Confirmed with Link: Francis out as GM - Don Waddell named GM 5/8/18

geehaad

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Aug 24, 2006
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The varying degree to which Dundon will be hands-on is not something we'll be able to nail down, so there's not a lot to gain from that discussion.

What we have solved is the mystery as to why some of us were concerned about him being too hands-on as news of Francis' demotion unfolded. My fears have been mitigated, but they were pretty well-founded at the outset of this change.
 

tarheelhockey

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I haven't seen only that as part of the discussion as there have been all sorts of shades of grey in this thread (and others). From "just wants to put a process in place" to "wants a figurehead GM" and a bunch in between. All of that has people talking because it's a change, it's different and we don't have enough history with him to really know what's going to happen. At the end of the day, he's going to be much more involved, even in hockey decisions, and there's no question that as he wants things done his way. He bought the team and they haven't been successful, so that's his right. Like I said, not necessarily a bad thing, just different and thus prompts discussion.

To me, the "figure head GM" came more from other stuff he's said than the Shannon tweet. He's come out and said pretty clearly that he wants to put a process in place where the "red/green" type decisions are automatic and that the process will survive even when people are changed. Call it what you want, but to me, that means that he's putting a process in place that takes some of the power away from what was traditionally a GM role. Doesn't mean a GM will be powerless and the GM still needs to make the "yellow" calls, but I think that's where a lot of the talk on "Figure head GM" is coming from.

I completely agree... I just see a lot of distance between “owner who puts processes into place which supersede the GM” and “owner who personally makes hockey decisions over the head of his figurehead GM”, which is what Shannon’s tweet strongly implied and which is what half the main board seemed to think was Dundon’s intention.
 
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I am pretty sure that I somewhere read that Dundon will interview as many guys as possible, because he is searching for that right connection between him and new GM. So he will talk to many guys, don't take every name very seriously, as that's just a part of process IMO.
 

My Special Purpose

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I am pretty sure that I somewhere read that Dundon will interview as many guys as possible, because he is searching for that right connection between him and new GM. So he will talk to many guys, don't take every name very seriously, as that's just a part of process IMO.


I also think we need to keep in mind that we're not alone in the driver's seat for this hire. The candidates have a lot of leverage and will be interviewing Dundon just as much as we're interviewing them. Those AGMs have waited very patiently in most cases -- extremely patiently in Paul Fenton's case -- and they're not going to waste what is likely their one and only shot to get this right if the situation doesn't work for them.

Then keep in mind that Seattle is going to need a GM once they get approved as a franchise. Then also keep in mind that there may be Original Six job openings in Montreal and Detroit shortly, as well as potential openings in hockey hotbeds like Edmonton and even Minnesota (if they fail to get past the first round again).

I have no problem with the Canes letting go of Francis as soon as they realized it wasn't going to work, but I wouldn't be surprised to see hiring his replacement drag on a bit into the off-season, while the GM merry-go-round sorts itself out a bit.
 

NotOpie

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I have no problem with the Canes letting go of Francis as soon as they realized it wasn't going to work, but I wouldn't be surprised to see hiring his replacement drag on a bit into the off-season, while the GM merry-go-round sorts itself out a bit.

I, for one, would be very surprised to see the search go on well into the off season. My suspicion is Dundon has an idea as to what the ideal candidate is like. I also think that he's getting significant advice from various hockey minds....he's said as much in other ways he's commented on running the business.
 

My Special Purpose

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I, for one, would be very surprised to see the search go on well into the off season. My suspicion is Dundon has an idea as to what the ideal candidate is like. I also think that he's getting significant advice from various hockey minds....he's said as much in other ways he's commented on running the business.

And again, my point is that it's not all about Dundon. If Paul Fenton thinks he's going to be the Nashville GM within two years, he's not taking our job. If BriseBois thinks he's got a shot at the Canadiens job, he's not taking ours. If McCrimmon thinks he's the odds-on favorite for the Seattle job, he's not taking our job.

It has nothing to do with Dundon being aggressive and impatient or having an idea what he wants. It has to do with the guy we want also wanting us, despite other jobs coming open and our job no longer being the "typical" GM job. If it's really more like a CEO, allowing managers to handle their areas, these AGMs may not be tripping over themselves to take our job.
 

NotOpie

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And again, my point is that it's not all about Dundon. If Paul Fenton thinks he's going to be the Nashville GM within two years, he's not taking our job. If BriseBois thinks he's got a shot at the Canadiens job, he's not taking ours. If McCrimmon thinks he's the odds-on favorite for the Seattle job, he's not taking our job.

It has nothing to do with Dundon being aggressive and impatient or having an idea what he wants. It has to do with the guy we want also wanting us, despite other jobs coming open and our job no longer being the "typical" GM job. If it's really more like a CEO, allowing managers to handle their areas, these AGMs may not be tripping over themselves to take our job.
In the end, the job is pretty attractive given the base of players (we'll have to disagree on overall talent level of the team and especially the prospect pool). At some point, the necessity of getting somebody in the position well in advance of the draft and the opening of free agency will take over. While the draft might not be as significant for the upcoming GM, it will still be his responsibility to make sure it is executed according to plan. My guess, especially after tonights shit show, a coaching search will also be under way. The time required for all of this isn't insignificant. With all those factors, 2nd best or 3rd best options end up being taken.

All that being said, I believe this is an attractive opportunity with a new owner who wants to win and wants to spend to do so. This is a great chance for an aggressive "up and comer" to make his mark. That doesn't exist in all of the places you named...
 

GoldiFox

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This has a Kay Yow coaching search written all over it. Which washed up GM that is friends with TD will come in after a lengthy search wearing lipstick?

I see it as the opposite. Dundon just ousted the guy who got the job presumably/largely through nepotism. Dundon seems more than capable of weeding through the potential candidates and selecting the best one. His approach to the Canes has been almost purely industrial rather than emotional, what indication has he given for us to assume the search will be anything other than "Let's find the right guy for the job"?

There are two AGM's currently in place so simply move Olczyk up to interim GM status. He's earned it.

I'd say Velucci is even more qualified. He'd be a decent GM candidate if he weren't already internal (they should go outside).
 

StormCast

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I see it as the opposite. Dundon just ousted the guy who got the job presumably/largely through nepotism. Dundon seems more than capable of weeding through the potential candidates and selecting the best one. His approach to the Canes has been almost purely industrial rather than emotional, what indication has he given for us to assume the search will be anything other than "Let's find the right guy for the job"?



I'd say Velucci is even more qualified. He'd be a decent GM candidate if he weren't already internal (they should go outside).
On paper yes, but Velucci, has a role as Checkers coach and Olczyk is already in the Carolina front office. He'd be fine as an interim GM because you need continuity.
 

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