HOH Top 50 European Non-NHL Players of All Time

Theokritos

Global Moderator
Apr 6, 2010
12,538
4,911
This is the final list of the top European Non-NHL Players of All Time project, as determined by the History of Hockey community at HFBoards. "Non-NHL players" stands for players who spent most of their prime years, if not their entire career, outside of the North American leagues (NHL and WHA) and who many voters in the other ranking projects (Top Players, Defensemen, Goaltenders, Centers, Wingers) felt were difficult to rank for that very reason.

RankPlayerPos.BornDiedNationality
1Vyacheslav FetisovD1958Russia/USSR
2Sergei MakarovRW1958Russia/USSR
3Valeri KharlamovLW19481981Russia/USSR
4Anatoli FirsovLW19412000Russia/USSR
5Vladislav TretiakG1952Russia/USSR
6Boris MikhailovRW1944Russia/USSR
7Alexander MaltsevC, RW1949Russia/USSR
8Vladimír MartinecRW1949Czechia/ČSSR
9Jiří HolečekG1944Czechia/ČSSR
10Valeri VasilievD1949Russia/USSR
11Václav NedomanskýC, RW1944Czechia/ČSSR
12Jan SuchýD1944Czechia/ČSSR
13Vladimir PetrovC1947Russia/USSR
14František PospíšilD1944Czechia/ČSSR
15Vladimir KrutovW19602012Russia/USSR
16Alexei KasatonovD1959Russia/USSR
17Alexander YakushevLW1947Russia/USSR
18Igor LarionovC1960Russia/USSR
19Milan NovýC1951Czechia/ČSSR
20Sven "Tumba" JohanssonC19312011Sweden
21Vladimír ZábrodskýC1923Czechia/ČSSR
22Vsevolod BobrovLW19221979Russia/USSR
23Helmuts BalderisRW1952Latvia/USSR
24Jiří HolíkLW1944Czechia/ČSSR
25Vyacheslav StarshinovC1940Russia/USSR
26Nikolai SologubovD19241988Russia/USSR
27Ivan HlinkaC19502004Czechia/ČSSR
28Alexander RagulinD19412004Russia/USSR
29Veniamin AlexandrovLW19371991Russia/USSR
30Lennart SvedbergD19441972Sweden
31Sergei KapustinLW19531995Russia/USSR
32Vladimir LutchenkoD1949Russia/USSR
33Vitali DavydovD1939Russia/USSR
34Josef MalečekF19031982Czechia/ČSSR
35Vladimír DzurillaG1942Slovakia/ČSSR
36Ulf SternerLW1941Sweden
37Håkan LoobRW1960Sweden
38Konstantin LoktevRW19331996Russia/USSR
39Alexander AlmetovC19401992Russia/USSR
40Vladimir VikulovRW1946Russia/USSR
41Vlastimil BubníkRW19312015Czechia/ČSSR
42Peter LindmarkG1956Sweden
43Viktor ShalimovRW1951Russia/USSR
44Jiří BublaD1950Czechia/ČSSR
45Boris MayorovC1938Russia/USSR
46Jozef GolonkaC1938Slovakia/ČSSR
47Nils NilssonC19362017Sweden
48Erich KühnhacklC1950Germany/BRD
49Vyacheslav BykovC1960Russia/USSR
50Jiří KrálíkG1952Czechia/ČSSR
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Links to the results of all the individual votes:
Round 2 Voting Results

Links to all the discussion threads that went into making this list:
Round 2, Vote 1 (1-4)
Rounde 2, Vote 2 (5-8)
Round 2, Vote 3 (9-11)
Round 2, Vote 4 (12-16)
Round 2, Vote 5 (17-20)
Round 2, Vote 6 (21-25)
Round 2, Vote 7 (26-30)
Round 2, Vote 8 (31-35)
Round 2, Vote 9 (36-39)
Round 2, Vote 10 (40-45)
Round 2, Vote 11 (46-50)

Preliminary Threads:
HOH Non-NHL Europeans project - anybody interested? (preliminary thread from January 2015)
Rules Discussion Thread (started in May 2015)
List of eligible players
Preliminary & General Discussion (before voters submitted their Round 1 lists)

Links that explain the creation of the aggregate list that formed the basis of discussion. This data was released at the end of the project:
Round 1 Voting Results (Aggregate List)
Round 1 Screening Procedure

Listed here are the individual voting records of all participants:
Batis
DN28
Hedberg
Johnny Engine
KriminellPipa
MadArcand
Robert Gordon Orr
Sanf
seventieslord
Sprague Cleghorn
Sturminator
TAnnala
tarheelhockey
TheDevilMadeMe
VMBM
 
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TheDevilMadeMe

Registered User
Aug 28, 2006
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Brooklyn
Biggest divergences from the HOH Top Players by position lists so far - the relatively low position of Balderis, and the higher positions of pre-1963 Europeans.
 

MaxV

Registered User
Nov 6, 2006
4,888
590
New York, NY
Actually, among Russians that chose KHL's paychecks over NHL, I would pick Ilya Nikulin over either Radulov or Mozyakin. During his prime (not now), I absolutely think he was one of Russia's best 2-way defenseman (not saying much, but still).

I'm not suggesting he belongs though. He was more of "jack of all trades, master of none" kind of player. He is no Fetisov or Vasiliev.
 

TheDevilMadeMe

Registered User
Aug 28, 2006
52,271
6,980
Brooklyn
While I disagree with several placements, overall I guess you can do worse. The absence of Guryshev (nine top-ten point finishes) is puzzling.

The Soviet league was kind of crap when Guryshev played. Peak vs Peak, Bobrov was easily better, right?

What did Guryshev do internationally?
 

DN28

Registered User
Jan 2, 2014
629
576
Prague
From 90s on, Cechmanek would be the best candidate. Extremely consistent goalie throughout his prime (95-03) + being 4th in Hart, 2nd in Vezina and 2nd All-star (behind Hasek) in his first NHL season is pretty good too.

Radulov might have a case too.
 

seventieslord

Student Of The Game
Mar 16, 2006
36,080
7,132
Regina, SK
How about Patrick Thoresen's European career? I'm actually surprised NHL didn't come calling after that awesome 2012 WHC performance.

So we're talking about a guy whom you're surprised didn't get an nhl job, who previously was a mediocre nhl player? We've put players on the list for whom there is almost universal agreement they were on par with star players in the NHL.
 

Theokritos

Global Moderator
Apr 6, 2010
12,538
4,911
Now that we're through with the voting and the top 50 list is finished, I want to thank everbody who contributed to this project. The first on the list is TheDevilMadeMe whose advise to his newbie co-administrator, me, was crucial. His experience from earlier projects allowed us to navigate around shallows I wouldn't have been aware of on my own. Next are those individuals who took the time and effort to screen the vote 1 lists (top 70 ballots) for glaring omissions and questionable choices, we were able to correct quite a few oversights thanks to their work.

The biggest thank you of course has to go to the voters: this project essentially consists of their contributions and submissions. The task to rank these European players was probably a bigger challenge than the earlier positional rankings and it showed as the number of participants was smaller. There were times when the debates turned a bit silent, I guess due to the difficulty of digging out tangible new informations about quite a few of the players. All the more the community owes a lot of appreciation to those participants like VMBM, DN28, Robert Gordon Orr and some others who were willing and able to provide us with invaluable new pieces of information from various books and papers, many of them originally in Swedish, Finnish or Czech. Apologies if I have forgotten someone I should have named along with those names.

Last but not least a thank you goes to those non-participants who still chimed in with some input, information or ideas, be it in the preliminary phase or during the voting debates.

I hope the voters don't feel I'm doing them any injustice when I say the following: In my personal opinion the top-50 list they have created should not be viewed as the last word on the topic. Let's keep in mind that it's probably one of the first organized attempts by any group of hockey history enthusiasts to come up with a transnational all-time ranking. Eight years ago the first of the HOH "best player of all time" lists was created and when you look back at it then it's obvious a lot of opinions have changed in the time that has passed. The community knows a lot more now than it did back then. And yet, it all started with that top 100 list and it provided the baseline for what followed. Our project should be viewed in the same light: it's more of a first word than a last. And already we've learned a lot during the project and know more than we did when we started, and that's the purpose of the whole enterprise as far as I'm concerned. Cheers to everybody.
 

johan f

Registered User
Jun 23, 2008
2,374
871
Sweden
Mats Waltin and Anders Eldebrink belongs on the list. They were outstanding. Svedberg does not belong.

I miss Mats Ã…hlberg as well.

Too many players from a distant era on the list.
 

Kibe

Regular User
Jan 17, 2012
730
369
Helsinki
Did Ville Peltonen have too many seasons in the NHL to count on this? Or why wasnt one of the all time finnish NT legends even an option for the vote?
 

Theokritos

Global Moderator
Apr 6, 2010
12,538
4,911
Did Ville Peltonen have too many seasons in the NHL to count on this? Or why wasnt one of the all time finnish NT legends even an option for the vote?

He was eligible, but only two of the 15 voters had him on their top 70 list and none in their top 50. Check out the aggregate list.
 

Hardyvan123

tweet@HardyintheWack
Jul 4, 2010
17,552
24
Vancouver
So we're talking about a guy whom you're surprised didn't get an nhl job, who previously was a mediocre nhl player? We've put players on the list for whom there is almost universal agreement they were on par with star players in the NHL.

That last part is extremely subjective and hopefull at best case scenarios for most of the pre 70's players right?I mean people talk about the quality of the KHL for Radu love and then skip over the relative weakness of tournament teams pre 1972 summit series as the WHC team quality.and depth was probably worse.
 

Hobnobs

Pinko
Nov 29, 2011
8,864
2,236
While I dont agree with the rankings at all basically :laugh: I do think most of the important players are atleast listed so its a pretty good list.
 

MaxV

Registered User
Nov 6, 2006
4,888
590
New York, NY
That last part is extremely subjective and hopefull at best case scenarios for most of the pre 70's players right?I mean people talk about the quality of the KHL for Radu love and then skip over the relative weakness of tournament teams pre 1972 summit series as the WHC team quality.and depth was probably worse.

Well, you make a subjective point also.

The idea that Summit Series 1972 be used as a starting point of European hockey quality is flawed logic. Keep in mind, the reason that series happened in the first place was because guys like Firsov, Starshinov and Alexandrov dominated for a decade.
 
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