If Pens move West,What West team moves East?

[detredWINgs]

I'd bet the NHL moves Columbus before Detroit. If only because the Wings-Avs rivalry is one of the few truely heated rivalries the NHL has right now, and a move to the east could destroy that.

No way. Toronto-Detroit is timeless. Avs has slowed down in recent years.

 

[Bucky_Hoyt]

Judging by the discussions here, I don't think it would be either simple or pretty if this situation does happen.

 

[sushinsky4tsar]

posted this in another thread:

Portland:
pit -> Northwest
min -> Central -OR- col -> Pacific, dal -> Central
---------------
cbj -> Northeast
bos -> Atlantic
-OR-
nas -> Southeast
was -> Atlantic

Winnipeg
pit -> Northwest
col -> Pacific
dal -> Central
cbj -> Northeast
bos -> Atlantic

Kansas City
pit -> Central
cbj -> Northeast
bos -> Atlantic

Las Vegas
pit -> Pacific
dal -> Central
cbj -> Northeast
bos -> Atlantic

Houston/Oklahoma City
pit -> Pacific/Southwest
sj -> Northwest (this will ruffle some feathers)
min -> Central
nas -> Southeast
was -> Atlantic

Hamilton
pit -> Northeast
bos -> Atlantic

Hartford
(null)-best option
-OR-
bos -> Atlantic
phi -> Northeast (feathers)

Quebec
pit -> Northeast
bos -> Atlantic

 

[dafoomie]

Boston moves into the Atlantic Division in the East to take over Penguins slot

Are you insane? Bruins-Canadiens is one of the few real rivalries hockey has anymore.

Here's a map of every NHL team.
http://www.tmlfever.com/files/map_of_team_cities.gif

Nashville just screams Southeast division to me. And Washington is much closer to the Atlantic division teams. Move Nashville into the Southeast division and more Washington into the Atlantic.

Option 2 would be to move Columbus into the Atlantic division.

You don't just move an Original 6 team away from its traditional rivals. They'd never, ever go for that.

 

[Rails]

posted this in another thread:
Houston/Oklahoma City
pit -> Pacific/Southwest
sj -> Northwest (this will ruffle some feathers)
min -> Central
nas -> Southeast
was -> Atlantic

I'd put Oklahoma or Houston in the Central before I put them in the Pacific. I don't understand why Dallas is in the Pacific, that just doesn't make any sense other than they needed to even out the division.

 

[sushinsky4tsar]

Yeah, I know. The Oklahoma City/Houston scenario really doesn't work out to well geographically with a 6 division format. Oklahoma City/Houston are "Central" at first glance. But the problem you have there is that it would be a sin to have an OKC/HOU in the league and not have them in the same division with Dallas.

The solution I posted was to move SJ to the Northwest. I realize it would be stupid to separate no.CAL from the so.CAL teams though. The point is 1 team in the West is gonna be in an unnatural division if Houston or OKC gets a team. Unless another Eastern team also moves to Vegas/Portland/Winnipeg. Then DAL and HOU/OKC could both move into the Central and disperse Nashville and Columbus both into the East.

 

[sushinsky4tsar]

Are you insane? Bruins-Canadiens is one of the few real rivalries hockey has anymore.

Here's a map of every NHL team.
http://www.tmlfever.com/files/map_of_team_cities.gif

Nashville just screams Southeast division to me. And Washington is much closer to the Atlantic division teams. Move Nashville into the Southeast division and more Washington into the Atlantic.

Option 2 would be to move Columbus into the Atlantic division.

You don't just move an Original 6 team away from its traditional rivals. They'd never, ever go for that.

Yeah, I think you might be right about Nashville into the SE/Washington to Atlantic. And with the Columbus option, it would be a shame to split Bos & Mtl up. So I'm assuming BOS-MTL > BOS-NYR. But as for the remaining divisional opponents, doesn't NYI-PHI-NJ beat out TOR-OTW-BUF? Or isn't it worth losing Montreal? I'm not challenging or anything, just curious to hear a Bruin fan's perspective.

 

[Jazz]

Isn't Nashville in the Central time zone?

If it is, then there should be no way for them to move to the Eastern Conference.

My first bet would be Detroit, but then I am also wondering how much Columbus needs Detroit as a nearby rival.

I also don't think that expansion to 32 teams (and 2 conferences of 16 teams) is out of the question either. If they expand and put 2 teams in the West, then both Detriot and Columbus could move east.

 

[Bruins4Ever]

Yeah, I think you might be right about Nashville into the SE/Washington to Atlantic. And with the Columbus option, it would be a shame to split Bos & Mtl up. So I'm assuming BOS-MTL > BOS-NYR. But as for the remaining divisional opponents, doesn't NYI-PHI-NJ beat out TOR-OTW-BUF? Or isn't it worth losing Montreal? I'm not challenging or anything, just curious to hear a Bruin fan's perspective.

Nah, sending Boston to a division other than the Northeast would be suicide to be honest. Us Bruins fans need our Montreal-Boston and Toronto-Boston feud. Here's my fix:

NE:

Montreal
Boston
Buffalo
Toronto
Ottawa

Atlantic

NYI
NYR
Philadelphia
Washington
New Jersey

Southeast

Carolina
Nashville
Tampa
Florida
Atlanta

Central:

Columbus
Detroit
Chicago
St. Louis
Dallas

Northwest

Winnipeg (Pittsburgh)
Edmonton
Colorado
Calgary
Minnesota

Pacific:

Los Angeles
Anaheim
Phoenix
San Jose
Vancouver

This makes the most sense to me. Columbus is the only team that can be argued for the East, but it makes more sense this way IMO.

 

[Rails]

Yeah, I know. The Oklahoma City/Houston scenario really doesn't work out to well geographically with a 6 division format. Oklahoma City/Houston are "Central" at first glance. But the problem you have there is that it would be a sin to have an OKC/HOU in the league and not have them in the same division with Dallas.

The solution I posted was to move SJ to the Northwest. I realize it would be stupid to separate no.CAL from the so.CAL teams though. The point is 1 team in the West is gonna be in an unnatural division if Houston or OKC gets a team. Unless another Eastern team also moves to Vegas/Portland/Winnipeg. Then DAL and HOU/OKC could both move into the Central and disperse Nashville and Columbus both into the East.

Point taken.

I don't believe that Oklahoma City or Houston will be first, or even second choice, in receiving a hockey team. I think that Quebec and Winnipeg are actually viable cities with the new CBA. The problem in Quebec was that their non-salary operating costs were high, and so were their salary costs, combined with a low location quality (how attendance is affected by location specific attributes, ie, population and income). Winnipeg had the lowest locational quality of the then 21 team league, but also were among the lowers in salary and non-salary costs. Quebec failed because they failed to control their costs of operation. Winnipeg was viable until the economics of the league led them to increase their salary costs (all of this came from the essay, "On Going South: The Econimcs of Survival and Relocation of the Small Market Franchises in Canada" by Angelo Cocco and JCH Jones). With the new CBA, the salary portion of costs of operation is contained. The only problem would be the whole arena situations, which are usually problems in

At the time of the study, 1997, all of the small market franchise were in jeopardy. Government subsidies and salary dumping are basically the only things that kept Edmonton and Calgary in Canada. Jones and Cocco believe that had there been any type of salary cap or revenue sharing that Winnipeg and Quebec would have been able to maintain their franchises, although I believe I read something about some ownership corruption in the Winnipeg franchise.

My point being, with some pretty good backing, is that with the salary cap and revenue sharing, Winnipeg and Quebec, maybe even Hartford are viable locations for NHL teams...although the people there might be bitter and maintain connections with their old teams now in Colorado, Phoenix, and Carolina. Who knows.

 

[guinness]

I'd rather see the Wings move East as they have stronger, traditional rivalries with the Orginal 6 than anyone in their own division, other than Chicago and St. Louis, the two other teams have been around for less than a decade. A geographical rivalry for sure, but games against TO, Boston, and Montreal would get more people pumped up I would think.

It wouldn't be so bad if the scheduling didn't totally suck this year, but I'd rather see a more balanced schedule overall.

 

[dafoomie]

Yeah, I think you might be right about Nashville into the SE/Washington to Atlantic. And with the Columbus option, it would be a shame to split Bos & Mtl up. So I'm assuming BOS-MTL > BOS-NYR. But as for the remaining divisional opponents, doesn't NYI-PHI-NJ beat out TOR-OTW-BUF? Or isn't it worth losing Montreal? I'm not challenging or anything, just curious to hear a Bruin fan's perspective.

You can't break up Boston and Montreal for any reason. I'd also really want to keep them with Toronto. And I'm sure Toronto, Ottawa, and Montreal would like to stay together as well. Buffalo would definitely want to keep Toronto in their division.

I really can't see changing the Northeast Division at all unless Hartford or Quebec come back, unless Toronto really wants to be back in a division with Chicago, Detroit, and St. Louis.

I'd still like to see Washington in the Atlantic and Nashville in the Southeast. If the new team isn't convienant for the Central division, Dallas or Minnesota could move into the Central, since Minnesota was in the Norris division with Chicago, St. Louis, and Detroit prior to moving, and they're both very far away from the rest of their division geographically.

 

[The Legend]

I still think that Houston, not Winnipeg, is the most likely place for the Pens. In that case, some reshuffling would have to be done but I think something like this would do....


ATLANTIC

New Jersey
New York
New York
Philly
Boston

NORTHEAST

Toronto
Detroit
Ottawa
Montreal
Buffalo

SOUTHEAST

Tampa
Florida
Washington
Atlanta
Carolina

CENTRAL

Dallas
Nashville
St. Louis
Columbus
Houston

NORTHWEST

Vancouver
Calgary
Minnesota
Edmonton
Chicago

Pacific

Phoenix
San Jose
Anaheim
Los Angeles
Colorado

 

[Tb0ne]

Crosby, Malkin, MA Fleury and co in the North West.. no thanks !

 

[Jazz]

Crosby, Malkin, MA Fleury and co in the North West.. no thanks !

Haha, good point...

 

[dafoomie]

What is with everyone trying to put the Bruins in the Atlantic division? It will never happen. Jeremy Jacobs will put a contract out on Bettman's head before he lets him take away his profitable Bruins-Habs and Bruins-Leafs games. The Isles, Rangers, and Devils games never sell very well in Boston.

The only way Toronto and Detroit will be in the same division again is if Toronto moves into the Central.

 

[naihlflames]

Are you insane? Bruins-Canadiens is one of the few real rivalries hockey has anymore.

Here's a map of every NHL team.
http://www.tmlfever.com/files/map_of_team_cities.gif

Nashville just screams Southeast division to me. And Washington is much closer to the Atlantic division teams. Move Nashville into the Southeast division and more Washington into the Atlantic.

Option 2 would be to move Columbus into the Atlantic division.

You don't just move an Original 6 team away from its traditional rivals. They'd never, ever go for that.[/QUOTE]

What do you think happened when the split up Detroit and Toronto?

 

[Snap Wilson]

My dream scenario has the Pens moving to Seattle and the Pacific Division, Dallas moving to the Central, Detroit moving to the Eastern Conference where they'll get to play in a division with Toronto, Montreal, and Boston.... hello, rivalries? and Buffalo replacing Pittsburgh in the Atlantic. So let it be written, so let it be done.

 

[naihlflames]

So, which three move West to replace them, eh? Or are you saying the league needs to have 18 teams in the East and 12 in the West?

Where's your brilliant Conference breakdown?

How is this for something radical? 3 conferences with:

West: New Pens, Oilers, Flames, Canucks, Sharks, Ducks, Kings, Coyotes, Av's, & Stars.
Central: Wild, Blues, Blackhawks, Wings, Leafs, Sabres, Blue Jackets, Predators, Thrashers, & Hurricanes.
East: Lightning, Panthers, Capitals, Flyers, Devils, Rangers, Islanders, Bruins, Habs, & Senators. (Put Canes in central to keep the 2 Florida teams together and give the East some travel).

82 game Schedule:
Home and away against everyone from the other 2 conferences (20 teams *2=40games). 4 games against everyone from your conference (9 other teams *4=36 games). Home and away against the 2 teams that finished the same in their division the prior year ie 1'st place 1'st, 10'th plays 10'th (2 teams *2=4 games). Random (2 games). This schedule has every team and every player visiting every city. It also includes more better games that could be geared toward a national tv games (the #1 vs #1 or #2 vs #2).

Playoffs: Round #1: The top 4 teams from each conference make the playoffs and within each division #1 plays #4 and #2 plays #3. That makes for 12 teams and 6 series based on geography. The next best 4 records in all of the NHL are paired up #1-#4 and may have to travel further in round I due to not finishing in the top 4. Round #2 is reseeded with any of the conference winners guaranteed a top 3 slot (if they advanced in round #1) and the remaining teams are seeded based on regular season record. So the #1 remaining seed will play #8, etc. Round #3 will not be reseeded.

So, you asked for something brilliant with a confernce make up. It's different, but is solves the not seeing every team schedule problem, is fairly balanced both rivalry and competativly, and evens out the travel some.

Thoughts/comments ........

 

[dafoomie]

What do you think happened when the split up Detroit and Toronto?

Toronto wanted to go. They were the ones that pushed for it, and they wanted it for many years before they got it. They wanted it mainly to be in the same division as Montreal.

Do you think the Bruins would honestly want to be moved out of the Northeast? Toronto and Montreal sell out games, Ottawa lately does very well, and Buffalo does OK when they're a decent team. They can't give away tickets for the Islanders and Devils games, and the Rangers haven't sold too well either.

Never in a million years would they ever want that.

 

[VanIslander]

Columbus, Ohio
and
Nashville, Tennessee

just ain't west !

 

[acr*]

Why the **** would anyone put Boston in the Atlantic? They don't fit in with those teams at all, and have been rivals with the Habs and Leafs for years. If you're going to kick anyone out of that division, make it Buffalo, they don't have the same kind of rivalries with the division the other 3 have. Boston-Montreal-Toronto-Ottawa is bad blood. Buffalo claim to dislike the Leafs because of territorial stuff, but they're definitely the weak sister int his argument, even if Ottawa was the last in.

 

[Spydey629]

I'd put Oklahoma or Houston in the Central before I put them in the Pacific. I don't understand why Dallas is in the Pacific, that just doesn't make any sense other than they needed to even out the division.

If memory serves, Dallas actually asked to be in the Pacific when the 6 division set-up was originated. I don't know how, but the travel to Cali & Phoenix and back is less than heading to the Upper Midwest all the time.

As a Pens fan, I just hope this thread ends up as a lot of hot air.

 

[HockeyCritter]

Washington needs to be in the same division as the NY Rangers, NI Islanders, NJ Devils and Philly. It's just that simple.

Move Nashville to the SE.

Please ---- like the NHL wouldn’t want Detroit in the same Division as Montreal, Toronto, and Ottawa?

Columbus and Detroit are the only two western conference teams in the Eastern Time Zone. From a purely logistically standpoint, it make sense to move one of these two teams east (Columbus to take Pittsburgh’s place in the Atlantic or Detroit to the Northwest with Boston dropping down to the Altantic).

 

[HockeyCritter]

Why the **** would anyone put Boston in the Atlantic? They don't fit in with those teams at all, and have been rivals with the Habs and Leafs for years. If you're going to kick anyone out of that division, make it Buffalo, they don't have the same kind of rivalries with the division the other 3 have. Boston-Montreal-Toronto-Ottawa is bad blood. Buffalo claim to dislike the Leafs because of territorial stuff, but they're definitely the weak sister int his argument, even if Ottawa was the last in.

For the same reason the Caps were moved to the SE or Detroit was moved to the Central