Post-Game Talk: Golden Knights 2, Penguins 1 - It's Lit

[UnrealMachine]

- Non-threatening would be the best way to describe the Pens last night.
- Dumoulin contract is looking BAAAAAAD. I never understood why people were pricing him at $4M?!? He's basically a better skating version of (prime?) Scuderi. Some aspects of his game are worse, though.
- Echo everyone's thoughts on the lines making no sense. I like a lot of things that Simon does, but I'm not sure if he is quite good enough of a skater to play with Sid?
- Sid needs to shoot more, period. He's trading too many low pct. shots for even lower pct. passes, that ultimately end up being no shot on goal. Shoot the puck and see what happens (rebounds and garbage goals anyone?).
- The whole is <<< than the sum of the parts. There is still an abundance of talent on the team that is comparable to the best teams in the league. Let's not kid ourselves about that.
- Pens records with Schultz in the lineup is 13-7-2 (not including game when he was injured early). He provides more than his point total this season. Ruh has just been a disappoint overall, and I'm one of his bigger supporters. Flashes of what he brought last season, but it's just not coming together. Hunwick is just kind of there, I guess?

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

The Pens are pretty likely to make the playoffs regardless of their recent struggles. It honestly doesn't matter if we're the 8th seed or 1st seed. These struggles are concerning but unlikely to continue for the next 50+ games.

Maybe losing Cullen was a bigger deal than we thought.

They're falling fast though. People were already a little leery of this team as they are currently composed a week ago, then they lose three straight without even getting any loser points. When you look at how many games at hand other teams have on us, it's enough to make you crap your pants. I don't think this is the team at its best, but I'm getting more and more concerned.

They need to at least grab a center, fill out this roster, and ensure they get in the playoffs. I would still bet they start to gel and squeak into the playoffs even without any moves, but I change my tune a bit after every regulation loss.

 

[Whakahere]

hey at least the Cole goal was nice. No shut out by MAF.

I mostly get the replays of games so that means I often watch a lot of games in a row. Last night I watched live and I have noticed we are getting slower. It's the legs somewhat but mainly it is how long they take to get up the ice. They don't have that killer instinct, they just slow.

 

[ZeroPucksGiven]

- Dumoulin contract is looking BAAAAAAD. I never understood why people were pricing him at $4M?!? He's basically a better skating version of (prime?) Scuderi. Some aspects of his game are worse, though.

Because Dumo was arguable the best defenseman all of last playoffs and played his best hockey last spring/summer? You know who his partner was during that time??

Ron "I can't make a pass to a teammate's stick" Hainsey. I won't argue that Dumo has been good, but there was abundant evidence that Dumo's contract was fair. Furthermore, if you didn't sign him, then who else would you replace him with?

 

[Shady Machine]

Yeah, the Penguins should just keep doing what they've been doing and not change anything. Sure, let's ignore that Hornqvist is gone after the year, doesn't fit at all in the top-6, plays a position of vast depth and probably inconveniences the Penguins due to his inability to play the other wing. Let's just say no to moving a perfectly logical guy to trade because he works hard and is gritty.

While we are are it, let’s trade all the other players that play like they give a shit.

 

[Richard]

Ya I mean we have three tweener 4th line AHL centers and two burnt out superstars. It's not a recipe for success. Crosby looks old this season. Malkin is clearly breaking down.

Sometimes you just hit a wall. These guys may have hit it. I remember when Trots hit 30 he was done being an elite point producer. Might be the same for Sid and Geno. They've played a god-awful amount of hockey.

I'd pencil them in as 70-80 point players from now on. The biggest thing is you're gonna have to reign in how they play. They can't take as many risks and they have to play more simple. They don't have the physical ability to dominate anymore. They have to adapt.

Crosby throwing blind backhand passes a second late all over the ice can't happen. Both Geno and Sid are gonna have to be taughtthe KISS method.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I was trying to keep myself awake so maybe I didn't see this sequence right, but wasn't it Simon who made that slick play to Dumo when he was falling... and Dumo of course Dumoed it.

The marquee sequence for Fleury unfolded about 13 1/2 minutes into the second period. Crosby slid a pass back between his legs to Conor Sheary. Sheary lost a handle on the puck but still somehow nudged it over to Dumoulin.

After waiting probably a beat longer than he would’ve liked, Dumoulin shot only to have Fleury lunging from his left to right, stopping Dumoulin much like he did Nicklas Lidstrom in the 2009 Stanley Cup final.

Rut of one-goal losses continues for Penguins

 

[Shady Machine]

This team is in a rut. Things look dire right now but I do believe a big trade can get things on track. It’s not a magic wand, but it provides fresh perspective and presumably upgrades at positions we clearly need. For those saying the bottom 6 isn’t a problem, you’re wrong and the evidence is clearly there if you want to see it. Depth scoring is one of the major problems and only JR can fix it at this point.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

I was trying to keep myself awake so maybe I didn't see this sequence right, but wasn't it Simon who made that slick play to Dumo when he was falling... and Dumo of course Dumoed it.



Rut of one-goal losses continues for Penguins

I just watched it again and you're right Simon passed it.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I just watched it again and you're right Simon passed it.

Thx UB.

Mackey probably saw a 4 and short guy and assumed it was Sheary.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I'm not as worried as 2 years ago, but right now things need to change
A trade could definitely give boost to the team, but the guys in that room could also play with a little more urgency.
They are very bla out there for too much of the game, need to be more intense
Maybe that's what a guy like Tocchet brought on the bench each night that we're lacking right now

 

[canadianguy77]

If they lose the majority of the rest of their 11 b2b's they have left, the math starts to get real sketchy in regards to their chances at making the playoffs.

 

[BHD]

Why would we trade our hardest working player? we need MORE players like him working hard, not less.

Who else could they trade that would be considered a shakeup?

 

[vodeni]

The fact that the line ith Neal and 57 dominated on forecheck all night long, let that sink in for a second, david fri.... Perron and jame Neal pressed Penguins so hard that they could not get the puck out of our zone !
Sully was right to assume and to state before the season when JR asked him about center position, that giving him Sid and Geno he can handle everything else. He did not know he was getting about 60% of Geno and 65% of Sid, he was getting 25% of what he expected from Rust, Sheary, and Hagelin, thats five of your top 9 forwards. His main fault is that he somehow still believes they will sanap out of it on their own. they won't. He should have before trades try to mix up with some guys from A, get hungry guys in, raise the energy level and see what you get there. Instead he is putting out for 30 games, Kuhn, McKegg, Reaves, etc...without even trying to brig something new. His version of mixung up is breaking whatever line is working (Guentz/Sheary - Sid-Horny; Guentz/Hags-Geno-Kessel; Sheary-Sheahan-Rust)

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

Who else could they trade that would be considered a shakeup?

Sheary. Rust. I'm not opposed to swapping a Dman if another team is in a similar situation. Maybe none of that sounds like a big enough shakeup, but that's not necessarily true and a complete matter of opinion. Trades like that often don't come down to how talented the player being traded is. It could be a guy everyone gets along with or is vocal in the room. Maybe you simply trade Reaves for a speedy scrub just to send the message you're trying to get back to your identity fully.

 

[Gurglesons]

This team is in a rut. Things look dire right now but I do believe a big trade can get things on track. It’s not a magic wand, but it provides fresh perspective and presumably upgrades at positions we clearly need. For those saying the bottom 6 isn’t a problem, you’re wrong and the evidence is clearly there if you want to see it. Depth scoring is one of the major problems and only JR can fix it at this point.

I feel like a boyfriend who has asked his partner if they are cheating on him and they keep saying “no”, but then you find out they are cheating on you.

It doesn’t feel good to be so right..

 

[Extra Texture]

Why would we trade our hardest working player? we need MORE players like him working hard, not less.

Agreed. I would seek to move one of the "untradeables" before I moved 72. I genuinely believe that this guy is integral to the culture of that room.

I get that it sounds crazy, and that he's a UFA and all of it. But he's part of why we have been successful, so unless some team is going to overpay for him, ridiculously, then I would hang onto him at (almost) all costs.

And even if he was traded, I would just throw a deal at him in the summer and hope he isnt too sore about it.

 

[The Old Master]

I can understand wanting to trade horny....he's not doing what he does best, and looks lost at times.....but that also goes for every one else on the roster. we are a team that needs to trade everybody, or the coach...and I don't see that happening.

 

[chethejet]

It isn't that simple for a trade to right the ship. Team is spent. Understandable. they are not super human. But a trade brings some fresh legs and hunger so the question is who goes for who. Sully has no answer since his guys are just not able to find that refresh button. And he has done a poor job of lines and combo hurting more than helping. I happen to be in the camp this year was a tough year and GMJR signed D men as there is no one in the pipeline. I agree with signing Dumo and Schultz. But not OLLi as to early and risky. Letang has his moments good and bad. Nothing new there. But Pens need a quality center to take the work load off Sid and Malkin .

 

[The Old Master]

But Pens need a quality center to take the work load off Sid and Malkin .

I can see this being more and more the case as they get older, they might both end up at wing if we get the right players to take their place. not sure now is that time though.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

We went through similar ruts in 2008-09 and 2015-16 at this exact same time period and we ended up winning the Cup.

The team was "shook up" both times. Both times we fired the coach and added some pieces. I think we need to do something similar (not firing Sully though) and we will be just fine. We need to address our issues though. The core is fine, we just need to make the right moves to surround Sid, Geno, Kessel and Letang better. They all are 30 or 31. They need more help than they used to.

 

[canadianguy77]

I feel like a boyfriend who has asked his partner if they are cheating on him and they keep saying “no”, but then you find out they are cheating on you.

It doesn’t feel good to be so right..

Oh right...you predicted that the top 6 even-strength scoring was going to dry up this season.

Just so you know, Sheahan is producing at a . 31 ppg clip, while your 4 million dollar boy Bonino is more than worth his salary producing at a .35 ppg pace, and only Fartsmell on that team has a worse +/-.

And please stop kidding yourself that only you and a handful of others were the only ones who wanted to keep Matt Cullen around.

 

[ColePens]

I feel like a boyfriend who has asked his partner if they are cheating on him and they keep saying “no”, but then you find out they are cheating on you.

It doesn’t feel good to be so right..

But.. you think Letang is doing just fine and the big issue is the 4th line. So in this situation, you keep asking your partner is he's cheating and refuse to listen to the answer while swearing he's cheating.

For all the chest thumpers out there, I'll call bullshit all day long. We thought this team would be good, not great yet, but good. They are horrible. The #1 issue was bottom 6 prior to Game 1 of the season. The real problems are stars who hit a wall, a star who is really struggling on his way back from a severe injury, and a focus/hunger level that is at an all-time low. I was here all summer and NOBODY said that. Hell if one thing Sully has shown in his 1.5 seasons is the team is able to stay on task and get the job done.

Matt Cullen wouldn't have saved the start of this season. Bones wouldn't have saved the start of the season. Duchene wouldn't have saved the start of this season. This isn't NHL 2018 where players are rated and they play at that level. The Pens hit a mental and physical wall and quite honestly, I understand it. Throw in some bad luck, which they deserve, and it makes life difficult. Throw in a pretty bad bottom 6 and it makes the matter even worse. Throw in that all of our potential great trade partners are buyers and not sellers, and it makes life really difficult for JR.

At the end of the day, everything that is happening this season is at least understandable. Disappointing, but understandable.

 

[WayneSid9987]

I'm not as worried as 2 years ago, but right now things need to change
A trade could definitely give boost to the team, but the guys in that room could also play with a little more urgency.
They are very bla out there for too much of the game, need to be more intense
Maybe that's what a guy like Tocchet brought on the bench each night that we're lacking right now

I've been thinking more about what Recchi is bringing to the table. It's his first spin behind the bench too, i believe. I'd get a more experienced hand there. Let Sully pick em. Don't care. Let Recchi go learn the ropes in Wilkes or somethin'. Other than trades/inserting more youth, thats something that deffo should be considered.

I'm with you as not being as worried as 2 years ago. I actually see a path to a much better lineup/roster where as JR pulled rabbits out of hats 2 years ago. Scuderi for Daley...LOL

 

[Beauner]

I just want to say, I was disgusted with the amount of people I knew actively cheering for the Knights last night. So many people who I thought were Pens fans wanted to see them lose. Like...what in the actual f***? I cheer for the logo on the front, regardless of who is wearing it. It made absolutely no sense to me.