in is the same place we are today - which is in need of a goaltending upgrade this summer to help Hellebuyck.
 

Whileee

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Actually, we were debating whether the only options Chevy had to address depth and goaltending were to trade away our 1sts or overpay free agents? Turns out there were other options.

Now you are starting a new hypothetical, which incorrectly assumes that the 2017-18 Jets were put together through Chevy's intelligent design....that somehow he hatched a plan in 2011 that started by overpaying Pavelec for 5 years which was just enough time to stink for long enough that we could finish 24th place 2016 which just so happened to be the correct combination of ping pong balls to draft Patrik Laine with all the while scooping up other goodies along the way.

And if you believe all of that, I'm sure TNSE has some land on the moon to sell you for fair market value plus a nominal moon seat deposit, ticketmaster's gravitational surcharge, lunar convenience fee and an egg management fee.

I am looking at the results, which is the roster and the prospects in the system. They are vastly improved from 2011 in every way. Even with a player like Tkachuk or Sergachev instead of Laine, the organization would be in very good shape - much better shape than if they had tried to build around the original core without any prospect depth to rely on.

They laid out a strategy and have generally pursued it effectively and now have a strong roster and a deep and high quality prospect pool. Now they are in a strong position to fill roster gaps to build a young contender. I think they should have been more aggressive, but I suppose they wanted to ensure that fans looking for a modicum of success in the near term were considered.
 

Whileee

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May 29, 2010
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Find me where I said we were a replacement goalie away from contending and I will change my avatar to Chevy. Nobody said that. You are the only person saying it and its an obvious misdirection and moving of the goalposts.

We could have replaced Pavelec every single year from 2012-2016 with better and cheaper options and the absolute worst place we'd have been in is the same place we are today - which is in need of a goaltending upgrade this summer to help Hellebuyck.

Okay, you said bad goaltending and coaching.

Doesn't the Pavs discussion ever get old for you? Is it the only defining aspect of the Jets management and development process? Would we even be having this conversation still if Hellebuyck had replicated his rookie season, as most expected? (Never mind the last question. I'm pretty sure we would.)
 

Mortimer Snerd

You kids get off my lawn!
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Jun 10, 2014
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I'd say that if we were any other organization in the NHL this next season would be the make or break for the coaching/head office staff. Ownership and fans have been patient but this team should be in the playoffs. But we are the Jets and Chevy/PMO must have some pictures ownership doesnt want getting out or soemthing.....

What makes you think that next season is not make or break?

No one has been extended yet. Not doubting there will be some extensions but they haven't happened yet.

I don't think Chevy is on the hot seat yet but it has to be a make or break for Maurice - even if he gets an extension.
 

Blue Shakehead

because lol Jets
Mar 18, 2011
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Okay, you said bad goaltending and coaching.

Doesn't the Pavs discussion ever get old for you? Is it the only defining aspect of the Jets management and development process? Would we even be having this conversation still if Hellebuyck had replicated his rookie season, as most expected? (Never mind the last question. I'm pretty sure we would.)

This isn't about Pavelec. Its about management incompetence. For instance, right now we need a good goalie, a new head coach to improve special teams and we need to ship Stuart and Chiarot to the Moose. Don't resign Thorburn. How many of these things are likely to happen?

Darling and Bishop are gone. We are keeping Paul Maruce. Chiarot is here to stay. There is probably a 90% chance Stuart is on the 23 man roster and a 50% chance Thorburn is as well.

And when we are in 9th place in the west next year, we will be talking about the injuries again.
 

Peggy

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Aug 6, 2016
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This isn't about Pavelec. Its about management incompetence. For instance, right now we need a good goalie, a new head coach to improve special teams and we need to ship Stuart and Chiarot to the Moose. Don't resign Thorburn. How many of these things are likely to happen?

Darling and Bishop are gone. We are keeping Paul Maruce. Chiarot is here to stay. There is probably a 90% chance Stuart is on the 23 man roster and a 50% chance Thorburn is as well.

And when we are in 9th place in the west next year, we will be talking about the injuries again.

Expansion saves chevy and Paul

Injuries also saved Paul Maurices job for at least another season

I think any other team who's serious about contending woudlve let him go

But the jets are trying to build a foundation. That it's not just a business, but a family
It looks this way anyways
And I have no problem with that when it's a new franchise, but eventually you gotta make some real moves to be competitive
And so Paul Maurice gets one more season
 
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