Greates passer of all time (minus #99)

[Big Phil]

I think most people will admit that Gretzky is the best passer of all time bar none. But who is second in your opinion? My pick: Adam Oates.

Oates had a career high of 97 assists in a season and also 90 one other year when he played only 61 games. He also was the centre of two players who hit 50/50 (Hull and Neely). That says something. He led the league in assists three times in his career. Even in the twilight of his career you knew Oates would put up 60 assists. But I cant think of anyone who could thread a pass as good as he could. He had some of the sweetest hands of all time. I'll put Oates just barely ahead of Lemieux.

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[Ogopogo*]

If you mean greatest passers by how aesthetically pleasing their passes were, not too sure who #2 would be. But, if you want the greatest playmakers Ogopogo style:

1 Wayne Gretzky
2 Gordie Howe
3 Adam Oates
4 Frank Boucher
5 Mario Lemieux
6 Andy Bathgate
7 Phil Esposito
8 Stan Mikita
9 Bobby Orr
10 Bill Cowley
11 Jean Beliveau
12 Ted Lindsay
Elmer Lach
14 Paul Coffey
15 Jaromir Jagr
16 Marcel Dionne
17 Bryan Trottier
Guy Lafleur
19 Bobby Clarke
20 Cy Denneny
21 Ron Francis
22 Alex Delvecchio
23 Howie Morenz
24 Peter Forsberg
25 Peter Stastny
Art Chapman
27 Max Bentley
Doug Bentley
Joe Sakic
30 Sid Abel

 

[Transported Upstater]

Adam Oates was one of the best pure playmakers ever.

 

[Biggsy]

Yeah Oatsy forsure

 

[Psycho Papa Joe]

If I'm a goalscoring winger and Gretzky isn't available, and with appologies to Oates, I want Mario Lemieux as my center.

 

[Puckclektr]

Oates for sure. Underated passer in Craig Janney.

 

[pappyline]

I think most people will admit that Gretzky is the best passer of all time bar none. But who is second in your opinion? My pick: Adam Oates.

Oates had a career high of 97 assists in a season and also 90 one other year when he played only 61 games. He also was the centre of two players who hit 50/50 (Hull and Neely). That says something. He led the league in assists three times in his career. Even in the twilight of his career you knew Oates would put up 60 assists. But I cant think of anyone who could thread a pass as good as he could. He had some of the sweetest hands of all time. I'll put Oates just barely ahead of Lemieux.

Kinda presumptuous to say Gretzy is the best passer of all time. The guy is not GOD. You could certainly make a good argument for his contemporary-Lemieux. There are old time players such as Bill Cowley & Andy Bathgate who are also up there. Of Gretzy/Lemieux contemporarys Oates is definitely close. Of todays players Joe Thornton is up there, 94 assists at this point.

 

[Murphy]

Hey Ogopogo,

I don't remember Phil Esposito to be much of a set up, playmaker type let alone top 7. I could be wrong as I didn't really see him all that much but I did pay attention to him somewhat as he was my moms favourite player at the time.

We used to bug her about "garbage goal Esposito" and my recollection of him was him in the slot or more times than not right on top of the crease. I don't remember him as much of a passer at all. I could be totally out to lunch on this of course but when I think of Esposito I don't think of playmaker.

 

[Ogopogo*]

Hey Ogopogo,

I don't remember Phil Esposito to be much of a set up, playmaker type let alone top 7. I could be wrong as I didn't really see him all that much but I did pay attention to him somewhat as he was my moms favourite player at the time.

We used to bug her about "garbage goal Esposito" and my recollection of him was him in the slot or more times than not right on top of the crease. I don't remember him as much of a passer at all. I could be totally out to lunch on this of course but when I think of Esposito I don't think of playmaker.

Espo led the league in assists 3 times and finished second 4 times. Purty darn good for a 'garbage goal' scorer.

 

[Ogopogo*]

Kinda presumptuous to say Gretzy is the best passer of all time. The guy is not GOD. You could certainly make a good argument for his contemporary-Lemieux. There are old time players such as Bill Cowley & Andy Bathgate who are also up there. Of Gretzy/Lemieux contemporarys Oates is definitely close. Of todays players Joe Thornton is up there, 94 assists at this point.

I disagree.

You couldn't make a good argument for anyone. Gretzky dominated the assist chart like nobody else in league history and it isn't close.

In fact, on my system, if you add #2 Howe and #3 Oates together, combined they just barely finish ahead of Gretzky. He was that great.

 

[Murphy]

Espo led the league in assists 3 times and finished second 4 times. Purty darn good for a 'garbage goal' scorer.

Top two in assists for 7 years certainly explains it.....

 

[pappyline]

Espo led the league in assists 3 times and finished second 4 times. Purty darn good for a 'garbage goal' scorer.

Maybe,but I know your ratings are based purely on stats and on dominance in certain years. Howevere, we know assists were handed out more freely in certain periods & in certain arenas. I think Boston was a good place to play in the late 60's & early 70's if you wanted to pad your assist totals. I remember Esposito very well. He had the great fortune to play with 2 of the greatest players in NHL history=Bobby Hull & Bobby Orr. I too remember him as a garbage goal guy. Orr carried the puck, Cashman & hodge dug it out of the corners and Esposito scored from the slot. To give him ctrdit he was the greatest garbage goal scorer ever and he took limited talent to high levels.

 

[MojoJojo]

24 Peter Forsberg

Not that there arent some amazing playmakers on the list but

 

[pappyline]

I disagree.

You couldn't make a good argument for anyone. Gretzky dominated the assist chart like nobody else in league history and it isn't close.

In fact, on my system, if you add #2 Howe and #3 Oates together, combined they just barely finish ahead of Gretzky. He was that great.

Again, it is all about career numbers with you. Gretzy was great but the 80's was an aberration and the stats of the decade were abnormally high to what happened before and since.Lets put things in perspective. Average players like Rick Vaive, rick Kehoe, al Secord & Jacques Richard were scoring over 50 goals.average players like Federko, Broten, Anderson, carson, & Bullard were scoring over 100 points. Granted gretzy dominated until Lemieux became a force in the latter part of the decade but the Oilers system was 100% geared to Gretzy. Your ratings would probably make more sense if you devalued all stats from the 80's. It is beyond imagination as to the stats Howe, Orr, & Hull would have put up if the were in their prime in the 80's.

 

[raleh]

Rocket and Hull would have been 100 goal a season scorers in the '80's. Elmer Lach would have had a few seasons of over 110 assists too.

 

[Ogopogo*]

Not that there arent some amazing playmakers on the list but

Injuries...

 

[Ogopogo*]

Again, it is all about career numbers with you. Gretzy was great but the 80's was an aberration and the stats of the decade were abnormally high to what happened before and since.Lets put things in perspective. Average players like Rick Vaive, rick Kehoe, al Secord & Jacques Richard were scoring over 50 goals.average players like Federko, Broten, Anderson, carson, & Bullard were scoring over 100 points. Granted gretzy dominated until Lemieux became a force in the latter part of the decade but the Oilers system was 100% geared to Gretzy. Your ratings would probably make more sense if you devalued all stats from the 80's. It is beyond imagination as to the stats Howe, Orr, & Hull would have put up if the were in their prime in the 80's.

I did devalue all stats from teh 80s. My system evens out all eras and Gretzky still comes out on top. That is how great he was. Sorry but that is the truth.

 

[pappyline]

I did devalue all stats from teh 80s. My system evens out all eras and Gretzky still comes out on top. That is how great he was. Sorry but that is the truth.

No need to be sorry but I do have a problem with your definition of truth. I can only comment on the era that I have seen which covers the mid 50's to the present. If I plop Gretzy into the late 50'-early 60's I see a Mikita type player without the toughness.

You may have a "system" but it is not necessarily the "Truth". A great effort but not the "Truth". Gretzy may have been great but is not necessarily the greatest.

 

[God Bless Canada]

Gretzky is No. 1. I don't care the era, he dominates. Nobody has ever seen or thought the game the way that Gretzky did. That's why he was so dangerous. So many of his goals came from seeing the gaps that nobody else could. Mentally, he's as strong as any player ever.

I'm not a Janney fan, but he's very underrated for his playmaking abilities. One of the reasons that the 1980s/early 1990s were so high scoring was the abundance of great playmaking centres. Janney was considered one of the top five playmakers in the game from about 1990 to 1994. (It helps when you play with the likes of Neely, Hull and Shanahan, but Janney was a wizard.

I think Jean Beliveau has to be considered. Adam Oates is right up there. Some of the other 1980s stars - Hawerchuk, Savard, LaFontaine, Stastny, Francis and of course Lemieux - are right up there. Bobby Clarke won three Hart Trophies partially due to his playmaking wizardry. Stan Mikita was among the all-time leader in assists when he retired.

 

[Ogopogo*]

No need to be sorry but I do have a problem with your definition of truth. I can only comment on the era that I have seen which covers the mid 50's to the present. If I plop Gretzy into the late 50'-early 60's I see a Mikita type player without the toughness.

You may have a "system" but it is not necessarily the "Truth". A great effort but not the "Truth". Gretzy may have been great but is not necessarily the greatest.

Any reasonable method of comparison says that Gretzky is the greatest.

Gretzky led the NHL outright in assists 13 times and he tied for the lead on 3 other occasions. 5 of Gretzky's assist titles were by more than 25%, 2 were by more than 50% and one was by more than 75%. Nobody in any era can boast such dominance of the assist leaderboard. There really is no comparison. Throw out the raw numbers, these percentages cannot be touched by anyone in any era.

 

[Bluesfan1981]

If you mean greatest passers by how aesthetically pleasing their passes were, not too sure who #2 would be. But, if you want the greatest playmakers Ogopogo style:

1 Wayne Gretzky
2 Gordie Howe
3 Adam Oates
4 Frank Boucher
5 Mario Lemieux
6 Andy Bathgate
7 Phil Esposito
8 Stan Mikita
9 Bobby Orr
10 Bill Cowley
11 Jean Beliveau
12 Ted Lindsay
Elmer Lach
14 Paul Coffey
15 Jaromir Jagr
16 Marcel Dionne
17 Bryan Trottier
Guy Lafleur
19 Bobby Clarke
20 Cy Denneny
21 Ron Francis
22 Alex Delvecchio
23 Howie Morenz
24 Peter Forsberg
25 Peter Stastny
Art Chapman
27 Max Bentley
Doug Bentley
Joe Sakic
30 Sid Abel

You left out Joe Primeau and Doug Harvey

 

[Ogopogo*]

You left out Joe Primeau and Doug Harvey

Primeau is #31 and Harvey is #63

 

[Leaf Lander]

add tomas kaberles name to your list in 3 yrs time

 

[God Bless Canada]

Forgot to mention the defencemen. Bobby Orr, of course, would be tops. Only defenceman to have over 100 assists in a season. Guys like Coffey and Bourque, among the 80s defencemen, were fantastic. Lidstrom is brilliant as a playmaking defenceman. Eddie Shore and Doug Harvey were brilliant. Larry Robinson was one of the first defencemen to combine size and high-end offensive skills.

Phil Housley was another great playmaking blue-liner, it's just his legacy is tarnished by his shoddy defensive play. Housley makes Paul Coffey look like Rod Langwy.

 

[KariyaIsGod*]

Kinda presumptuous to say Gretzy is the best passer of all time. The guy is not GOD. You could certainly make a good argument for his contemporary-Lemieux. There are old time players such as Bill Cowley & Andy Bathgate who are also up there. Of Gretzy/Lemieux contemporarys Oates is definitely close. Of todays players Joe Thornton is up there, 94 assists at this point.

No, you can't make a good argument for anyone but Gretzky.

He is the greatest passer of all-time...