Here's why Quenneville still sux

[LDF]

If you don't want to devote much time to a bad team that's your call, but front running or being fair-weather about it is a pretty clear indicator that you're more casual than others.

no offense intended, but what is the numerical number that a person needs to give to show that they are not a fair weather fan ??

 

[LDF]

no offense intended, but what is the numerical number that a person needs to give to show that they are not a fair weather fan ??

you know, after rereading this, i can see how it may come out as i am being a dick. so i will attempt to answer my own question, and i should have posted that it was rhetorical in nature.

but a fan to me is a person who claims to be a fan. there is no need to show that, that person is not. be a fan and step up and claim the fandom of a great team, Bhawks in a great sport. NHL.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

In terms of what? Money? I'm not talking money.

 

[LDF]

In terms of what? Money? I'm not talking money.

neither am i and i am sorry if it came out that way.

for me there is no tape measuring instrument that needs to be used to show how 1 person is a fan or a bigger fan then the other.

some fans has a great lifestyle and can afford to show their fandom while a candy vendor can only show his or hers fandom by listening to radio or local drinking establishment nite of fun.

a fan is a fan.

 

[Pez68]

If you don't want to devote much time to a bad team that's your call, but front running or being fair-weather about it is a pretty clear indicator that you're more casual than others.

But there's a distinction there you are missing. I don't have an issue supporting a bad team that is moving in the right direction. Hell, 2007-2008 was probably my record year for attending Hawks' games and events, and they didn't even make the playoffs that year. What I have a problem with is the team being OK with the status quo. A team satisfied with just making the playoffs... or 1st round exits...or not even making the playoffs.

The Hawks thinking the coaching this season has been acceptable would be a sign, to me, that they care more about the perception behind firing Q than they do about moving forward and improving. The power play has never been worse. This team has never been more unprepared to play. This team has never had this little compete, or energy level. It's really hard to have a hockey team that isn't fun to watch this season. The Hawks are one of them. If it is unacceptable to me as a fan, it better be unacceptable to the powers that be.

I have no idea how this somehow makes me a lesser fan.

 

[LDF]

But there's a distinction there you are missing. I don't have an issue supporting a bad team that is moving in the right direction. Hell, 2007-2008 was probably my record year for attending Hawks' games and events, and they didn't even make the playoffs that year. What I have a problem with is the team being OK with the status quo. A team satisfied with just making the playoffs... or 1st round exits...or not even making the playoffs.

The Hawks thinking the coaching this season has been acceptable would be a sign, to me, that they care more about the perception behind firing Q than they do about moving forward and improving. The power play has never been worse. This team has never been more unprepared to play. This team has never had this little compete, or energy level. It's really hard to have a hockey team that isn't fun to watch this season. The Hawks are one of them.

what you are expressing and in terms that many can see, is what i am sure many are experiencing.

while you make a lot of great points here and in other posts, nothing can be said or done from the team until the season is over. so in other words, we are in a state of constant limbo until the season and playoff is over and hoping that the FO does the right thing.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

But there's a distinction there you are missing. I don't have an issue supporting a bad team that is moving in the right direction. Hell, 2007-2008 was probably my record year for attending Hawks' games and events, and they didn't even make the playoffs that year. What I have a problem with is the team being OK with the status quo. A team satisfied with just making the playoffs... or 1st round exits...or not even making the playoffs.

The Hawks thinking the coaching this season has been acceptable would be a sign, to me, that they care more about the perception behind firing Q than they do about moving forward and improving. The power play has never been worse. This team has never been more unprepared to play. This team has never had this little compete, or energy level. It's really hard to have a hockey team that isn't fun to watch this season. The Hawks are one of them. If it is unacceptable to me as a fan, it better be unacceptable to the powers that be.

I have no idea how this somehow makes me a lesser fan.

Fan is short for fanatic. Having conditions for your support by definition makes you less of a nut job than somebody who doesn't.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

I actually think the arguing about who is a better fan generally is pretty silly. Be whatever kind of fan you like.

My gif of confusion was in response to trying to equate teaching your kids a lesson as a parent and not supporting a struggling team. Don't see how that applies at all.

I'll add that frequently posting on a message board about the team puts us all towards the die hard end of the spectrum of fandom.

 

[deytookerjaabs]

Here's why Q's system is DEAD:


It relies on offensive talent schooled to out-team-defend the other team. Thus, through all the conservative play we're supposed to, in theory, cash in more on equal or less high end opportunities.

We've gotten all the depth contribution we could ask for while the top end talents in Toews/Saad (Hossa) have been neutered. You either need to....replace those guys with "prime" examples..i.e.legit 1st line talent...or change the system to give them higher end scoring chances so they can contribute more.

No one is going to give us a first line, what happened to the LA Kings was a fluke, not the norm.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Here's why Q's system is DEAD:


It relies on offensive talent schooled to out-team-defend the other team. Thus, through all the conservative play we're supposed to, in theory, cash in more on equal or less high end opportunities.

We've gotten all the depth contribution we could ask for while the top end talents in Toews/Saad (Hossa) have been neutered. You either need to....replace those guys with "prime" examples..i.e.legit 1st line talent...or change the system to give them higher end scoring chances so they can contribute more.

No one is going to give us a first line, what happened to the LA Kings was a fluke, not the norm.

There's some truth to what your saying but I think the defense is the biggest problem. The current team has 1 maybe 2 legit top 4 defenders. No other Q team was that thin at the blue line.

That's not to say I don't think Q needs to go, just that isee the defensive talent or lack thereof as the bigger issue than the forwards.

 

[Pez68]

There's some truth to what your saying but I think the defense is the biggest problem. The current team has 1 maybe 2 legit top 4 defenders. No other Q team was that thin at the blue line.

That's not to say I don't think Q needs to go, just that isee the defensive talent or lack thereof as the bigger issue than the forwards.

And this coaching staff has not been able to develop a single defenseman in 10 years? And the head coach played defense??

The truth of the matter is, Q was given a cup winning defensive squad on a silver platter. He has NEVER had to coach up the defense, or develop a player to fill a hole. Now that the Hawks require that? Failure. Total and complete failure.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

I actually think the arguing about who is a better fan generally is pretty silly. Be whatever kind of fan you like.

My gif of confusion was in response to trying to equate teaching your kids a lesson as a parent and not supporting a struggling team. Don't see how that applies at all.

I'll add that frequently posting on a message board about the team puts us all towards the die hard end of the spectrum of fandom.

Agreed with all of this. I'd like to think I've been pretty good about not trashing anybody for becoming a fan during the Hawks resurgence/golden era. But I'm a hockey nut. I watch regular season Hawks games over playoff baseball when my teams in it. Not saying anybody here is or isn't "a real fan" but there's certainly levels to it.

 

[jls24]

There's some truth to what your saying but I think the defense is the biggest problem. The current team has 1 maybe 2 legit top 4 defenders. No other Q team was that thin at the blue line.

That's not to say I don't think Q needs to go, just that isee the defensive talent or lack thereof as the bigger issue than the forwards.

Keith, Murphy, Kempny, and Rutta are all top 4 defenders. Oesterle is close.

The problem is Kempny is lucky to even get to play because Q made a snap decision to not like him for some reason and Q deploys his defense all wrong.

Last game Kempny played 10 min, Rutta 14, while Seabs played 23 and Oesterle 26.

He can't coach defense, admittedly doesn't coach offense, can't put together a sensible roster (his fwd lines have been better lately), and doesn't deploy players to give them and the team the best chance for success.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

And this coaching staff has not been able to develop a single defenseman in 10 years? And the head coach played defense??

The truth of the matter is, Q was given a cup winning defensive squad on a silver platter. He has NEVER had to coach up the defense, or develop a player to fill a hole. Now that the Hawks require that? Failure. Total and complete failure.

And he once said, all puffy chested, I don't coach offense. As if offense just comes along all by itself.

The guy is classic right place right time, let's not make more of it than that. For any great tweaking moves he has made they were preceded by at least 2 idiotic moves that needed to be undone.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

He can't coach defense, admittedly doesn't coach offense, can't put together a sensible roster (his fwd lines have been better lately), and doesn't deploy players to give them and the team the best chance for success.

BBBBut he's a coaching genius headed to HOF.

 

[Panzerspitze]

Well, Quenneville did "develop" Sharp from a 10-SHG (and 3-SHG the next season) PK center into a one-dimensional PP winger/pointman who sucked more and more on breakaways and in shootouts. And Keith/Seabrook gradually went from a shutdown pairing to two defensive sieves. Ladd/Bickell/Eager's shots all got worse the longer they were "coached" in Quenneville's "system". Kruger became almost completely offensively impotent. Boland too, but there might be an injury excuse.

 

[deytookerjaabs]

There's some truth to what your saying but I think the defense is the biggest problem. The current team has 1 maybe 2 legit top 4 defenders. No other Q team was that thin at the blue line.

That's not to say I don't think Q needs to go, just that isee the defensive talent or lack thereof as the bigger issue than the forwards.

I think with a blue line upgrade beyond offensive type guys that Q wouldn't like anyways (look at how he treated soup last year) we'd still be getting shut down on the other end on a regular basis.

Having a first line that could match up defensively and outscore the other teams first line more times than not was an integral part to Q's game plan.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

What's really weird about Q is that he hit his offensive high water mark as a 22 year old and had nearly 50% of points on the PP.

This is Q's 10th season. So far there have been 3 Cups and 4 first round exits, this season may miss the playoffs entirely. Actually looks like a team underachieving to me.

 

[BobbyJet]

And he once said, all puffy chested, I don't coach offense. As if offense just comes along all by itself.

The guy is classic right place right time, let's not make more of it than that. For any great tweaking moves he has made they were preceded by at least 2 idiotic moves that needed to be undone.

Exactly. It's quite obvious isn't it? Q can coach players who don't require development. However, that coaching amounts to his insistence that players adhere to his dumb ass system. Other than that the players are on their own.

When the experienced players buy into the country club, they begin to take many things for granted, hence get fatter, lazier and tend to lose their hunger. The offense and creativity is the first thing to go.

Take a look at any successful team and the first thing you'll notice is the players are not only playing well but with plenty of attitude, emotion and importantly are having fun. Remember the teams from 2009, 2010? They were never out of a game. There's been no fun in Chicago for some time.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Keith, Murphy, Kempny, and Rutta are all top 4 defenders. Oesterle is close.

The problem is Kempny is lucky to even get to play because Q made a snap decision to not like him for some reason and Q deploys his defense all wrong.

Last game Kempny played 10 min, Rutta 14, while Seabs played 23 and Oesterle 26.

He can't coach defense, admittedly doesn't coach offense, can't put together a sensible roster (his fwd lines have been better lately), and doesn't deploy players to give them and the team the best chance for success.

I think Murphy probably is about a #4, but Kempny and Rutta are 3rd pairing guys to me. Osterle as well. At least at this point in there careers. They are all young and inexperienced though so there's room for growth. I'm curious to see what they do with those 3 going forward.

 

[Blue Liner]

Agreed with all of this. I'd like to think I've been pretty good about not trashing anybody for becoming a fan during the Hawks resurgence/golden era. But I'm a hockey nut. I watch regular season Hawks games over playoff baseball when my teams in it. Not saying anybody here is or isn't "a real fan" but there's certainly levels to it.

I think this is fair and true, and there is nothing wrong with that. Fandom evolves for various reasons, at least for some.

 

[BobbyJet]

For folks who think keeping Q until the season ends will make no difference, just look what Bruce Cassidy is doing in Boston. Cassidy took the Bruin reigns a year ago yesterday.

It took a while to get going but now the resurging Bruins are playing high paced hockey and could be #1 overall by this weekend. Bergeron and Chara are playing like kids.

 

[Blue Liner]

For folks who think keeping Q until the season ends will make no difference, just look what Bruce Cassidy is doing in Boston. Cassidy took the Bruin reigns a year ago yesterday.

It took a while to get going but now the resurging Bruins are playing high paced hockey and could be #1 overall by this weekend. Bergeron and Chara are playing like kids.

This only works if the person the organization would have in mind to replace him is free and available to start working immediately, even if they wanted to do this today.

 

[Pez68]

I think "The Chicago Blackhawks and Joel Quenneville have decided to mutually part ways" is a headline we read shortly after the regular season ends. They fired Kitchen last season as a warning shot, basically. I can't see how Q is back behind the bench next season.

 

[ray c]

you cannot have all your forwards behind the net,passing the puck back and forth.they get opened and no one is in front of the net.
that is our offence,in a nut shell.even our power play is based on perimeter hockey.
we have no players going to the dirty spots.only open man is the defence.