Saint Patrick
2 rings in my hears
- Feb 14, 2007
- 4,806
- 685
Houle for sure, but Bergevin is a close second. Its not comparable to the Roy trade, and this is coming from a Roy superfan, but Subban is pretty high up there for horrible trades.
Houle vs Bergevin
- Thread starter Bouboumaster
- Start date
Masao
Registered User
Well Bergevin and Houle had one thing in common. They made the fans feel like any possibility of being a contender was too good to be true.
Price is Wright
Registered User
Without the Recchi and Roy trades they would be running Damphousse/Turgeon/Leclair/Koivu/Bure so they needed another top six forward. Desjardins/Malakhov/Brisebois was probably good enough but another D wouldn't hurt and a lot were getting moved then for affordable prices.
With the Recchi/Roy trades, they needed a veteran/better goaltender as a platoon which they finally got in Hackett, but they could have went with Ranford in 96. They needed at least one more Top 4, maybe two, but they were pretty set offensively in 95-96. That's likely why Savard thought they were one move away. He saw that move being Roy for Nolan/Fiset, but that's a little too much confidence in Fiset. They didn't need a power forward (not that it would hurt) but someone to replace Desjardins.
Doc McKenna
A new era 2021
- Jan 5, 2009
- 11,821
- 11,752
He didn't have a run with the team he has built and good picks is not what I would say we have, plus that is generally the scout. What has Bergie traded for that is a vast improvement on houle or what he even inherited from Goat who was reviled by most.
roy munson
...
Thank you for the link, very interesting. Two things hit me while reading this: 1) I totally forgot about Darcy Tucker playing here (he was drafted by Savard in '93, 6th round) and 2), I always assumed that after being pulled, Roy told Corey that he wanted to be traded, but then I read this : "Now, some people have defended Houle on this one, pointing out that Roy had demanded a trade, so Houle’s hands were tied. But Roy didn’t actually demand a trade. What Roy said was that he would never play for head coach Mario Tremblay again." On the Roy trade alone I was leaning towards giving my vote to Houle, but after reading this I can't wait to click his name. Think about this, he had to choose between a rookie coach (a friend and ex-team mate who ended up coaching 159 games only...) and his concession player who was already one of the best G in NHL history.
It does remind me of somebody we know. Nepotism. Does. Not. Work.
Scintillating10
Registered User
Houle by a country mile. First move Houle did was trade Roy in franchise worst trade. Bergevin did have some success here. Won division last year, final 4 in 2014. He did make some good moves, ie. Byron, Waite for Price, etc... Bergevin just can't judge top talent.
In addition to being told to cut salary...
he was apparently held at gunpoint to make awful trades at the same time.
Don't only cut salary Reggie...make sure you don't get any quality back when trading Hall of Fame caliber players
The Gr8 Dane
L'harceleur
6 years . Petry,Byron,Danault. That's it....6 years. 3 decent additions...
6 years
I'd add radulov but the village idiot blew it
6 years
I'd add radulov but the village idiot blew it
You can't justify ANY trade Bergevin has made being worse than the Roy or Turgeon or Damphousse trades.
Not even close.
Bergevin has been bad, he owns that.
But Houle, regardless of how you want to paint a prettier picture for him, goes down as one of the worst GM's in professional sports history.
Kimota
ROY DU NORD!!!
Are you kidding? They needed a power forward. Getting Nolan would have completely changed that team and make it a contender. Those type of players were pretty rare at a time when PF were needed cause of the clutch and grab.
Price is Wright
Registered User
With Fiset in net? They weren't going anywhere. Do you remember him being the starter for the Kings in the mid-late 90s? Don't front.
If you're trading Roy, yes you try to get a powerforward for him, but you also try to get a competent goaltender. Houle attempted that actually. He tried to get a top six forward (Rucinsky), power forward (Kovalenko), and new goalie of the present/future (Thibault). It was 2/3 poorly scouted, but the mindset was there. Quebec/Colorado wasn't giving up a D as they needed one and gave up Nolan for Ozolinsh.
After trading away Desjardins, Houle should have been trying to get a top 4 D, power forward, and goalie.
hotcarle
Registered User
Thanks for reminding me that Pierre Lacroix gave up more for ozolinsh than he did for Roy.
Kimota
ROY DU NORD!!!
But at that point in time Fiset was seen as a competent goalie. And you can always get another one later.
No...not even close.
I don't think either the Turgeon or Damphousse trade brought back a player Weber's caliber (even though, I prefer Subban).
NORiculous
Registered User
Letting Markov and radulov go for f all, is for me as similar as Damphousse/Turgeon. Same type of caliber player.
Difference between MB and Houle is that MB did it on purpose. He sucks. Houle was stuck in a really bad situation with a cheap ass owner. MB has all the leverage and money possible.
Difference between MB and Houle is that MB did it on purpose. He sucks. Houle was stuck in a really bad situation with a cheap ass owner. MB has all the leverage and money possible.
Probably Houle but Houle just didnt know what he was doing, MB doesnt know what he is doing but he is an A -Hole
NORiculous
Registered User
The fact he's still here and going on 7 seasons and 8 years makes this reign worse. It's a never-ending nightmare.
Fish on The Sand
Untouchable
I'm just measuring the trade by what went out and what came back.
Habs traded Vincent Damphousse not because he was a pending UFA...but because they didn't want to re-sign him.
Vincent Damphousse ended up being traded for the following;
1999 5th round pick (M-A Thinel)
2000 1st round pick (Marcel Hossa)
2000 or 2001 2nd pick (Kiel McLeod)
Impact on franchise?
I guess that depends on how one defines "impact".
I can't compare a trade where a HOF-caliber player gets traded and the best you get back is Marcel Hossa.
PK Subban may be a HOF caliber player one day but there's as much chance Shea Weber will be too.
Ultimately, that's how I measure this trade.
Pierre Turgeon was still a very productive #1C when he was traded.
He was coming off a 96pt season (a total that remains the highest point totals by a Hab since Mats Naslund had over 100pts in the 80's).
He proceeded to have several more productive years for the Blues
So I'm not sure I agree with that at all...
Damphousse wasn't what he was when the Habs traded him, but he still played another 5yrs and put up more points than Marcel Hossa, Marc-Andre Thinel ever did.
Subban for Weber remains Bergevin's worse move, I won't deny that...
But it pails in comparison to the Roy/Turgeon/Damphousse trades.
The Habs would of been lucky to make off with a player of Weber's caliber in any of those trades.
With the season the Habs just had and with Subban getting a Norris nomination, it's easy to forget that Shea Weber is STILL a very, very good Dman in the NHL today.
The Habs did not get back any "very, very good" players in any of those trades.
