Is Playing Against Your Country in a Tournament Betrayal?

Discussion in 'International Tournaments' started by SpItFiReZ, Dec 28, 2004.

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  1. SpItFiReZ

    SpItFiReZ Registered User

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    Alright....this isn't a question about something stupid...

    I was wondering after a night of arguing when me and some buddies were watchin the Spengler Cup...Joe Thornton, Martin St. Louis, Rick Nash were on Davos and they were playing Canada. Does that betray Canada in your mind? The arguements were that they are Canadian and shouldn't be playing there country and then the other was that they are playing hockey in a tourny that not many ppl care about and isnt a big deal since it isnt a huge tourny. I kind of agreed to both after arguing it doesnt betray Canada since it is club teams and not a large scale tourny......What do you all think??
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2004

  2. No, it's not "betrayal" because nobody gives two ***** about the Spengler Cup!
     
  3. Bicycle Repairman

    Bicycle Repairman Registered User

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    Thornton, Nash and St. Louis weren't invited to try out for the Canadian Spengler Cup team.
     
  4. Canadian Chris

    Canadian Chris Registered User

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    I don't think it's betrayel at all.

    All 3 of them have contracts with HC Davos, so why should those contracts be voided for a tournament put on by HC Davos!? The Canadian team, is made up of guys who are playing in Europe, I don't believe any of them have are playing with any of the teams involved, so their club teams have released them for the tourny. A few of the other players, like Auld, have come from the AHL.

    At the same time, Habshied has stated that if NHLers won't be participating in the 06 Olympics then he wants to get a decent national program up and running again by then, and thus wants to give guys who will have a shot at playing in the Olympics a try out of sorts...this will also likely be the case when the World Championships roll around if the NHL is still locked out by then. Habshied and Hockey Canada are preparing in case NHLers won't be present in Italy.
     
  5. The Legend

    The Legend GW

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    Canada is not really like the Team Canada we identify with. Rather, it is a bunch of journeymen from the AHL that are united under the same flag. The Spengler Cup is like a club championship that invites a team from Canada. If it were an invitation by player tourney, obviously it would be more akin to betrayl.
     
  6. LannysStach

    LannysStach Thou shall

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    i agree with all of the above. it's not like it's a series real international tourny like olympics or canada/world cup. it's just fun.

    it was a dream game!

    as in, i had this dream last night i was watching a canada-sweden game [yellow & blue uniforms], but joe thorton and st. louis and rick nash and all these guys were playing for sweden!

    it was funny bizarro-world game.
    enjoy the weirdness.
    it'll all be normal again before long.
     
  7. CRUNK JUICE

    CRUNK JUICE Registered User

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  8. Schenn02

    Schenn02 Registered User

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    I don't call it betrayal either.
     
  9. Masao

    Masao Registered User

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    I don't care if it's the spengler cup or the freaking olympics... it's a HOCKEY GAME.

    Betrayal is not playing against a hockey team representing your country... betrayal is fighting against your country's army in a war.
     
  10. wilka91*

    wilka91* Registered User

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    Well the Fedorov brothers and Gonchar played for the World Stars against Russia ... is that betrayal? Of course not. Nobody gives a **** about the Spengler Cup even if it's fun to watch.
     
  11. espo*

    espo* Guest

    Not for the Spengler cup with Canadian players who are under contract with a European team...if it was the olympics they would'nt be playing with Davos.Now guys like Deadmarsh,Hull,Brady,etc.....they don't have a heck of a lot of respect with most Canadians and for good reason.
     
  12. wilka91*

    wilka91* Registered User

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    Deadmarsh and Hull are American ... or did I miss something?
     
  13. espo*

    espo* Guest

    A little something....they are Canadian and grew up here
     
  14. AJ1982

    AJ1982 Registered User

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    Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind.

    -Albert Einstein
     
  15. Wetcoaster

    Wetcoaster Guest

    They are both dual citizens from birth.

    Hull's mother was American so although he was born in Belleville, Ontario he is both. IIRC Bobby was still a Canadian at the time.

    In Deadmarsh's case his mother was an American and he was born in Trail, BC.

    BTW after playing goal for Canada in the 1977 World Championships, Tony Esposito (a naturlized US citizen) joined the American team for the 1981 Canada Cup.
     
  16. chriss_co

    chriss_co Registered User

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    Lol. :lol So I guess the US is a hotbed for disease?
     
  17. DaaaaB's

    DaaaaB's Registered User

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    It's definitly not betrayal.
     
  18. espo*

    espo* Guest

    Maybe, but most people have some pride about who and what they are and i don't think that's a bad thing at all as long as no-one goes on some rampage killing everyone who isn't like them.I for one know where the limits have to be drawn so i'm fine with being patriotic.
     
  19. Roughneck

    Roughneck Registered User

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    It would be 'betrayl' if it were truly an international event. In this case, it is not. Each country has a team representing it. Canada's team just happens to be its national team. If it wanted to send the champions from the Manitoba beer leagues, it would also be called Canada.

    Nash, Thornton and St. Louis are playing for the club team that happens to be representing Switzerland. Nothing more. Oleg Petrov will also be facing his own nation's team.

    I'm just amazed that Canada managed to pull out a win. It was really good hockey too. And all those names that just seem to get forgotten like Domenichelli, Heward and Roest.
     
  20. Sotnos

    Sotnos Registered User

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    You have a lot of nerve saying that on these boards. :shakehead
     
  21. Hart_House_Ca

    Hart_House_Ca Registered User

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    First of all, I don't think the IIHF recognizes the spengler cup as a sanction tournament and counts it towards World Rankings. If I am wrong, then it would definitely be a problem because not all countries are represented and way too many advertisers for anybody's liking.

    I personally don't have a problem with players on club teams playing against this so called team Canada because the spengler cup is more of a fun and friendly tournament.

    Players from Canada as well as Team Canada knows and understands that canadians on these club teams could be facing the only team named after its country.

    I think the only reason people are upset is because the quality of these players are NHL calibre. This isn't the first time canadians have played against team canada in this tournament, but nobody has made a big fuss about it until the NHL players came along. Why is that? It was ok before why isn't it ok now?
     
  22. The IIHF has nothing to do with the Spengler Cup. This isn't Team Canada playing over there, it is a group of Canadian players playing as a team in the tournament.

    As for the advertising...have you ever watched any European sports?
     
  23. Hart_House_Ca

    Hart_House_Ca Registered User

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    I watch european football, hockey, F1 Racing... I know they have tons of ads so I was making a joke about it.

    I enjoy watching the spengler cup because Canada is the only team to have its players come from one country. It gives us canadians something to cheer for in this tournament.
     
  24. Diaboli

    Diaboli Registered User

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    I don't think this thread should be here. And no, I don't consider it to be betrayal, unless they were given a chance by their employer and by team Canada to play for, surprise surprise, team Canada.
     
  25. 12# Peter Bondra

    12# Peter Bondra Registered User

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    I also think this thread shouldnt be here but there aint any other forum to discuss international tourneys except this one which means that the thread will stay here for the time being.
     
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