Has Quebec City been priced out of the NHL?

[Drytoast]

I'll actually agree with you on the diving/embellishment, there does seem to be more of that.
The instigator rule should be revoked. Let players settle it on the ice.

That said, IMO the game is better today than ever. The number of players with high end skill, puck control, speed, hard hitting is miles ahead of where it was.

Bobby Orr, the Canadiens of the 1970's were bright spots in an era that really had a lot of boring games.

One of the worst things that happened to hockey was the Broad Street Bullies, that was not hockey.

Things have been streamlined now to the point it's boring. All goalies look and play the same. All forwards do the same moves, it's just some can do it slightly better. Same with defense men. Nobody does anything really out of the box, except maybe on break ways...during the all star game. And ya never really see end to enders or players just able to dangle through 5 guys before scoring.

I miss there being a large skill gap, so we could see some outrageously beautiful plays.

The game has become drywall. Where every team looks the same. Sure it's faster, and the average skill level is higher...and the separation between most of these teams is slight. But this progression would have happened with or without the game being sold to the united states market.

I could watch games like this all day. And this was just a regular season division rival game...



Ya got high scoring, high fights...a lot of character. (Bester was a midget goalie, Hanlon had that god awful mask)

No diving, no cheap shit like Marchand or Kadri...

Players actually had a dislike for the other team because trades were less frequent and they were not all friends in the offseason.

The commentating was better...(miss ya prime Cole, Harry Neal)

Yup. Game's become homogenized drywall in comparison. Higher skill, but everyone looks and plays the same. It's safe, and has a broader appeal. And from where I'm sitting, I don't find that more entertaining or a better version of hockey.

Zzzzzzzzz

 

[GuelphStormer]

Let's be honest, Bettman is only interested in "growing the game" if he can extort someone else into paying for it. He regularly makes silly pronouncements that this or that team will be moved (or not arrive in the first place) if local leaders don't cough up untold hundreds of millions of public dollars to build him shiny new arenas and have the honour of hosting a team. The NHL's bullying of the City of Glendale is perhaps the most shameless example of such greed and arrogance.

 

[Drytoast]

Let's be honest, Bettman is only interested in "growing the game" if he can extort someone else into paying for it. He regularly makes silly pronouncements that this or that team will be moved (or not arrive in the first place) if local leaders don't cough up untold hundreds of millions of public dollars to build him shiny new arenas and have the honour of hosting a team. The NHL's bullying of the City of Glendale is perhaps the most shameless example of such greed and arrogance.

The shit he's pulling with Calgary?

 

[zetajerk]

The **** he's pulling with Calgary?

You mean the shit that the Calgary owners are pulling?

 

[FMichael]

“You look at Houston and you look at (Quebec) … fifth largest in North America versus, you know, 105th, let’s say,” Jacobs continued. “So they have a different situation. Economically they’re challenged and numerically they’re challenged. They just don’t have the numbers.”

lol - so how's the Yotes doing these days Jeremy?

 

[New User Name]

“You look at Houston and you look at (Quebec) … fifth largest in North America versus, you know, 105th, let’s say,” Jacobs continued. “So they have a different situation. Economically they’re challenged and numerically they’re challenged. They just don’t have the numbers.”

lol - so how's the Yotes doing these days Jeremy?

That's the mind boggling thing.

I believe it was said the Canadian dollar value was one of the reasons for QC being deferred.
I guess Gary, Jeremy and the other owners were worried QC would be recipients of revenue sharing.

As someone who doesn't believe QC was ever in serious consideration by the league, I guess what does it matter.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

DOM, ARE YOU COMPARING NASCAR, to the Arizona Coyotes mega thread, I hope not

Not really. Although it's true that some of their fans do whine about tracks being in some parts the country (e.g. a road course in norcal) and not where they "should be" (closure of Rockingham, N. Wilkesboro), which *is* like the megathread, they're not as numerous.

But they can't whine about public ownership of tracks like they do in the MT, because it doesn't exist. In fact the league (ISC) essentially owns half the tracks.

No, the comparison being made was that there are fans of hockey and of NASCAR that are quite similar in their distaste for the way their sports have changed. As a fan of both sports who don't mind said changes, I find that humorous.

 

[Melrose Munch]

Not really. Although it's true that some of their fans do whine about tracks being in some parts the country (e.g. a road course in norcal) and not where they "should be" (closure of Rockingham, N. Wilkesboro), which *is* like the megathread, they're not as numerous.

But they can't whine about public ownership of tracks like they do in the MT, because it doesn't exist. In fact the league (ISC) essentially owns half the tracks.

No, the comparison being made was that there are fans of hockey and of NASCAR that are quite similar in their distaste for the way their sports have changed. As a fan of both sports who don't mind said changes, I find that humorous.

Those fans are holding NASCAR back. Racing has dissapeared from the consicuosness of the US because of NASCARS bad decisions. IndyCar is all but more popular then ping pong and you still drop the ball...

 

[End on a Hinote]

And the ones who are at the top doing the snubbing are the Proud, Patriotic Canadian players....excuse me while I vomit.

The vast majority of these good old boys prefer to retire in the land of the free and the home of the brave.....they couldn't give a **** about Canada. So many of them don't want to play for a Canadian team.

And what do most of the European/Russian players do after they retire, go back home.
American players playing for Canadian teams, you ask?.........go home.

So, when I hear Canadian born players complaining about the lack of a team in QC or snubbing "real fans" I'll take notice but they better hurry up because within 50 years Canadian born players will be a minority.

You need to do more research. Sure a lot of Canadian ex NHLers now reside in the US, but many have retired here too.

Eric Lindros resides in Toronto, and I know Joe Sakic frequently returns to Swift Current. And the Okanagan Valley is loaded with homes owned by former and current NHLers.

I’ve heard people say it’s “good for the game” for hockey teams to exist in all geographic areas. I’ve heard people say it’s “good for the game” for success in tournaments to be spread out geographically, because it gets fans from all areas engaged in the fun and excitement of hockey.

I’ve never ever heard anyone say that it’s “good for the game” for Canada to lose teams, or for Canada to fail in tournaments.

“I would like to experience X” =/= “I hope you never get to experience X”

I'm speaking more so about here on HF than the media as a whole. Obviously most here aren't Rhode scholars but the general consensus by many is that a Canadian hockey failure is a good thing for everyone else.

 

[Melrose Munch]

You need to do more research. Sure a lot of Canadian ex NHLers now reside in the US, but many have retired here too.

Eric Lindros resides in Toronto, and I know Joe Sakic frequently returns to Swift Current. And the Okanagan Valley is loaded with homes owned by former and current NHLers.



I'm speaking more so about here on HF than the media as a whole. Obviously most here aren't Rhode scholars but the general consensus by many is that a Canadian hockey failure is a good thing for everyone else.

Primary residence and stars. Eric is not a big star, Sakic returns for personal reasons. @2525 is talking most top players. Okanagan is full of summer residences. I don't think failure is and HF thing either, and if it is it spread from the league hq...

 

[tucker3434]

I don’t think anybody actually wants a team in Quebec except the people of Quebec. It’s going to be a tough hill to climb. Seattle and Houston are obviously higher on the priority list. If one of the two is expansion, you’re at 32 teams and in no rush to get to 33. And even then, I’m guessing Bettman will be looking for larger TV markets. I just don’t see it.

 

[LeafShark]

It boggles my mind that Canadian teams can draw in more actual TV viewers, but the potential for many more American viewers is what is selling... the advertising industry is stupid.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

It boggles my mind that Canadian teams can draw in more actual TV viewers, but the potential for many more American viewers is what is selling... the advertising industry is stupid.

In N Out was very successful in California for decades, and CA is a very fast growing high population state. Why do you think they've started putting franchises in AZ, NV, etc. when they could have just as easily opened those new stores in California?

 

[tucker3434]

It boggles my mind that Canadian teams can draw in more actual TV viewers, but the potential for many more American viewers is what is selling... the advertising industry is stupid.

The issue is net gain. How many viewers does it actually add as opposed to just changing the channel from a different team. If 1m people tune it for a Quebec game but there are 800k less watching the Habs game, you’ve netted 200k. If Houston has only 500k watching but only 100k less watching the Stars, you’ve netted 400k. You come out ahead with half the audience.

And as unfair as it is, it’s just easier to pull those net additions from places where people don’t care about hockey (right now).

 

[GuelphStormer]

The issue is net gain. How many viewers does it actually add as opposed to just changing the channel from a different team. If 1m people tune it for a Quebec game but there are 800k less watching the Habs game, you’ve netted 200k. If Houston has only 500k watching but only 100k less watching the Stars, you’ve netted 400k. You come out ahead with half the audience.

And as unfair as it is, it’s just easier to pull those net additions from places where people don’t care about hockey (right now).

its difficult to equate two very different markets and to reduce it to #viewers. i think its more about what advertisers are willing to pay for these sorts of ratings (whatever they work out to in your example), and that's the crap shoot that broadcasters have to take when they bid on the contract with the NHL.

im not so sure rogers/(subcontracted to RDS) is necessarily willing to pay less for 200K more viewers than NBC/FOX/Netflix/(?) is willing to pay for 400K viewers. perhaps Rogers/RDS values those viewers more.

also, im sure the league would try to schedule national broadcasts of overlapping markets (Habs/Nords; Stars/Houston) to maximize viewers. but yeah, i do agree, there would liekly be more net viewers of a team in houston and who's to say they wouldn't instantly become a stanley cup winner. what are the odds of that?

 

[FMichael]

I don’t think anybody actually wants a team in Quebec except the people of Quebec. It’s going to be a tough hill to climb. Seattle and Houston are obviously higher on the priority list. If one of the two is expansion, you’re at 32 teams and in no rush to get to 33. And even then, I’m guessing Bettman will be looking for larger TV markets. I just don’t see it.

Not so.

Many fans of teams around the league would love to see the return of the Nordiques.

Just that they'll most likely have to wait until a team from the east looks to sell/relocate...And that might be a while.

 

[Hal1971]

I don’t think anybody actually wants a team in Quebec except the people of Quebec. It’s going to be a tough hill to climb. Seattle and Houston are obviously higher on the priority list. If one of the two is expansion, you’re at 32 teams and in no rush to get to 33. And even then, I’m guessing Bettman will be looking for larger TV markets. I just don’t see it.

perhaps does not care if quebec is back or not, but not wanting ? Why be against Quebec return ? From a fan perspective , Quebec will only add to the league (ambiance, rivality, sold out loud crowd).

 

[tucker3434]

Not so.

Many fans of teams around the league would love to see the return of the Nordiques.

Just that they'll most likely have to wait until a team from the east looks to sell/relocate...And that might be a while.

I think it’d be cool to have them back too, but after that nostalgia blast wore off, I wouldn’t be watching them on a nightly basis like locals do. I don’t have reason to believe anyone else would either.

And again, this needs to be new people turning the game on, not just changing the channel from a different team. If you’re the kind of fan that watches hockey every day anyway, the league isn’t as interested in you (as far as expansion/relocation is concerned) as they are in adding new viewers.

perhaps does not care if quebec is back or not, but not wanting ? Why be against Quebec return ? From a fan perspective , Quebec will only add to the league (ambiance, rivality, sold out loud crowd).

Im mainly talking about the people in power. I think ownership groups of Montreal, Toronto, Ottawa, Buffalo, etc would actively oppose it. And I think Bettman would go out of his way to make it easier for a Houston-type city to get a team.

As a neutral fan, would it be cooler to have a team in Quebec rather than Houston? For sure. How much money would I spend to see it happen? None.

 

[zetajerk]

perhaps does not care if quebec is back or not, but not wanting ? Why be against Quebec return ? From a fan perspective , Quebec will only add to the league (ambiance, rivality, sold out loud crowd).

Ask any Hurricanes, Coyotes, Panthers fans.

 

[Melrose Munch]

perhaps does not care if quebec is back or not, but not wanting ? Why be against Quebec return ? From a fan perspective , Quebec will only add to the league (ambiance, rivality, sold out loud crowd).

No new money or fans
Boston and montreal
Will be a target of a lot of no trade clauses

I guess those are the league reasons.

 

[FMichael]

perhaps does not care if quebec is back or not, but not wanting ? Why be against Quebec return ? From a fan perspective , Quebec will only add to the league (ambiance, rivality, sold out loud crowd).

Many apparently feel the BoG would rather risk having another Coyotes/Canes/Panthers in an untapped market rather than a franchise in a much smaller market that will at least make some $$$, and sell out home games.

 

[voyageur]

I don’t think anybody actually wants a team in Quebec except the people of Quebec. It’s going to be a tough hill to climb. Seattle and Houston are obviously higher on the priority list. If one of the two is expansion, you’re at 32 teams and in no rush to get to 33. And even then, I’m guessing Bettman will be looking for larger TV markets. I just don’t see it.

I think watching the Jets fans come out in masse for the playoffs makes Quebec City even more appealing.

If you think hockey fans deserve hockey. And the passion is good for the game. Win or lose. Because that is the bottom line. Winners have followers. Perennial losers Arizona, Carolina and the Isles don't. North of the border, teams can make the playoffs once in 7 years and still make a profit.


I think Houston is next in line, just for national growth, TV contract renewal. When Jacobs loses his grip, Nordiques Nation will return.

 

[Melrose Munch]

Ask any Hurricanes, Coyotes, Panthers fans.

That has nothing to do with it. It was the western teams that starting the anti southern campaign years ago to begin with.

 

[Roadrage]

Many apparently feel the BoG would rather risk having another Coyotes/Canes/Panthers in an untapped market rather than a franchise in a much smaller market that will at least make some $$$, and sell out home games.

If BoG keeps "deferring" QC, but pounce on Seattle and possibly Houston in a heartbeat, the feelings and optics appear true.

 

[powerstuck]

Lets suppose there is an unnoticed dormant volcano under TD Garden in Boston.

It erupts on October 1st and by chance there are no victims but the TD Garden is destroyed.

Where do Boston Bruins play their season ? All 82 road games ? In XL Center ?

I know where Flyers played in 1968.