Fan 590's Howard Berger: Contentious debate about draft

Discussion in 'The Business of Hockey' started by ColoradoHockeyFan, Apr 8, 2005.

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  1. ColoradoHockeyFan

    ColoradoHockeyFan Registered User

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    On the Fan 590 just now, Howard Berger reported that the GMs had just wrapped up a meeting at about 2pm EST, and that the debate over how to conduct the draft was both "lively" and "contentious." He said this was highlighted by John Ferguson declaring outright that he firmly believes that the Leafs and other top teams deserve a fully equal chance at drafting Crosby. There is clearly a big-time debate going on between those wanting a draft with equal chance for all and those wanting it significantly weighted. Not shocking, I know, but still interesting to hear about.

    He also said that Daly confirmed that there was in fact finally some "common ground" reached after Monday's meetings and that rumors of progress and positive vibes from that meeting were well-founded.
     
  2. The thought all 30 teams should have a shot at the top picks is ridiculous to start with, much less equal chances. Imagine if Philly Detroit and Toronto got the first 3 picks. That would destroy alot of good faith with all the fans of the bad teams. No team that even made the playoffs 2004 should even have a chance at the top picks.
     
  3. CalgaryThrasher

    CalgaryThrasher Registered User

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    They've got to weigh the lottery based on the past 3 seasons success.
     
  4. Slats432

    Slats432 Registered User

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    In my humble opinon, as a small market team that hasn't really ever had much advantage financially, I agree with JFJ that every team should at least have a "shot" at number one.

    Firstly, you have to try to assimilate what kind of standings you would have had. I think the best way would be to probably average the last 5 years points and assign lottery balls. Draw draft position for the first round based on the balls. Do a snake draft for the 2nd and third rounds, then go by the points orders for the final 6.
     
  5. mooseOAK*

    mooseOAK* Guest

    The teams that made the playoffs in 2004 don't exist as they did back then any more. Who is to say which team is a "top team" any more?

    On the other side, why should the bottom dwellers receive special treatment because they sucked two seasons ago?

    With a hard cap the richer teams aren't going to be able to buy their way back to the top, either.
     
  6. Atlas

    Atlas Registered User

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    They should not have a draft without a season to base the order on. But they probably will. Gretzky, the greatest player in NHL history was not drafted into the NHL What a joke that is. If Crosby is anything close to what he is reported to be then it'll be a real shame if he doesn't go to a bottom-feeder.
     
  7. Wondercarrot

    Wondercarrot Le Doormat

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    Why? You don't know how team would have finished this year. Many teams will likely have to dump some players to get under the Cap.
    It also works as a bribe to get some of the big money teams to agree to other more important issues.

    Equal weighted lottery, now THAT would be exciting, and after Ottawa drafts Crosby you can all lineup for your a$$-kickings for the next 10 years.
     
  8. Munchausen

    Munchausen Guest

    I could see an argument for giving a shot to all 30 teams, although it isn't my prefered scenario, but I have a hard time understanding why the Leafs' and the Penguins' of this league should have an equal chance at the #1 pick. If we go for the legit shot for all 30 teams option, it should be heavily weighted in favor of bottom teams.

    But in all honesty, I don't think all 30 teams should have a shot. The best way IMO would be to determine a ranking based on an average for the last 4 years for each team. Then maybe have a lottery for the 5 first picks among the top-10 or top-15 teams in the rankings.

    Again, I don't see any argument that could justify the Leafs or Red Wings to have a shot at Crosby. It's non-sense. The draft is a mean to create a cycle and make sure the bottom teams can rise to the top eventually. So unless they decide in the new CBA that ALL subsequent drafts are a 30 teams lottery weighted system based on rankings (which might be a way to make sure there's no encentive to tank a season), I don't see why it should be that way for this draft, other than JFJ drooling all over the idea of picking Crosby.
     
    Last edited by moderator : Apr 8, 2005
  9. futurcorerock

    futurcorerock Registered User

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    Every team should have a chance at the top pick is fine...

    but,

    Let's do a big lottery machine where teams like Columbus get 1,985 balls.. and those lowly Toronto Leafs get one single solitary ball.

    Then i'd be happy.

    But if you want to see the NHL cheat fans even more, they'll deny the Washingtons, Pittsburghs, and Carolinas the opportunity to pick up good prospects in favor of whiny Leafs and Habs fans who cry foul at the lack of a season.
     
  10. Brodeur

    Brodeur Registered User

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    JFJ has bigger brass ones than I do.
     
  11. ColoradoHockeyFan

    ColoradoHockeyFan Registered User

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    Hey, let's not ignore this part of what Berger reported! :)

     

  12. Yep itll make the NHL look even more of a joke if Crosby ends up with a good team.

    Does anyone here actually think that Washington, Pittsburgh, Chicago will be better then Detroit, the AVs, Flyers or Leafs? Only a fool would think so.
     

  13. Right now the NHL REALLY REALLY REALLY needs respectability coming out of this mess of a year.

    Letting the easily recognisable best teams having a shot at " The next Gretzky" is absolutely not the way to do it. Just imagine how the mainstream national US media will react to that one? They will laugh and bash the NHL even more then they already do.

    Does the NHL need USA Sports Media talking heads trashing the sport even more? Yeah lets scare off any potential fans some by hearing things like " Fixed lottery" or "Absurd Lottery"
     
  14. mooseOAK*

    mooseOAK* Guest

    Washington and Pittsburgh made conscious efforts to get rid of their best players and get worse. Why should they be rewarded for that two drafts in a row?
     
  15. WRONG.
    They made efforts to not go belly up financially!

    Dont make me hit you with my stick.
     
  16. shakes

    shakes Pep City

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    This is rich...lol. When did the Leafs all of a sudden become so good? Posts on this board suggest that the Leafs have a team of overpaid, past their prime chumps. Weren't all these old players supposed to end up hurt all year and the Leafs would do nothing? Saying that as a joke, but who is to say that wouldnt have happened? JFJ is right, everyone should have an equal shot, not just the teams who sucked two years ago.
     
  17. Gags1288

    Gags1288 Registered User

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    You must consider the teams that these clubs would've iced this season under a salary cap of say 38 million dollars and a floor of say 25 million. The bottom feeders would've been forced to put more money into their teams and those top teams would've been forced to dump some of their high salary players. The bad teams have been rewarded for their poor play. Washington got Ovechkin, Pittsburgh got Malkin and Chicago got Barker. These teams are very young and getting better, who's to say where each team would have finished. Why not just snake the whole draft and have the 1st rounders picked randomly? If you pick 1st, your next pick is number 60, then 61 and then 120 and so on.
     
  18. Less than 300 players are under contract for next season. Every team deserves an equal shot at the top pick. EVERY TEAM missed the playoffs in 2005!
     
  19. speeds

    speeds Registered User

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    true, but can you seriously say that WSH looks to be as good as PHI for next season, or would have been as good as PHI if they had played last season?

    No we can't perfectly forecast how the teams would have performed last year, does that mean we shouldn't bother at all?
     
  20. mooseOAK*

    mooseOAK* Guest

    So what? Point still stands.

    Charity to those teams for me ends with the salary cap.
     
  21. Terrier

    Terrier Registered User

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    Kevin Dupont of the Boston Globe(a.k.a. "hubofhockey") has proposed a draft order based on team's records over the last four seasons.

    http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=132915
     
  22. Coins

    Coins Registered User

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    They should give the top three picks to the three teams with the worst attendance. Give those fans someone to want to go see and watch the NHL prosper all around.

    BTW, im from St. Louis so Im not saying that to wish my team would get Crosby. I just want to see the entire NHL flourish like it did in the 90s.
     
  23. Jester

    Jester Registered User

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    erm... yeah. washington isn't going belly up financially unless AOL crashes completely... which isn't going to happen. they had more than enough money behind them to ride it out, they traded off their talent because it wasn't working and they wanted to rebuild.

    draft thoughts being part of that i'm sure.
     
  24. Slats432

    Slats432 Registered User

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    You can't be serious. Teams slowly rebuild, but since we are on HF, each great prospect is a sure turnaround for an organization. Let's see, if the lockout happened a few years ago, you would say...oh..well, they got Kovalchuk.(no need to have Heatley or Lehtonen on that team.)

    Like I said, no reason to go by last year's standings, but it should be a weighted lottery of some sort.
     
  25. Stephen

    Stephen Registered User

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    In the new world order, Toronto, Detroit and Philly will no longer be big spending teams. They will be forced to get under the cap like all other teams, so why would they deserve Crosby any less than Los Angeles or Minnesota or Buffalo?
     
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