Hockey Canada mandates cross ice hockey

[Pez68]

Both of these posts are spot on.

I have zero issue with Cross-ice hockey for the pre-Atom age groups. I think it's a good thing.

But like you said, practices still need to be on a full-sized sheet.

Too many coaches at the lowest youth levels think this is the NHL. The focus for coaches up to the teenage years should be all about skills development..skating, passing, shooting, stick-handling.

Kids will figure out their role based on what their stronger skills are when they approach teenage years. Players generally like to do the things they do well more often than the things they don't do well.

Tons of time to learn systems and positioning. Some will of already figured it out on their own. I had the misfortune of some pretty awful coaches as a youth player, can't say any of them taught me much about systems and positioning. By the time I was 12-13, I had figured a lot of it out on my own, as will many kids.

Bingo... All positioning is, is hockey sense anyway. Teach kids anticipation and how to read the ice and read the play, and they can play in any system and any position. This is what I'm trying to do with the kids I coach. Work on skills, and make them think the game. Give them general guidelines on how to accomplish the goal, but for the most part, let them play and figure it out. I think this should be ESPECIALLY true at the higher levels of travel hockey. Most of the kids already have the skills. What they are lacking is that ability to read the game.

 

[TorMapleJays]

So, I have attended two clinics in hockey canada, and they are emphasizing the figure it out method, they want to foster creativity, and vision, and i believe this is steps in the right direction. If you can create a gap in half ice hockey, your going to be dominate in full ice hockey.

 

[Alex Jones]

Here's the thing... It's not one or the other. I have no issues with cross-ice hockey. HOWEVER, it has to be mixed in with full ice practices. Kids have to learn to use the entire ice.... Create space. Develop stamina, and top speed. Learn how to hit players in stride with passes. There are a lot of things cross-ice hockey is good at. And a lot of things that it lacks.

I don't know precisely what all of the reasoning behind this is, but I have suspected for a long time that cross ice hockey is designed with the same concept as modern soccer/football development.

Most academies consider a players technical development finished around 13 years old. While this doesn't mean that a player is fully developed, their core technical skillset (dribbling, first touch, passing, shooting) is considered generally finished. Everything after that is about teaching a player how to apply those skills in real match situations and body development. Cross ice hockey has always seemed to me like a similar system. Load up on technical development at a young age (stickhandling, passing, shooting), then work on learning the game at a higher level later in development. We've seen this work to some degree in the US, I think this is a good move by Hockey Canada. Basically this sacrifices intellectual and physical development for technical development in younger age groups.

 

[Bedards Dad]

Great! More touches, faster game, and cheaper ice time for parents.

Grownups play on “FULL SHEET” scale of what an 8 year old sees!....

That looks like a blast!!!!

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Great! More touches, faster game, and cheaper ice time for parents.

Registration opens here in a few days. Don't see any reduction in fees on the website. (Wasn't expecting it either.) They can go to town on tweaking the development models like this, but it'll never compensate for losing half the population due to the costs.

 

[Yukon Joe]

We registered a couple of weeks ago. If I understand it right ice time isn't any cheaper because they're not trying to cram 4 novice teams onto a single sheet of ice - the dressing rooms alone couldn't handle it. Instead they put up boards to shrink the ice (and it's half-ice in novice, but cross-ice in the younger age groups).

Interestingly in Alberta they partially caved though. 2010 kids (which my son is), who already played full ice hockey last year, will be classed as 'senior novice' (or something like that) and will continue to play full ice. 2011 kids will be junior novice and play on half ice. I'm not sure what I think about that.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

We registered a couple of weeks ago. If I understand it right ice time isn't any cheaper because they're not trying to cram 4 novice teams onto a single sheet of ice - the dressing rooms alone couldn't handle it. Instead they put up boards to shrink the ice (and it's half-ice in novice, but cross-ice in the younger age groups).

Interestingly in Alberta they partially caved though. 2010 kids (which my son is), who already played full ice hockey last year, will be classed as 'senior novice' (or something like that) and will continue to play full ice. 2011 kids will be junior novice and play on half ice. I'm not sure what I think about that.

That's a good point. We have a lot of multiplex rinks here where if they really tried they could probably manage the room issue. Or they could stagger icetimes and share rooms, etc. But it would be hard to have 4 teams going in some of the other 1-sheet rinks with 4 more coming in behind them. It would seem like a shame to have half-ice/cross-ice hockey though and leave the other half of the ice empty.

Either way, I think the idea that one advantage of this shift is that it will save parents money is fictitious.

 

[Chrisinroch]

Registration opens here in a few days. Don't see any reduction in fees on the website. (Wasn't expecting it either.).

Feel free to volunteer for the board if you think the money is being spent poorly. I know hockey associations are always scrambling to make ends meet. I’m guessing the money from ice time savings went to plug another hole and maybe kept the fees the same. But like I said; maybe your association is different and you could help fix that.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Feel free to volunteer for the board if you think the money is being spent poorly. I know hockey associations are always scrambling to make ends meet. I’m guessing the money from ice time savings went to plug another hole and maybe kept the fees the same. But like I said; maybe your association is different and you could help fix that.

No need to be defensive about it. I already said I didn't expect to see any reduction in fees, but I didn't say why or mean to imply that the money would be spent poorly. Rink costs are rising steadily, fees are rising, it's all tied together and I know the people on the board and have total faith in them doing the best they can at keeping all balls in the air to the best of anyone's ability.

But I do think there has been a tendency to use a possible reduction in costs to parents as a "selling point" for this switch to cross-ice/half-ice hockey - not by our association, nor even necessarily by HC - just it seems to pop up frequently in the discussions downstream. And it's a total red herring. The benefits of the half-ice hockey are purely developmental and should only be taken as such.

 

[Yukon Joe]

No need to be defensive about it. I already said I didn't expect to see any reduction in fees, but I didn't say why or mean to imply that the money would be spent poorly. Rink costs are rising steadily, fees are rising, it's all tied together and I know the people on the board and have total faith in them doing the best they can at keeping all balls in the air to the best of anyone's ability.

But I do think there has been a tendency to use a possible reduction in costs to parents as a "selling point" for this switch to cross-ice/half-ice hockey - not by our association, nor even necessarily by HC - just it seems to pop up frequently in the discussions downstream. And it's a total red herring. The benefits of the half-ice hockey are purely developmental and should only be taken as such.

For what it's worth in Edmonton I haven't heard anyone try to justify it based on costs.

 

[Chrisinroch]

I wasn’t being defensive, but I did wrongly take your comment as criticism of your association. So I was being serious about being part of a solution if you had perceived a problem.

Believe me, I think the half sheet game is developmentally better for young kids; more touches, faster, etc. Even bigger kids benefit from 3-on-3 cross ice for creativity and decision making.

However, I don’t think there’s anything false about the cost saving argument. 3 practices or 2 games vs 1 is a cost savings.

 

[francis246]

The thing is the keeping score and friendship part that rubs people the wrong way. Like the goal limit on kids.

This is what they should do, instead of having age groups, have skill groups, it's that simple.

skill is subjective and telling a kid that they aren't as skilled as their peers at a young age can do a lot of damage to their psyche and actually cause them to leave the sport. As we know many hockey players blossom as they get older and as they grow. Just because you are skilled at 6-10 years of age it doesn't mean you will make it far

 

[Spirit of 67]

If you don't want to keep score, stop teaching kids how to count.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

If you don't want to keep score, stop teaching kids how to count.

You can keep score without heaping pressure or other constraints associated with the score onto the kids. They may still do it themselves. But if parents and coaches don't, that'd help.

 

[BogsDiamond]

If you don't want to keep score, stop teaching kids how to count.

This usually isn't the problem. The problem with lopsided scores is that some jackass coach decides to triple-shift their best player despite being up 20 goals.
What that usually means is that one team (typically one ore two kids) always have the puck so the game turns into a game for 1. That's not good for any of the players on the ice regardless of which team they're on.

I've been coaching for over a decade with three different kids and I see this every. single. year.
When calling the coach on being a d'bag they are either really good at acting, or have no idea that they're being a giant a'hole.

 

[Spirit of 67]

This usually isn't the problem. The problem with lopsided scores is that some jackass coach decides to triple-shift their best player despite being up 20 goals.
What that usually means is that one team (typically one ore two kids) always have the puck so the game turns into a game for 1. That's not good for any of the players on the ice regardless of which team they're on.

I've been coaching for over a decade with three different kids and I see this every. single. year.
When calling the coach on being a d'bag they are either really good at acting, or have no idea that they're being a giant a'hole.

And not keeping score solves this problem?

And I do get it. I coached my little niece in soccer and had no interest in doing it again. Far too many people didn’t understand they were only 5 years old.

 

[BogsDiamond]

And not keeping score solves this problem?

And I do get it. I coached my little niece in soccer and had no interest in doing it again. Far too many people didn’t understand they were only 5 years old.

Yes. If d'bag coach sees that nobody's keeping score, there's less incentive to double-shift Johnny to pump more goals in.
In fact, if you advertise that scores won't be recorded, chances are good d'bags will stay off the bench.
Problem solved.

Besides, what does keeping score actually do? Especially for 6YO's?
The only people that care are overbearing parents who give a s**t about some non-consequential sporting event. Like it's suddenly going to make their genitals bigger or their job better.
"My 6YO scored 4 goals in a cross-ice game!! My life has meaning! I'm not an unemployed, overweight loser with impotence problems any longer! What a time to be alive!"

I have no problem with keeping score when the kids are older, but for kids 7 and under, who gives a s**t.

 

[puckpilot]

"My 6YO scored 4 goals in a cross-ice game!! My life has meaning! I'm not an unemployed, overweight loser with impotence problems any longer! What a time to be alive!"

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter if the score is on the board or not. D-bags will be d-bags and they'll know exactly how many goals, assists, hits, take aways, ice-time, etc. their kid has.

Seriously, I was watching my nephew play when he was 6, and this jackass dad is yelling at the top of his lungs from the stand for his kid to take the body. It took all my common sense and restraint not rip his tiny pee-pee off and sew his mouth shut with it. I mean, FFS, at that age, it's basically a scrum bouncing around the ice and at any moment there are 2-3 kids exploding into a yard sale already.

And quite honestly, regardless of it's on the board or not, most parents know how many their kid got, even the ones who are sane. And from my experience, not keeping score doesn't stop coaches from double shifting their "stars".

 

[Spirit of 67]

Yes. If d'bag coach sees that nobody's keeping score, there's less incentive to double-shift Johnny to pump more goals in.
In fact, if you advertise that scores won't be recorded, chances are good d'bags will stay off the bench.
Problem solved.

Besides, what does keeping score actually do? Especially for 6YO's?
The only people that care are overbearing parents who give a s**t about some non-consequential sporting event. Like it's suddenly going to make their genitals bigger or their job better.
"My 6YO scored 4 goals in a cross-ice game!! My life has meaning! I'm not an unemployed, overweight loser with impotence problems any longer! What a time to be alive!"

I have no problem with keeping score when the kids are older, but for kids 7 and under, who gives a s**t.

Fair enough.

 

[NewDef]

Thing is, this is only for novice. As soon as they turn Atom, it go back to full ice. Hockey sense, playing in traffic, 1 on 1, hands, confidence and FUN is more important than overall skating speed at this age. Spatio temporal / game space perception and anticipation should be developped before 11-12 as this is much harder to develop later, it's related to brain development WHILE strength, stride perfection, cardio can very well be developped a bit later if the kid only uses hockey for conditionning (although most high level players do play other sports such as soccer, baseball and tennis which help with high intensity/low duration efforts, endurance and general strength).

I too wanted to whine about it, but realized it makes sense... as it happen, i will be coaching my eldest in the last year of full-ice novice and i was not disapointed about it... I guess #2 and #3 will be on half-ice and we'll see how it goes....

 

[BogsDiamond]

Thing is, this is only for novice. As soon as they turn Atom, it go back to full ice. Hockey sense, playing in traffic, 1 on 1, hands, confidence and FUN is more important than overall skating speed at this age. Spatio temporal / game space perception and anticipation should be developped before 11-12 as this is much harder to develop later, it's related to brain development WHILE strength, stride perfection, cardio can very well be developped a bit later if the kid only uses hockey for conditionning (although most high level players do play other sports such as soccer, baseball and tennis which help with high intensity/low duration efforts, endurance and general strength).

I too wanted to whine about it, but realized it makes sense... as it happen, i will be coaching my eldest in the last year of full-ice novice and i was not disapointed about it... I guess #2 and #3 will be on half-ice and we'll see how it goes....

I coached my boys when they played and my daughter is starting in a season or two. Going cross-ice games actually makes me excited about coaching her.
I was dead-set against ever getting back on the ice, lol.