Greatest Net Front Presence Of All Time
- Thread starter 67Leafs67
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Admiral Awesome
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2015
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Holmstrom is the first guy that popped into my head.
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
Wayne Cashman seems a really strange choice.
2 more non-HHOFers not yet mentioned - Camille Henry and Tim Kerr
2 more non-HHOFers not yet mentioned - Camille Henry and Tim Kerr
Wanted to post this.
Smyth was a really strange player to defend against. He had the worst stick in NHL history. Was completely straight like a paddle. He also had the pain threshold of Jackie Chan, as a zombie, on cortisol.
Any abuse or slashing he would take, and would not budge.
Ryan Smyth scored nothing but the ugliest goals I've ever seen. Including the only garbage goal I've ever seen in a shootout.. where it needed to be reviewed for a several minutes.
frisco
Some people claim that there's a woman to blame...
Craig Simpson. Dave Andreychuk. Patrick Hornqvist. John LeClair. Espo. Charlie Simmer. Tim Kerr. Paul Gardiner. Ulf Dahlen.
My Best-Carey
My Best-Carey
The Panther
Registered User
Craig Simpson. Had near-elite talent (deking, shooting, tipping), but most of his goals were scored within six inches of the goal line. Wasn't a very big guy, and consequently career over at ２５.
The Panther
Registered User
I'm not sure if Franzen would be as successful today. He was right on top of the goaltenders half the time. Pretty strict calls against that now.
Franzen came in that period between the late-９０s' call-everything-back-for-having-a-toe-in-the-blue-paint and today's review-every-play-for-any-vague-hint-of-goalie-interference.
Franzen came in that period between the late-９０s' call-everything-back-for-having-a-toe-in-the-blue-paint and today's review-every-play-for-any-vague-hint-of-goalie-interference.
Yup, thought of Holmstrom and Franzen right away.
charliolemieux
rsTmf
- Apr 1, 2010
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Dave Andreychuk,
Dino Ciccarelli
Dino Ciccarelli
Johnny Engine
Moderator
- Jul 29, 2009
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Is there anyone (I'm looking at you, @Canadiens1958 and @Killion) who'd like to expand upon the evolution of the role? Who'd have been the first guy to regularly spend a lot of time with his back to the goaltender, looking to either get in front of point shots for a tip or screen, or to sag behind the goal line for a short-side tuck-in or a quick reverse pass into the slot? I imagine a few of these names didn't exactly play that way, despite scoring a lot of 6-inch goals, and the role as exists today certainly couldn't have existed before the forward pass.
VanIslander
A 19-year ATDer on HfBoards
In my lifetime...
Mark Messier
Dino Ciccarelli
Dave Andreychuk
a young Brind'amour
Jarome Iginla
Patrick Marleau
Mark Messier
Dino Ciccarelli
Dave Andreychuk
a young Brind'amour
Jarome Iginla
Patrick Marleau
Canadiens1958
Registered User
Net front presence. Anchoring a player in front of the goalie in the low slot like Holmgren or Franzen is quite modern. Started late 1970s progressing to specialists.
Previously it was flow through movement,arc thru,dart in, the high and low slot for deflections,tip-ins, re-directs and rebounds,chase the puck down in the corner,etc. Skate, keeping moving so that the passing and shooting lanes were not constant. Put pressure on the d-men, especially on the PP, creating odd man situations, hard to set a box or diamond.
First Canadiens player to spend time in the low slot was Yvon Lambert.
Previously it was flow through movement,arc thru,dart in, the high and low slot for deflections,tip-ins, re-directs and rebounds,chase the puck down in the corner,etc. Skate, keeping moving so that the passing and shooting lanes were not constant. Put pressure on the d-men, especially on the PP, creating odd man situations, hard to set a box or diamond.
First Canadiens player to spend time in the low slot was Yvon Lambert.
WingsOverAvs
Non Right Winger
Gotta go Holmstrom. He may not have potted as many as some guys, but if you add the number his butt had disallowed as well as the number other players scored because goalies couldnt see, he's tops in my book. Im surprised his spine held up with all the abuse it took over the years. Had a real knack for deflecting pucks too
Chili
En boca cerrada no entran moscas
- Jun 10, 2004
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The guys I remember are just about all mentioned. How many of these guys developped back problems because of all the cross checks to the back they received? (like Craig Simpson)
Espo was the best I saw. Great hands and hard to move. Tim Kerr was similiar but had a short career.
Steve Shutt was great at deflections.
Another name who comes to mind was Joe Mullen. He wasn`t very big but he had the knack of finding pucks in close and burying them
Espo was the best I saw. Great hands and hard to move. Tim Kerr was similiar but had a short career.
Steve Shutt was great at deflections.
Another name who comes to mind was Joe Mullen. He wasn`t very big but he had the knack of finding pucks in close and burying them
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
It's not evident to me, and it sounds like you might well agree...in the pre-offside days (new-age strategies led by Boston, primarily, in 1929), it doesn't appear as if Art Ross stapled someone to the front of the net in the way being described here. They had players above the puck, but I don't get the sense that they had guys just standing at the top of the crease or anything of the sort. And the film that I've watched, doesn't make it evident that tactic was utilized much through the 1950's or 60's either...
Canadiens1958
Registered User
Correct. A player standing still, not moving his feet is very easy to defend.
Ironically you see this often in the modern game that is supposed to be faster.
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
Yeah, that's a good point. I never really liked losing a passing lane and a shooting lane by having a player stand in front unless he was really, really good at it. Personally, I've crafted myself into something of a special teams coach these days - as I feel like there's more that can be done schematically to impact the game there. And I'm not sure I've ever had a guy just standing in front...my low guy (I call him a 'rover' because no one knows what the origin of that term is these days haha) moves around from the corner, to behind, to the front, etc. depending on where the puck is...he's actually the quarterback as my power plays traditionally work from down low, not up high...having that freedom to move adds at least two passing lanes that I would not have ordinarily have had if I had a guy just standing in front.
Plus, modern penalty killing doesn't even address that guy so much any more. A majority of clubs, even as you work your way down the ladder, front pucks now. They don't engage in a Hatcher/Holmstrom type battle like we would see in the 90's...so now you're really short a passing lane in a situation where you have an extra man. Not much of an advantage I say...
Last point selfishly about me...ya know, it's true sometimes what they say: you coach almost the opposite of how you played...you almost live vicariously through yourself so to speak...I don't put a guy in front on the power play, yet I model my entire game (as a slower, RHS player with good hockey sense) after Patric Hornqvist...he's basically my spirit animal haha. Dan Bylsma, a fork and spoon operator in the NHL, coaches a complicated offensive style of play...Randy Carlyle, a defenseless defenseman, is a hardcore line matcher and defensive coach...Patrick Roy, a goalie who even played the puck very poorly, is a heavy-attack minded coach...etc. etc. Just funny how things work sometimes...
Plus, modern penalty killing doesn't even address that guy so much any more. A majority of clubs, even as you work your way down the ladder, front pucks now. They don't engage in a Hatcher/Holmstrom type battle like we would see in the 90's...so now you're really short a passing lane in a situation where you have an extra man. Not much of an advantage I say...
Last point selfishly about me...ya know, it's true sometimes what they say: you coach almost the opposite of how you played...you almost live vicariously through yourself so to speak...I don't put a guy in front on the power play, yet I model my entire game (as a slower, RHS player with good hockey sense) after Patric Hornqvist...he's basically my spirit animal haha. Dan Bylsma, a fork and spoon operator in the NHL, coaches a complicated offensive style of play...Randy Carlyle, a defenseless defenseman, is a hardcore line matcher and defensive coach...Patrick Roy, a goalie who even played the puck very poorly, is a heavy-attack minded coach...etc. etc. Just funny how things work sometimes...
David Bruce Banner
Nude Cabdriver Ban
George Laraque
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Kerr and Simpson leap to mind. Sadly both had injury shortened careers due to the punishment they took from “crease clearing” defencemen like Hatcher(s), Murzyn and Rathje.
jk
Kerr and Simpson leap to mind. Sadly both had injury shortened careers due to the punishment they took from “crease clearing” defencemen like Hatcher(s), Murzyn and Rathje.
Canadiens1958
Registered User
Involve your three forwards in a rotating triangle and watch the results. Front,corner, behind they just replace each other following the movement.
Last twenty years the Canadiens have had some of their better PPs when defensive coaches were around at the top or as assistants. Guys like Jarvis and Carbonneau who knew from first hand experience what was hardest to defend coached on teams with excellent PPs.
Recently Felix Potvin, Magog Midget AAA is doing great teaching, offence, defence and team play.
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
Yeah, we have that triangular look that finishes in the slot just below or around the hashmarks...I had a freshman who can really fire the disc, and I told him after one practice, "I have a power play that I made years ago, but it was made just for you" ...41 goals as a freshman (led the entire conference in goals and points as an 18 year old) and a power play that hummed along at over 35%, I'd say things worked out just fine without a man standing in front of the goalie for a screen...
Good point on guys like Jarvis/Carbonneau...they know what they can't stop. Another example is Stephen Valiquette's work with "royal road" and shot selections...a goalie who was big, but without strong lateral mobility without compromising some aspects to his technique...took it to an analytical level, effectively saying, "this is what I couldn't stop...I wonder who else can't stop these?" Turns out, it's just about everyone at the moment.
Potvin had some strong coaching early on I would think...Pat Burns, Pat Quinn...later in his career I think he would have Dave Tippett as an assistant in LA if my timeline is right...some pretty smart guys that may have left an impression on him...
Good point on guys like Jarvis/Carbonneau...they know what they can't stop. Another example is Stephen Valiquette's work with "royal road" and shot selections...a goalie who was big, but without strong lateral mobility without compromising some aspects to his technique...took it to an analytical level, effectively saying, "this is what I couldn't stop...I wonder who else can't stop these?" Turns out, it's just about everyone at the moment.
Potvin had some strong coaching early on I would think...Pat Burns, Pat Quinn...later in his career I think he would have Dave Tippett as an assistant in LA if my timeline is right...some pretty smart guys that may have left an impression on him...
