How do you Rebuild... The Montreal Canadiens?

[DowntownBooster]

My responses are lazy? I've put in the time to support my arguments with facts. I took the time to list all of the recent coaches of the team and their accomplishments. I brought up Randy Cunneyworth and corrected 2 claims about him, mentioning articles and quotes. Your answer was to say "whatever, a lot of people think like me so I must be right" which is not an argument but a fallacy.
Maybe if you presented any facts of your own, I could add even more to the discussion. But as your claims so far have been limited to "focusing on French is bad", I can only answer that. It is not my fault your arguments lack rigor.

I was pointing out your replies to me have all been the same which is claiming that I'm lazy. There have been other threads about the Canadiens relating to what can be done to improve the team. The team has obviously been performing below their fans expectations for a number of years now and it has been 25 years since they last won the Stanley Cup. In fact, 1993 was the last time they made it to the final. I have previously suggested they should rebuild their team through the draft and develop method. It takes longer and the fans have to be patient but it can certainly pay off in the long run. Making rash decisions by a gm in order to save their job short term can have long term consequences. Times are different now than in the 70's and earlier when the Habs were a force to be reckoned with. As the whole league is currently so much more at par competition wise, it may require the team to take a different approach in order to get back to the top. It's just possible that they may need to consider a coach like Mike Babcock or a gm like Steve Yzerman even though they are unilingual. It was just a suggestion for thinking outside the box and for the Canadiens to not restrict themselves to only hiring bilingual staff. The Expos and Alouettes were able to go that route and had some very good teams.

 

[ismelofhockey]

I was pointing out your replies to me have all been the same which is claiming that I'm lazy. There have been other threads about the Canadiens relating to what can be done to improve the team. The team has obviously been performing below their fans expectations for a number of years now and it has been 25 years since they last won the Stanley Cup. In fact, 1993 was the last time they made it to the final. I have previously suggested they should rebuild their team through the draft and develop method. It takes longer and the fans have to be patient but it can certainly pay off in the long run. Making rash decisions by a gm in order to save their job short term can have long term consequences. Times are different now than in the 70's and earlier when the Habs were a force to be reckoned with. As the whole league is currently so much more at par competition wise, it may require the team to take a different approach in order to get back to the top. It's just possible that they may need to consider a coach like Mike Babcock or a gm like Steve Yzerman even though they are unilingual. It was just a suggestion for thinking outside the box and for the Canadiens to not restrict themselves to only hiring bilingual staff. The Expos and Alouettes were able to go that route and had some very good teams.

Well I did mention a few times, though I guess to other posters, that I do believe Montreal would not complain about a coach or GM that is clearly at the top of the profession. There would be some grumblings, but they would die down as long as the team was winning. However the slightest hint of trouble would "awaken the dragon", and that has to be considered too. My point was rather that a situation like this has not come up yet to my recollection. Every coach the Habs hired made sense at the time as a hockey decision. That seems to be born out by their collective record. Again, this has been only one bad year. Many teams have not won a Cup since much longer than the Habs. Of course if anyone wants to learn French like Larry Robinson or Bob Gainey once did, the problem disappears. But you can see why Quebeckers are worried about their culture. Captains and players aren't learning French anymore. That's not an isolated incident. It's a sign of what happens if Quebec lets its guard down.

 

[sharknado]

Well I did mention a few times, though I guess to other posters, that I do believe Montreal would not complain about a coach or GM that is clearly at the top of the profession. There would be some grumblings, but they would die down as long as the team was winning. However the slightest hint of trouble would "awaken the dragon", and that has to be considered too. My point was rather that a situation like this has not come up yet to my recollection. Every coach the Habs hired made sense at the time as a hockey decision. That seems to be born out by their collective record. Again, this has been only one bad year. Many teams have not won a Cup since much longer than the Habs. Of course if anyone wants to learn French like Larry Robinson or Bob Gainey once did, the problem disappears. But you can see why Quebeckers are worried about their culture. Captains and players aren't learning French anymore. That's not an isolated incident. It's a sign of what happens if Quebec lets its guard down.

That's the mentality that will continue to be the downfall of the habs, but again, I really doubt this is what the current generation is thinking.

Unrelated but a few times I was at the Dominican Republic, a few people from Quebec started to complain because the hotel workers were not able to speak French. If it's ok for Quebecers to expect players to learn our language, then the same should be applied when Quebecors go outsite the province. You can't have it both ways.

 

[DowntownBooster]

Well I did mention a few times, though I guess to other posters, that I do believe Montreal would not complain about a coach or GM that is clearly at the top of the profession. There would be some grumblings, but they would die down as long as the team was winning. However the slightest hint of trouble would "awaken the dragon", and that has to be considered too. My point was rather that a situation like this has not come up yet to my recollection. Every coach the Habs hired made sense at the time as a hockey decision. That seems to be born out by their collective record. Again, this has been only one bad year. Many teams have not won a Cup since much longer than the Habs. Of course if anyone wants to learn French like Larry Robinson or Bob Gainey once did, the problem disappears. But you can see why Quebeckers are worried about their culture. Captains and players aren't learning French anymore. That's not an isolated incident. It's a sign of what happens if Quebec lets its guard down.

I do feel bad for Canadiens fans with regard to the dilemma faced in which language plays such an important role amongst Quebeckers and the desire to protect their culture. As you say, they might not complain as long as the team was winning but I do see your point that should they start losing, then the language issue could multiply the level of anger there. It's an issue that the other 30 teams don't have to concern themselves with.

 

[ismelofhockey]

Unrelated but a few times I was at the Dominican Republic, a few people from Quebec started to complain because the hotel workers were not able to speak French. If it's ok for Quebecers to expect players to learn our language, then the same should be applied when Quebecors go outsite the province. You can't have it both ways.

No argument from me there.

 

[MSSLYNX]

That's the mentality that will continue to be the downfall of the habs, but again, I really doubt this is what the current generation is thinking.

Unrelated but a few times I was at the Dominican Republic, a few people from Quebec started to complain because the hotel workers were not able to speak French. If it's ok for Quebecers to expect players to learn our language, then the same should be applied when Quebecors go outsite the province. You can't have it both ways.

If that hotel or that area welcomes thousands of francophones (Quebecers, French, whatever) yearly, maybe it would be wise to have someone with some knowledge of french. Not an obligation but word would spread and that hotel would soon benefit from it.

Same reason why Quebecers outside of Mtl who are like 80% francophones learn English especially if they rely on tourism.
Doesnt mean you cant go to Cuba because there is a francophone-friendly hotel in the Dominican Republic.

I spend most of my winters in South Florida. Many health clinics, law firms, travel agencies, advertise service in French.

I feel for these folks who can barely speak English. Its a shame. Most are 60+ to be fair.

 

[haveandare]

There is no quick rebuild for them imo.

If they really commit to it wholesale, move Weber and price at the very least, hoard draft picks and hope you hit a grand slam with a few of them.

They really, really messed up the past few years, no quick fix really since they have little now and somehow also have little in the way of really good futures too.

 

[sharknado]

If that hotel or that area welcomes thousands of francophones (Quebecers, French, whatever) yearly, maybe it would be wise to have someone with some knowledge of french. Not an obligation but word would spread and that hotel would soon benefit from it.

Same reason why Quebecers outside of Mtl who are like 80% francophones learn English especially if they rely on tourism.
Doesnt mean you cant go to Cuba because there is a francophone-friendly hotel in the Dominican Republic.

I spend most of my winters in South Florida. Many health clinics, law firms, travel agencies, advertise service in French.

I feel for these folks who can barely speak English. Its a shame. Most are 60+ to be fair.

I agree. The elderly have a hard time getting serviced outside of Quebec for sure. For the current generation and onward, I think our school system should be more like some European countries where everyone knows at least 4 languages by the time they are finished with high school. In my days, I was forced to take courses like woodworking and home economics as of grade 9. I would have preferred to take language courses where it would be more useful to me than learning how to bake a cookie and how to cut wood.

 

[sandysan]

What if the new anglophone coach from Ontario or the East coast simply understands that talking to an important part of your fanbase is important and decides to do a crazy thing like learning basic French?

A few hours a week. A weeklong stay at Bergevin's cottage with no English allowed.

And Drouin was not traded for because he is speaking French. This is only brought up because he did not live up to expectations.

you mean like what randy cunneyworth said HE WAS GOING TO DO before he got tossed under the wheels of the bus?

Please stop the " so long as they learn conversational french its okay". it's not. it never was.

And to suggest that drouin's langue maternelle didnt factor into his acquisition is laughable and you know it ( even if you wished it were not true).

 

[Perfect_Drug]

I think languages will be obsolete very soon.

Once AR takes off everyone will have subtitles in their glasses everywhere they go.

 

[BHD]

Bergevin has them poised for mediocrity every year. Good but not great players on long-term contracts.

 

[voxel]

Amazing a few years ago with Subban, Price, all the so called great D prospects (who all busted more or less).... to today. Traded McDonagh and Serg anyway too...

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Quebec city getting a team would help

 

[QCNords]

Focus on the center line.

First option: John Tavares; Overpayment require.

Second option: Leon Draisaitl; Depending on the lotery, build a trade around this year first rounder + (Galchenyuk?).

Third option: Ryan O'Reilly; Still depending on the lotery. I would still build a trade around this year first rounder or Galchenyuk...

Main trade chip a this draft: Max Pacioretty; Will get a first rounder (around 13-20) + a decent B+ prospect. Then, go around and find a left handed D to play with Shea Weber with this pick ++ (couple of second round picks?).

With one of these centers, i would play Hudon 2C (he is a center), Danault 3C and DeLarose or anything that pops out of training camp 4C.

Lets face it, MB and coach Julien are going nowhere...

Dont hate, at least i tried!

 

[HABsurde]

you don't rebuild, you move the team to Houston and Gary would be happy

 

[PinkFly]

Trade Weber to Toronto

 

[VanIsle]

Draft well and don't trade away #1 d's.

 

[member 290103]

You start at the top. Turf the GM. You bring in someone that basically cleans house. Communicate to the fanbase what the plan is. Have them prepare and accept that the team will have a hard time competing for a while.

Montreal is always going for the quick fix, it needs to stop.

 

[JLP]

Bergevin still has a lot of damage to do. Once he's gone it will take several years to recover.

 

[Hockeyholic]

Thru my won't contend until they get rid of the language policy.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Fire Gm ( not happening )

Weber Price Paciorrety Drouin Shaw Alzner Petry out hell even Galchenyuk and Gallagher on the block. ( Not happening )

Revamp scouting/coaching staff ( Not happening)

Tell the vocal french minority that lives in the past that we want to compete instead of appeasing the peasants. Hire best men for the job regardless of language ( not happening )

Start constructing a hockey team built on C's and D's. (Not happening)

Patience


Mb's plan : Put square peg in round hole. Pray carey puts up 920+ save pourcentage. Profit


Anybody thinking we can re-tool is lying to theirselves. I mean with competant people in place a retool could be possible but at this point it's gotta be a scorched rebuild from the ground up. The damage is done and management is only going to make it worst

 

[CartographerNo611]

Price, Weber, Alzner and Drouin are unmovable.

I’d keep Byron, Shaw, Gallagher, Petry, Galchenyuk unless some solid offers are made 4 em

Patches, Sherbak are trade bait.

Sign some cheap, speedier veteran 2 way players to fill out the roster and let the current garbage walk.

Draft skilled centers and defenseman and develop them well.

2-3 years in fire Julien

4-5 years bad contracts come off the books. Maybe a buyout or 2. Maybe a compliance buy out in 2020 lock out.

So at best, realistically, this is going to be 6 year rebuild if everything goes hunky dorey.

 

[YoSoyLalo]

It would probably take at least, like, 3 years to rid that team of their awful contracts, IF they could even be moved.

Honestly, the only thing that can rebuild the Canadiens is time.

Oh, and Bergevin getting axed. That would help.

 

[LeafFever]

They are the NHLs biggest mess.

 

[ole ole]

Hopefully not the same way as the Leafs. I would like to get by the 1st rd of the playoffs.