Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by Habsfan18, Oct 25, 2006.
What do you guys think?
Is he still a potential top 4 d-man?
I personally have always thought he was overrated, that said he is far from a bust and should be a NHL player likely a decent 2nd pairing guy.
still can't believe he was picked before Phaneuf.
And on the same note..why oh why did the Flames have to pick Dion when the Habs had the next pick?
On the same note why oh why did the habs have to pick Ward when the sens had the next pick?
The guy is what 21-22? No he isnt a bust. Give him time. Look at Komisarek, he's finally really coming into his own this year, defensemen, especially big guys, take longer.
Already? You've got to be kidding.
Has his stock fallen since the draft? Possibly
In his draft year, Coburn was, apparently, the safe choice. Phaneuf was considered higher risk for higher reward, his stock grew the year after he drafted. I believe Suter was also a higher risk choice. As has been said, bigger guys take longer to develop.
i have heard it was the other way around, but im not really sure. just something i heard.
question: do you think the habs would have picked phaneuf if they had the #9 overall pick or do you think they would have picked kostitsyn anyway??
Maybe it was, just citing stuff i read from these forums.
Im disappointed that Atlanta took Coburn, he doesnt have enough work ethic.
same with me. i dont know. could have been any of the two.
I remember it as the other way around, Phaneuf was the safe pick, going to be a solid defenseman but not an all-around #1, whereas Coburn was more raw but had Jay Bouwmeester-esque potential.
As for Suter, up until last year, the Phaneuf vs. Suter debates were perhaps the most heated on the boards (and that includes Ovechkin vs. Crosby).
No, Coburn was considered the safer pick of the two for sure. Phaneuf had the temperament and the big shot, but Coburn was supposedly more polished and more of a sure-thing to become an NHL regular. Few people predicted Coburn would become much more than a really good #2 d-man. Phaneuf was definitely the higher-risk/higher-reward player.
Suter was somewhere between the two in terms of perceived risk, but he had the highest overall skill level and had more of a competetive streak than Coburn and I think that's what put him over the top on draft day.
Coburn was such a sick junior player, I remember watching him play the T-Birds in a game where he scored four goals (as a ****ING DEFENSEMAN!!!) and then proceeded to own our enforcer FitzGerald (who was one of the toughest in the league at the time) and the whole game he made it look so effortless. And this was when the T-Birds were icing one of their best teams in years with one of the best goalies in the league.
Coburn just doesn't seem to have that drive or mean streak or ability to elevate his game in the bigs... or at least he hasn't shown it yet... which is a shame because he has the tools to be a number one.
Not at all.
At the time, Coburn was the projection. He had the rare combination of size/mobility/skill that had scouts believing he could develop into a #1 defender if he put it all together. But he'd had a so-so draft year, and was considered a somewhat risky pick.
Phaneuf wasn't considered to have that kind of upside. He was thought to be more of a prototype defensive defender - steady, hard-nosed #2-3 guy in pro. Scott Hannan-type, maybe with a bit nastier edge. Hard point shot, but lots of big defenders have a hard point shot (see Bryan Allen) that they don't really know how to use. But he was considered a very, very safe bet to be a solid NHL defender.
Phaneuf's offensive development after being drafted came completely out of left field. No-one thought he had that sort of potential in him.
As a Flames fan...watching that draft I was hoping Coburn would slip and felt Dion was a consolation prize. Though Sutter's reaction did encourage me a bit. None the less, Coburn was the guy I wanted the Flames to select.
Nice to be wrong about things like that.
People seem to forget how much Phaneuf has progressed since being drafted. After being drafted, he improved a ton in the last 2 years before the NHL. The player Phaneuf is now and what when he was drafted, is easily a few levels above!
He was always a weaker prospect than Suter and Phaneuf. Teams just get enamoured with big guys who can skate, forgetting to see how they stake up in other areas.
That said, still far from a bust, should develop into a useful player. A dissapointment? For sure.
I'm pretty sure they would've taken Kostitsyn anyway. Savard seemed to have a blindspot for WHL players and rugged players generally.
Coburn stock has not dropped that much IMO
He's just been passsed by guys taken after him.
Phanuef, Weber, Seabrook, and Carle have all left him in the dust.
Personally I don't know how this guy had so much upside to begin with to me he's always looked so-so offensivly and pretty slow when handing nifty fowards
Here are Coburn's biggest weaknesses:
Phaneuf, Seabrook, Weber, Suter and Carle.
Coburn WAS rated HIGHER than Dion Phaneuf going into the 2003 draft, so the Thrashers didn't go way off the board. If anything, Coburn was a better player at the time.
I haven't seen much of Coburn, but to me he projects as a second-pairing guy, a jack-of-all-trades but master of none type of guy. Solid, but doesn't produce a ton of offensive output or deliver huge hits routinely. Just a steady guy. Nothing wrong with that. How many young defensemen, even Top 10 picks, even turn out to be consistently solid NHL'ers? Not as many as people realize.
Just because he's not Seabrook (and that selection was widely criticized if I remember correctly...those people got owned), Weber (I really like this kid...he's my kind of defenseman), Suter (who actually reminds me of Hamhuis, kind of) or Carle (this kid has a better overall game than people realize, not just a scorer) doesn't mean he's a bad player. He just has years to go yet. If he was picked that high in the '04 draft, no one would be complaining.
Coburn's biggest burden in the eyes of many fans (although it shouldn't be) is "Celine" Dion Phaneuf. I don't know if anyone could have predicted the simply dizzying rate of development by Dion from 2003-2005. I don't know if I've seen a CHL defenseman improve that much that quickly during the time I've been a hockey fan, and if there have been guys who fit that criteria, they do not come to mind right now. Plain and simple, 19 and 20 year-old defensemen do NOT make and EXCEL in the NHL without AHL time. It just doesn't happen. Phaneuf is an absolute marvel. He didn't just make the team. He made the team and played Top-20 D-man hockey FOR THE ENTIRE LEAGUE. Amazing. WHAT A MONSTER.