Fedor Tjutin (Tyutin)..

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KM

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schneider's only questionable to the extent that he's been inconsistent over his career. in detroit this year he is playing at a very high level and has shed the "only offense" label long ago.
 

Dr_Chimera*

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I like Tyutin a lot. He can foreseeably do everything as a pro, but needs to put all the pieces together.

He moves so well and handles himself effectively in traffic. Just wait until his offensive game catches up to his defensive abilities.

It's very easy to discount a prospect without explaining one's reasons, like some people are doing. When your defense is that 'thn has him high so they must be wrong', they doesn't say much.
 

Charge_Seven

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vik said:
What's his potential as an NHL'er?? Do you see him as a top 2/4 d-man, that can play the powerplay. Is he a defensive d-man, all-round contributor?? What's his offensive potential?? Thanks is advance..

He played in Guelph, my hometown. He's an excellent player, great shot, and will be a solid guy IF the Rangers trade him. If they don't, he's done.
 

Bobby Orr's Knees

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Wingboy2999 said:
He played saturday against the Flyers. From the few times of me watching him, he was just bad. He coughed up the puck a couple times, could barely get it out of his zone. Just not good.
Tjutin had been out with a knee injury. This was his first game back, plus his NHL debut. Not a game you should look at and make any kind of judgement about the kid's ability.
 

BLACKBURN

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Dr_Chimera said:
When your defense is that 'thn has him high so they must be wrong', they doesn't say much.

My point was that as a person who has not seen him play I would value the report of respectable magazine with writers taht have seen him play rather than a poster who probably has never seen him. Theres no right or wrong, just in my opinion I would trust THN's opinion over a lot of posters on this board.
 

Evilo

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Dr_Chimera said:
I like Tyutin a lot. He can foreseeably do everything as a pro, but needs to put all the pieces together.

He moves so well and handles himself effectively in traffic. Just wait until his offensive game catches up to his defensive abilities.

It's very easy to discount a prospect without explaining one's reasons, like some people are doing. When your defense is that 'thn has him high so they must be wrong', they doesn't say much.

Actually, I explained it.
I think Tyutin has no better than #3 Dman upside, which IMO isn't worth a top 20 prospect rank.
In a top 20, I don't expect to see backups or second line forwards. Same with Dmen. And I think he's overrated when he's ranked that high.
A lot of Dman prospects out there have better upside.
I never said he was a bad prospect or anything as ridiculous.
I simply said I felt he was overrated based on his rankings.
 

dedalus

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Evilo said:
Actually, I explained it.
I think Tyutin has no better than #3 Dman upside, which IMO isn't worth a top 20 prospect rank.

Actually you've explained nothing; you've merely made a statement over and over again. Going over all your posts you've never actually stated WHY you believe him over rated. If you wonder why people are quick to dismiss your view as nothing more than Ranger bashing, you need to offer something more than a simple opinion. You've not talked about his play nor his decision making nor his skill set. For starters, how many times have you seen him play? And what did you see that disagrees with the ratings of 15 NHL executives and presumably the scouting staffs to whom they speak every day? You may like to trash THN, but their ratings aren't plucked from thin air. They are compiled by talking to guys who scout, draft, and run teams for a living.
 

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dedalus said:
Actually you've explained nothing; you've merely made a statement over and over again. Going over all your posts you've never actually stated WHY you believe him over rated. If you wonder why people are quick to dismiss your view as nothing more than Ranger bashing, you need to offer something more than a simple opinion. You've not talked about his play nor his decision making nor his skill set. For starters, how many times have you seen him play? And what did you see that disagrees with the ratings of 15 NHL executives and presumably the scouting staffs to whom they speak every day? You may like to trash THN, but their ratings aren't plucked from thin air. They are compiled by talking to guys who scout, draft, and run teams for a living.

Couldnt agree more....
 

Evilo

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dedalus said:
Actually you've explained nothing; you've merely made a statement over and over again. Going over all your posts you've never actually stated WHY you believe him over rated. If you wonder why people are quick to dismiss your view as nothing more than Ranger bashing, you need to offer something more than a simple opinion. You've not talked about his play nor his decision making nor his skill set. For starters, how many times have you seen him play? And what did you see that disagrees with the ratings of 15 NHL executives and presumably the scouting staffs to whom they speak every day? You may like to trash THN, but their ratings aren't plucked from thin air. They are compiled by talking to guys who scout, draft, and run teams for a living.

I've stated that IMO, his upside is no better than #3 Dman.
I've stated that numerous times.
He's not that solid in his own zone. He's a solid player with no major weakness, but he doesn't have a big strengh that IMO would warrant being touted as a possible #1-2 Dman.
 

iamcaper

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I've noticed a few people dismiss Tyutin as a decent prospect based on his first game. I, in my opinion, think this is the first mistake of somebody who is too quick to judge. As mentioned in an earlier post, Tyutin is coming off of an injury and this was his first game of the year on an offensive minded team. You have to give the guy a little bit of slack. There have been so many prospects who have played their first games and maybe put up a point or two in that game but how many of them actually turned into an offensive force? Tyutin, as with all players in their first season, will have ups and downs. What he learns from his mistakes will help determine just how good an NHL defenseman he will be. It may take some time but I'm pretty confident he has the tools to be an impact defenseman in this league. I think he would make a bigger impact on any other team than he would with the Rags though. No offense to Rags fans.
 

Hokej

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And can you belive that he is considered better player than Filip Novak, I have seen both of them play and I can tell you that Filip is going to be one of the better offensive defenseman in years to come.
stats:
Filip Novak 2002-2003 10-17-27 with 79 PIM in 57 games
Fedor Tyutin 2003-2004 3- 9-12 with 44 PIM in 38 games

I know Fedor still has lots of games to play this season so it's not too accurate but you can get the picture :rolly:
Im glad he got traded to Florida, that way he gets better chance to make it, even though I heard that he was one of the Sathers favorit players.
The only think that could stop him from making it to the nhl is his ankle injury but I belive that wont be a problem.

And for some reason I think Fedor is going to get good chance in NY, I dont want to be missunderstood I know Fedor is going to be NHLer but not as good as everybody think he's going to be.
 

Dr_Chimera*

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Evilo said:
Actually, I explained it.
I think Tyutin has no better than #3 Dman upside, which IMO isn't worth a top 20 prospect rank.
In a top 20, I don't expect to see backups or second line forwards. Same with Dmen. And I think he's overrated when he's ranked that high.
A lot of Dman prospects out there have better upside.
I never said he was a bad prospect or anything as ridiculous.
I simply said I felt he was overrated based on his rankings.

That's not an explanation.

You see, when a person has seen a prospect closely and consistently, it's easy to tell, because they can tell you something about him that most posters can't.

It's an easy way to tell whether the poster knows his stuff or is simply throwing out bold statements.
 

Mizral

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I quite like Tyutin. Scouting reports I've heard of him lately is that his offensive skills may have been a bit overrated, but he's a force in his own zone, and with his size & speed certainly has top 4 defenseman upside.

I have him in the late teens on my prospect listing (though I haven't updated it lately).
 

Evilo

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Dr_Chimera said:
That's not an explanation.

You see, when a person has seen a prospect closely and consistently, it's easy to tell, because they can tell you something about him that most posters can't.

It's an easy way to tell whether the poster knows his stuff or is simply throwing out bold statements.

What am I supposed to say to please you?
That he has a major weakness? I don't see any.
I don't see a big strengh either that would warrant him being ranked in a top 20 prospect.
 

The Jerk*

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I think Evillo is simply saying that he does not have any major weakness, but is not dominant is any one part of his game either. And by Evillo's standards to be rated as a top prospect you should excel very well in one part of your game, if it be offensively, defensively, physical play..whatever. It's a difference in criteria of ranking as much as it is a difference in opinion over Fedor...
 

iamcaper

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Hokej said:
And can you belive that he is considered better player than Filip Novak, I have seen both of them play and I can tell you that Filip is going to be one of the better offensive defenseman in years to come.
stats:
Filip Novak 2002-2003 10-17-27 with 79 PIM in 57 games
Fedor Tyutin 2003-2004 3- 9-12 with 44 PIM in 38 games

I know Fedor still has lots of games to play this season so it's not too accurate but you can get the picture :rolly:
Im glad he got traded to Florida, that way he gets better chance to make it, even though I heard that he was one of the Sathers favorit players.
The only think that could stop him from making it to the nhl is his ankle injury but I belive that wont be a problem.

And for some reason I think Fedor is going to get good chance in NY, I dont want to be missunderstood I know Fedor is going to be NHLer but not as good as everybody think he's going to be.

I hate to nit-pick here but using stats isn't really a good gauge of comparing prospects, even if they are in the same league. So many variables have to come in to play, i.e. teammates, role, injuries, and age. The perfect example of this is Guy Carbonneau. Guy was a guy who put up amazing stats as a Junior player (72 goals and 182 points in 72 games with Chicoutimi) but even though he had decent numbers in the NHL he was, in my opinion, one of the best defensive forwards and leaders that has worn a Habs jersey in quite some time.

On the flip side is a guy like John Ogrodnick who was talented in junior but didn't put up numbers like Guy. But he averaged almost a point per game in his NHL career.
 

dedalus

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Incredible! You quote my post but you seem not to have read a single word of it given that you've not addressed a single point in your reply.


Evilo said:
I've stated that IMO, his upside is no better than #3 Dman.

Exactly. That's a statement not an argument.


Evilo said:
He's not that solid in his own zone.

I refer you to the questions in my post, both of which you seem to be dodging. How many times have you seen him play that allows you to make this statement? What specifically have you seen on those occasions? (Lack of quickness in his skating? Poor decision making? Indecisiveness? Physical weakness? Lack of effort? Inaccurate clearing passes? An unwillingness to go to the corners or clear the front of the net? Mediocre agility? Problems with hand/eye coordination?)


Evilo said:
He's a solid player with no major weakness, but he doesn't have a big strengh that IMO would warrant being touted as a possible #1-2 Dman.

Yes. More statements. I'll give you still another example. In your third post of this thread you compare Tyutin to Whitney and Welch. You say they are better prospects. Clearly you must have seen all three play in order to come to this conclusion, otherwise you're merely:
1. Parroting what you've read in some reports
2. Talking out of your ass.

So in addition to telling me what you've observed when you've watched Tyutin play, can you also please scout Whitney and Welch for me? And please be specific. Don't give me, "They're skilled. More so than Tyutin."
 

Evilo

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Seems to me you have serious comprehension problems.

BTW, let me first start by answering something you wrote earlier : I've never ever made a ranger bashing post. You can do a search, anything you want, you won't find one single post like this. In fact I'm more of a Rangers backer, and used to post on a Ranger forum.
I can't believe the paranoia. I simply state that a prospect is IMO overrated because he doesn't belong in the top 20, and I'm getting a rep as a Rangers basher. :shakehead

So to answer your question, I'm getting the info from guys I trust and I also caught a couple of tapes of Tyutin to form my own opinion. I found him solid but unspectular.
Again, you talk about a specific problem he has and that I should point to, but I seriously didn't see any glaring hole in his game. I didn't see him being more than above average in one specific area either.
Comparison with Whitney and Welch : Whitney is much more of a force in the offensive zone, and is under average in the defensive zone, mainly because he doesn't use his size enough, and his decision making results in turnovers. IMO, these two weaknesses can get better and thus, with his offensive ability, Whitney is IMO a better prospect than Tyutin.
As for Welch, he's rock solid in his own zone with excellent hitting ability, and has excellent offensive upside. His defense is IMO better than Tyutin, and his offense is just as good.
So as VIK pointed, Tyutin is IMO a solid guy with #3 Dman upside, but his play doesn't warrant being ranked in the top 20.
 

BLACKBURN

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Evilo said:
Seems to me you have serious comprehension problems.

BTW, let me first start by answering something you wrote earlier : I've never ever made a ranger bashing post. You can do a search, anything you want, you won't find one single post like this. In fact I'm more of a Rangers backer, and used to post on a Ranger forum.
I can't believe the paranoia. I simply state that a prospect is IMO overrated because he doesn't belong in the top 20, and I'm getting a rep as a Rangers basher. :shakehead

So to answer your question, I'm getting the info from guys I trust and I also caught a couple of tapes of Tyutin to form my own opinion. I found him solid but unspectular.
Again, you talk about a specific problem he has and that I should point to, but I seriously didn't see any glaring hole in his game. I didn't see him being more than above average in one specific area either.
Comparison with Whitney and Welch : Whitney is much more of a force in the offensive zone, and is under average in the defensive zone, mainly because he doesn't use his size enough, and his decision making results in turnovers. IMO, these two weaknesses can get better and thus, with his offensive ability, Whitney is IMO a better prospect than Tyutin.
As for Welch, he's rock solid in his own zone with excellent hitting ability, and has excellent offensive upside. His defense is IMO better than Tyutin, and his offense is just as good.
So as VIK pointed, Tyutin is IMO a solid guy with #3 Dman upside, but his play doesn't warrant being ranked in the top 20.

Welch and Whitney = Penguin prospects. You are a Penguin fan and are overating your prospects. I think its funny the way you say Welch has "excellent hitting ability" But then other reports ive read say things like "One of Welch’s few weaknesses is in his physical game and his use of his large frame." As ive mentioned before I think that your analysis has very little credibility and so I really do not value your opinion whatsoever. Im not saying Fedor is going to be great but I am saying he isnt overrated.
 

Evilo

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I'm taking these two examples but I could give you many. There are plenty of Dman prospects I would take before Tyutin.
And saying Welch isn't a good hitter is laughable. Maybe you are confused with Whitney, who seems to not use his size enough? Because Welch surely does. Or maybe, just maybe, you went to Welch's profile on HF's site, which is not good, just like the whole Pens section (ask ANY Pens fan about it).
Here are a few guys I would rate more or less as good or better as Tyutin : Coburn, Stuart, Phaneuf, Babchuk, Seabrook, Ballard, Daley, Woywitka, Krajicek, Novak, Gebreshkov, Suter, Hainsey, Komisarek (though he may not be considered a prospect), Colaiacovo, Koltsov and Eminger. 17 guys are around his level or better.
I don't think Tyutin is much better than any of these guys, and in some cases I would rate him lower. Not that there is anything wrong with that, as it is the cream of the Dmen prospects, but that stresses my point that when Tyutin gets rated as a top 20 prospect and top 5 Dman prospect, then he's overrated. He's a sure fire top 50 prospect, NOT a top 20.
Of course that's my opnion, and I'm sorry it is not to your liking.
 

Evilo

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Oh BTW, I find it funny that you say I overrate Welch and Whitney because I'm a Pens fan...
Aren't all your posts in this thread defending a Ranger prospect? And guess what? You're a Ranger fan!!!!!
 

BLACKBURN

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Evilo said:
(ask ANY Pens fan about it).

Thats my point.

Evilo said:
Aren't all your posts in this thread defending a Ranger prospect? And guess what? You're a Ranger fan!!!!!

Yes I am a ranger fan but the point I was defending is that he is not overrated.

Evilo said:
Coburn, Stuart, Phaneuf, Babchuk, Seabrook, Ballard, Daley, Woywitka, Krajicek, Novak, Gebreshkov, Suter, Hainsey, Komisarek (though he may not be considered a prospect), Colaiacovo, Koltsov and Eminger.!!!!!


Im not denying that SOME of those defenceman are betteer/considerably better. I am merely saying that he isnt overrated, I feel that i have mentioned this point several times. You dont like him and feel he is overrated, having based your opinion on a couple of games. I feel he is a descent prospect who isnt overrated and is better then a lot of prospects. I really am bored of the topic and feel I have wasted too much time already on it.
 
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