Laval Rocket: Jean-François Houle Discussion Thread

[HABitual Fan]

He's not a Therrien level neanderthal by a long shot, but by his own admission he's a classic north-south defensive system oriented coach. As I said, I do like what he's done with a lot of the kids and I'm perfectly fine with him staying. I just really liked the new approach Joel Bouchard was bringing when he was the coach, he's closer to what my ideal farm team coach should be. Thanks a bunch for the compliments ;⁠-⁠)

Bouchard was a failure as a coach in Laval. Developed nobody, won nothing, and was never an Organization first guy. No way would his ego allow him to take orders from a nobody like MSL. All he cared about as he showed, was advancing his own career, when that didn't happen fast enough, he grabbed the puck and left like an entitled brat. He ran all the veterans out of town, but of course ALL of them were bad apples. He took a job where he made it clear he wanted to replace the NHL coach, only to be fired instead.. So much for organization first.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

He's not a Therrien level neanderthal by a long shot, but by his own admission he's a classic north-south defensive system oriented coach. As I said, I do like what he's done with a lot of the kids and I'm perfectly fine with him staying. I just really liked the new approach Joel Bouchard was bringing when he was the coach, he's closer to what my ideal farm team coach should be. Thanks a bunch for the compliments ;⁠-⁠)

He is using and 100% implementing MSL's system so even if he is a north/south guy he is not currently practising it at all.

With the current regime the emphasis is on the AHL adopting the NHL team's strategies and tactics to help facilitate a seamless transition from Laval to Montreal for players who get called up. So, without any tactical/system related criticisms that are just not possible with Houle, I just don't see any obvious area for criticism that are not heavily based on pre-conceived judgments due to many anecdotal sources, not the least of which is simply the past affiliation with Bergevin which is by a large margin driving the negative narrative surrounding Houle on this board.

Looking forward to your next avatar as well!

 

[teamfirst]

Bouchard was a failure as a coach in Laval. Developed nobody, won nothing, and was never an Organization first guy. No way would his ego allow him to take orders from a nobody like MSL. All he cared about as he showed, was advancing his own career, when that didn't happen fast enough, he grabbed the puck and left like an entitled brat. He ran all the veterans out of town, but of course ALL of them were bad apples. He took a job where he made it clear he wanted to replace the NHL coach, only to be fired instead.. So much for organization first.

I see you and i have the same love for Bouchard

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Bouchard was a failure as a coach in Laval. Developed nobody, won nothing, and was never an Organization first guy. No way would his ego allow him to take orders from a nobody like MSL. All he cared about as he showed, was advancing his own career, when that didn't happen fast enough, he grabbed the puck and left like an entitled brat. He ran all the veterans out of town, but of course ALL of them were bad apples. He took a job where he made it clear he wanted to replace the NHL coach, only to be fired instead.. So much for organization first.

Bouchard was definitely more interested in personal success than organizational success. Putting the farm team's win/loss record on his resume above the organizational need to develop NHL ready players rather than players who are trained to exploit the garbage that is AHL hockey.

 

[Vachon23]

Julien?

Yes but it’s à personnal preference, not an info

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Bouchard was a failure as a coach in Laval. Developed nobody, won nothing, and was never an Organization first guy. No way would his ego allow him to take orders from a nobody like MSL. All he cared about as he showed, was advancing his own career, when that didn't happen fast enough, he grabbed the puck and left like an entitled brat. He ran all the veterans out of town, but of course ALL of them were bad apples. He took a job where he made it clear he wanted to replace the NHL coach, only to be fired instead.. So much for organization first.

If he wasn't using the vets enough then why weren't the prospects developing? I assume he left when he wasn't brought into the bubble after his last season.

 

[montreal]

I'm not a fan but also don't complain because he mostly does what I want to see. With RHP and Ylonen no matter what they got top 6 and PP time, so with prospects that's what I want to see, you have to put these kids in good situations.

I don't like how he's handled some, I can't get the logic behind taking Norlinder off the PP and putting him on the PK. It's not to take any blame away from Norlinder, as it's his own fault as he does not seem interested in working hard all the time so I can see why Houle doesn't like him.

I liked Joel Bouchard because when you watch his teams they are always so well structured defensively. Granted he had his issues creating offense so maybe he's a better D coach but with Houle he's certainly had the opposite problem as the offense has mostly been good and the D shit.

If the Habs re-sign him then so be it, I don't think he's that good of a coach but there's a lot we don't have access to so I'll leave it up to the Habs as Gorton said just before the season started they were happy and it sounded like it was a done deal but I guess we'll find out in the next month or two.

 

[dcyhabs]

I'm not a fan but also don't complain because he mostly does what I want to see. With RHP and Ylonen no matter what they got top 6 and PP time, so with prospects that's what I want to see, you have to put these kids in good situations.

I don't like how he's handled some, I can't get the logic behind taking Norlinder off the PP and putting him on the PK. It's not to take any blame away from Norlinder, as it's his own fault as he does not seem interested in working hard all the time so I can see why Houle doesn't like him.

I liked Joel Bouchard because when you watch his teams they are always so well structured defensively. Granted he had his issues creating offense so maybe he's a better D coach but with Houle he's certainly had the opposite problem as the offense has mostly been good and the D shit.
If the Habs re-sign him then so be it, I don't think he's that good of a coach but there's a lot we don't have access to so I'll leave it up to the Habs as Gorton said just before the season started they were happy and it sounded like it was a done deal but I guess we'll find out in the next month or two.

The one thing I’ve noticed about Houle is the old school habs thing where a player (exception Lafleur) has to show defensive commitment before being unleashed offensively. Many players, especially on D, were given defensive assignments no matter what their game was. Maybe he’s not satisfied with Norlinder’s defensive commitment?

It’s not something the habs should do in the NHL but I like the idea in the minors. Try to get snipers to work on their D, and defensive specialists to carry the puck a bit.

Team performance has been inconsistent but many of the players have improved. I’m not a Houle fan, and I wasn’t happy they hired someone with a family connection, but I’m fairly happy with the coaching. It would have been good to make the playoffs but developing comes first.

 

[yianik]

No rumours of Houle telling Reinbacher or Xheraj they are bottom pair D and to just accept it. Guys actually seem to improve in Laval.

I'm not sold on getting rid of Houle.

Just had a flashback. Thinking of how MB treated Markov versus Sly. Remember when Sly contract was up and he had done nothing positive that anyone could identify, and MB actually offered an extension ? We were all stunned. But then Sly asked for time because he thought his fine coaching of the team could lead to an NHL job ? And instead of MB waking up and telling the ingrate to get lost, he said ok. And when no NHL offers came , shocked me, he said ok , and Sly was back. Only Bergevin.

 

[WeThreeKings]

You don't keep Houle because he is better than Lefebvre. Lefebvre is the worst development coach in history.

It's not about the talent level on the team, it's about how he handled certain prospects like Norlinder and Mysak, he already has a bias against Mesar so we know he can't be the coach for Mesar.. so there is a bit of the Lefebvre shit it's just on selective few.

More importantly, even if you don't have the talent, you need to show up in big games and over this last stretch, they laid massive eggs in big games to the point where they went a full period + without mustering a shot on goal. Disorganized. No energy. Yet he keeps sticking with the same vets regardless if they are terrible or not.

He needs to be improved upon.

 

[HABitual Fan]

You don't keep Houle because he is better than Lefebvre. Lefebvre is the worst development coach in history.

It's not about the talent level on the team, it's about how he handled certain prospects like Norlinder and Mysak, he already has a bias against Mesar so we know he can't be the coach for Mesar.. so there is a bit of the Lefebvre shit it's just on selective few.

More importantly, even if you don't have the talent, you need to show up in big games and over this last stretch, they laid massive eggs in big games to the point where they went a full period + without mustering a shot on goal. Disorganized. No energy. Yet he keeps sticking with the same vets regardless if they are terrible or not.

He needs to be improved upon.

Or maybe the roster and vets need to be improved on?
Ironic that our top vet scored his 20th of the season in the same game Gaudette scored his 40th!

 

[WeThreeKings]

Or maybe the roster and vets need to be improved on?
Ironic that our top vet scored his 20th of the season in the same game Gaudette scored his 40th!

A professional team in a playoff hunt - that got there with the roster and vets playing in that game - should not be so disorganized, ill prepared and unmotivated in those games. That is on the coach.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

It's tough to have this conversation about why our farm team is so shitty without also addressing the limited pool of Head Coaches because we need our farm team's coach to speak French as well.

There just isn't an abundance of French coaches, especially in the AHL, and we have a never ending cycle of under qualified bums running the show.

We can keep looking for up and coming coaches in the QMJHL, but most likely these guys have a better thing going for them in the Q, or if they do want to coach Laval it's because they want to build their resume to coach in the NHL.

 

[montreal]

The one thing I’ve noticed about Houle is the old school habs thing where a player (exception Lafleur) has to show defensive commitment before being unleashed offensively. Many players, especially on D, were given defensive assignments no matter what their game was. Maybe he’s not satisfied with Norlinder’s defensive commitment?

It’s not something the habs should do in the NHL but I like the idea in the minors. Try to get snipers to work on their D, and defensive specialists to carry the puck a bit.

Team performance has been inconsistent but many of the players have improved. I’m not a Houle fan, and I wasn’t happy they hired someone with a family connection, but I’m fairly happy with the coaching. It would have been good to make the playoffs but developing comes first.

I give him credit this year for not benching Norlinder more as he clearly plays at a lower tempo until he figures out and often too late that he's now got to kick it into high gear. If I was his coach he would never play until he figured out that he either has to play a more up tempo game or go back to Sweden.

On the other hand I can't get the logic of not using him on the PP when that's his best asset. The PP has looked like shit so many times, no creativity, pure puck movement. I just don't get why he refuses to use him there and instead puts him on the PK when he's shit defensively. I just can't figure that out unless the plan is to work on his defense by forcing him on the PK? If so that's an interesting approach as his SHL Head Coach, who is one of the best in Sweden from my understanding, said he felt Norlinder's issues defensively weren't because he was poor at it but it was a lack of focus (I believe) or something to that effect.

In Laval to me he just looks lazy and doesn't play anything like he did in Sweden. He used to be so aggressive carrying the puck up ice, pinching in at the blueline, so often you would see him standing next to the goalie in the offensive zone but in Laval you never see that or almost never as it's so rare to see him take the puck and go end to end. He's shown flashes but he's mostly been terrible this year and looks like he wants to be back in Sweden next year, although he is playing his best hockey of the season but too little too late I'm guessing.

If Houle is back then how Mesar does under him will be very interesting. I love how he's handled Roy this year and mostly Farrell as I would have moved him up to the 1st PP unit much quicker then he did and now he's back on the 2nd unit after 1 game. He's easily been one of the few skaters creating things in the offensive zone so I don't get that as it's not like the 1st unit hasn't been struggling for some time but he's slow to make adjustments. He was slow to move Mailloux up to the 1st unit after he was really starting to produce but at least he finally put him on the top unit. But now that the unit has struggled and Barron has looked better on the 2nd unit with Farrell, he should have flipped both imo but that's also splitting hairs as it's a tough call as do you do what's best for Mailloux here or do you bump up Barron because he might help the team more.

 

[Le Barron de HF]

Sorry mods if this doesn't deserve its own thread, could be merged with Laval thread.

In your opinion, should Houle be brought back as Head Coach of the Rocket next year?

PROS:
- Most call-ups have fit like a glove when being called up, seems to teach the MSL's system fairly well.
- Prospects for the most part have improved (Struble, Xhekaj, Mailloux, Barron, Simoneau, RHP)
- You know what you're getting with him; is it a good idea to gamble on a new candidate with the upcoming prospects joining the Rocket? (Engstrom, Reinbacher?, Kidney, Mesar, Beck, Mailloux?, Farrell, Davidson)
- For most part, Rocket has had success under him.

CONS:
- Was not HuGo's guy; might not share the same philosophies or objectives 100%
- Missed the playoffs this year and lack of urgency from players in important games.
- Not the best tactician from what I saw as far as special teams.
- Can be stubborn in his evaluations of players or limit their progress (Mysak, Norlinder)
- If plan is to groom some candidates to help the main team; might not be the best choice.

Thoughts?

 

[WeThreeKings]

Massive mistake if he comes back.

 

[montreal]

Sorry mods if this doesn't deserve its own thread, could be merged with Laval thread.

In your opinion, should Houle be brought back as Head Coach of the Rocket next year?

PROS:
- Most call-ups have fit like a glove when being called up, seems to teach the MSL's system fairly well.
- Prospects for the most part have improved (Struble, Xhekaj, Mailloux, Barron, Simoneau, RHP)
- You know what you're getting with him; is it a good idea to gamble on a new candidate with the upcoming prospects joining the Rocket? (Engstrom, Reinbacher?, Kidney, Mesar, Beck, Mailloux?, Farrell, Davidson)
- For most part, Rocket has had success under him.

CONS:
- Was not HuGo's guy; might not share the same philosophies or objectives 100%
- Missed the playoffs this year and lack of urgency from players in important games.
- Not the best tactician from what I saw as far as special teams.
- Can be stubborn in his evaluations of players or limit their progress (Mysak, Norlinder)
- If plan is to groom some candidates to help the main team; might not be the best choice.

Thoughts?

I moved it to this thread where there was a good bit of discussion on bringing him back or not.

I know Jeff Gorton said days before the season started that they were happy with Houle and he made it sound to me like he was going to be re-signed at some point but perhaps I read too much into the interview since here we are getting closer to May but no word yet on what the plans are, I guess in the coming weeks we should hear something.

 

[montreal]

I wouldn't bring him back as I do think we should strive for better there but if he's back I'm fine with it as he's been good to give the TOI and PP time that you want to see for the prospects no matter if they struggle or not. I really like that just don't like some things like his lineups, defensive structure, special teams, and I think he's too slow to make changes. That PP1 was shit and he did nothing to fix it and that is troubling when you could clearly see better puck movement from PP2.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

I'm pretty sure it was the most recent podcast on Basu- Godin, but could have been Engels earlier when I listened to the sick podcast, but whichever one seems to think favourably of him and believes the org does, too, but didn't sound like there was any direct evidence, more of a speculation.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

I think if Houle was going to be back, he'd already have an extension by now. With more guys from HuGo's first draft turning pro this upcoming year, it is the perfect time to bring in their own guy to match their vision and help the young guys reach their potential.

That being said, I didn't have high expectations for Houle when he was brought in however he was better than I thought he'd be. A lot of guys looked ready to play in the NHL when called up and it sounds like most players enjoyed playing for him. He did have his faults, however I think he showed he can be a decent coach at the AHL level.

 

[1909]

Sorry mods if this doesn't deserve its own thread, could be merged with Laval thread.

In your opinion, should Houle be brought back as Head Coach of the Rocket next year?

PROS:
- Most call-ups have fit like a glove when being called up, seems to teach the MSL's system fairly well.
- Prospects for the most part have improved (Struble, Xhekaj, Mailloux, Barron, Simoneau, RHP)
- You know what you're getting with him; is it a good idea to gamble on a new candidate with the upcoming prospects joining the Rocket? (Engstrom, Reinbacher?, Kidney, Mesar, Beck, Mailloux?, Farrell, Davidson)
- For most part, Rocket has had success under him.

CONS:
- Was not HuGo's guy; might not share the same philosophies or objectives 100%
- Missed the playoffs this year and lack of urgency from players in important games.
- Not the best tactician from what I saw as far as special teams.
- Can be stubborn in his evaluations of players or limit their progress (Mysak, Norlinder)
- If plan is to groom some candidates to help the main team; might not be the best choice.

Thoughts?

Is Mysak better in SD ? No. he is even worse.

 

[Rapala]

I wouldn't bring him back as I do think we should strive for better there but if he's back I'm fine with it as he's been good to give the TOI and PP time that you want to see for the prospects no matter if they struggle or not. I really like that just don't like some things like his lineups, defensive structure, special teams, and I think he's too slow to make changes. That PP1 was shit and he did nothing to fix it and that is troubling when you could clearly see better puck movement from PP2.

Given where both our Pro Clubs sit in the standings getting better might just be a good idea. I sense a certain complacency within a certain section of our fan base. I'm for getting better anywhere we possibly can even if it means dumping minimal contracts to do so.
I think we are at that point at least that is what I'm hearing.

 

[Laurentide]

It's tough to have this conversation about why our farm team is so shitty without also addressing the limited pool of Head Coaches because we need our farm team's coach to speak French as well.

There just isn't an abundance of French coaches, especially in the AHL, and we have a never ending cycle of under qualified bums running the show.

We can keep looking for up and coming coaches in the QMJHL, but most likely these guys have a better thing going for them in the Q, or if they do want to coach Laval it's because they want to build their resume to coach in the NHL.

I've heard for decades about this Habs-only problem (because the Nordiques, despite all the fleur de lys festooned on their jerseys, never had a problem hiring unilingual anglos to coach the team)

My answer to the Habs would be this: If you have decided, for whatever reason, that the Habs and the Rocket must have a bilingual (or outright francophone) head coach, and you know in advance that the pool of such coaches is not deep, why are you not doing anything to develop them aside from occasionally hiring one who you know is in over his head? Why do the Habs not invest any money into developing a generation of bilingual coaches through the formation of some sort of coaching "academy"? It's not like they don't have the money to do it.

So instead of forever settling for the next talking head from L'Antichambre to step behind the bench, why not groom them in an academy of some sort?

 

[Ezpz]

I don't see how you finish second last in the conference in the NHL and last in the division in the AHL and then bring back both coaching staffs. AHL will and should be overhauled.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I don't see how you finish second last in the conference in the NHL and last in the division in the AHL and then bring back both coaching staffs. AHL will and should be overhauled.

They might know Houle but he was never their guy - I think they'll want to bring in some other young forward thinkers that can accurately coach what Marty is doing at the NHL level. Houle is a dullard who is out of touch with this generation.