Fan 590 Reports NHLPA on Conference Call

[Chayos]

Please explain who will force the oilers or any other team to spend $45 Million.

Before they were competing against teams spending $78 million, and they only spent $30 Million.

So now, with competitors spending much less money, they're suddenly going to go out and spend wildly???

It makes no sense, Chayos.

There is still arbitration and that gives leverage to teh players. The oilers will not be able to spend $45 million but the kind of team tehy get for 25 million will not be all that competive.

Let me ask you how having a $45 million dollar cap does anything at all for small market teams. Teh only winner here is the big market teams like Tor, dall and det as they can field the best roster for a savings of 3o million dollars. The oil and other small market teams will still get all there best players taken from tehm and still not be profitable. under the players offer they wouldn't even be able to try a rebuilding period because of the salary floor and with the escalators would be looking at a possible floor nearing 36 million by the end of the deal.

How is that anything but suicidal for small market teams? The offer of $42.5 was listed as final and if the players want more than that let them rot and try and make teh best of it at $35 million next september or $25 million in January. As brian Burke keep saying what is there end game scenario here?

The PA must not have financial forcasters on the payroll because they have to see that they CAN'T EVER get a better deal than this one.

 

[OntCanuck]

I've been an owner guy from day one but this is like newsguyone said it's all about greed at this stage. The league is trying to get as much as it can at this point. A 45 million cap is going to stop the high spending teams from doing just that. There are teams that make as much money but don't spend it all. So a team can't pick up a second line player and pay him second line money to sit on the third or fourth line. It also hinders the agents ability to get teams to bid agaisnt themselves. An agent can no longer say that Toronto or such is offering more money if they have no cap room.

 

[PecaFan]

Nice lecture.

Now explain to me why the NHL will play for $42.5M.

But not $45M.

Again, you're presenting the false dichotomy of $42.5 vs $45.

That's *NOT* the issue. It's the other stuff that comes with those offers. The PA is not saying "Ok, we like your offer, but change the $42.5 to $45 and we have a deal".

 

[Chayos]

I've been an owner guy from day one but this is like newsguyone said it's all about greed at this stage. The league is trying to get as much as it can at this point. A 45 million cap is going to stop the high spending teams from doing just that. There are teams that make as much money but don't spend it all. So a team can't pick up a second line player and pay him second line money to sit on the third or fourth line. It also hinders the agents ability to get teams to bid agaisnt themselves. An agent can no longer say that Toronto or such is offering more money if they have no cap room.

Maybe they can't get a 2nd line guy for their 3rd line but their top 2 lines will be all be still better than any of teh small markets teams 1st lines



In the end the only way to get this to work is Revenue sharing. The PA knows it, the small marrket teams know it and the Big teams know it! The problem is the Big teams won't giv eit up so there can be no deal. The irony is all the fans for big teams have been spewing venom over the small market teams and how a $45 million dollar cap can work because teh NBA, and NFl have one and it works for the small market teams there, but they have huge revenue sharing and that is the one piece of the pie missingright now. This NHL has been trying to get the players to solves the Small market teams problems and in reality I don't see that happening.

While i am Very pro owner I am also getting more and more angry with the NHL and its stance on Revenue sharing.

If the league took the $2.1 billion and plsit it 30 ways every team would get $70 million and spend $45m on players costs then fine but when teams like the rangers have revneues in the $120m range and the oilers are in the $45m million range in Total revenue you can see how a $45 million dollar cap doesn't work for small market teams.

 

[John Flyers Fan]

Maybe they can't get a 2nd line guy for their 3rd line but their top 2 lines will be all be still better than any of teh small markets teams 1st lines



In the end the only way to get this to work is Revenue sharing. The PA knows it, the small marrket teams know it and the Big teams know it! The problem is the Big teams won't giv eit up so there can be no deal. The irony is all the fans for big teams have been spewing venom over the small market teams and how a $45 million dollar cap can work because teh NBA, and NFl have one and it works for the small market teams there, but they have huge revenue sharing and that is the one piece of the pie missingright now. This NHL has been trying to get the players to solves the Small market teams problems and in reality I don't see that happening.

While i am Very pro owner I am also getting more and more angry with the NHL and its stance on Revenue sharing.

If the league took the $2.1 billion and plsit it 30 ways every team would get $70 million and spend $45m on players costs then fine but when teams like the rangers have revneues in the $120m range and the oilers are in the $45m million range in Total revenue you can see how a $45 million dollar cap doesn't work for small market teams.

The owners aren't all on the same page and they never will be. The small maret teams made a trade-off. They wouldn't ask for revenue sharing from the big clubs, in return the big clubs would stand behind the small clubs in asking for a salary cap.

It's an argument that I agree with both sides, and it's a major reason why we have no deal.

If I'm a player, I certainly would think why should I help out the Predators, Pathers and Hurricanes, if Comcast, Illitch, and Cablevision won't help them.

If I'm Comcast I also see that why should I split revenues evenly with Nashville ??? I paid $200+ million for the Flyers, and Leipold paid $80 million for the Preds.

 

[Chileiceman]

Hell, just split into two leagues and promote and relegate like European soccer. It's really the perfect solution. You could even have a third division with some of the AHL cities.

Iv'e thought about that but do you think someone in Raleigh is going to want to pay to go watch their third division team. I don't think so.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

There is still arbitration and that gives leverage to teh players. The oilers will not be able to spend $45 million but the kind of team tehy get for 25 million will not be all that competive..

1. As far as I know, there are changes to arbitration.
2. There is a salary cap. So salaries are not going to go hogwild,setting insanely high standards for all the others.
3. ANd my god, this is the question of the day: IF ALL YOU CAN SPEND IS $25 MILLION, THEN REALLY, DOES IT MATTER MUCH IF THE CAP IS $42.5 or $45 MILLION???

Let me ask you how having a $45 million dollar cap does anything at all for small market teams. Teh only winner here is the big market teams like Tor, dall and det as they can field the best roster for a savings of 3o million dollars. The oil and other small market teams will still get all there best players taken from tehm and still not be profitable. under the players offer they wouldn't even be able to try a rebuilding period because of the salary floor and with the escalators would be looking at a possible floor nearing 36 million by the end of the deal.

IF ALL YOU CAN SPEND IS $25 MILLION, THEN REALLY, DOES IT MATTER MUCH IF THE CAP IS $42.5 or $45 MILLION???

You are being very narrow minded. Detroit spent $78 Million last year.
If the cap was $45 or $42 or $49 or whatever, their ability to go out and spend has just been cut off at the knees. They'll still have some advantage, yes. But they're not going to be able to steal Iginla from Calgary and Sakic from Smyth from Edmonton.

And let me ask you this, if Detroit fans support their team with some of the best attendance records and highest ticket prices in the game, shouldn't they get a little something for their money???

Or do you think we should by more than Edmonton fans?
Because I don't hear Bettman's knights of the roundtable talking about a ticket price cap, to make things equal and protect the fans who get gauged by the evil forces of supply and demand in the big markets.

But that's not the kind of fairness you're interested in, is it?

 

[Icey]

Again, you're presenting the false dichotomy of $42.5 vs $45.

That's *NOT* the issue. It's the other stuff that comes with those offers. The PA is not saying "Ok, we like your offer, but change the $42.5 to $45 and we have a deal".

Well the salary cap is moot at this point, because according to Guerin in the DMN, they never even discussed the salary cap. They talked arbitration, qualifying offers, revenue sharing etc., and the league has gone backwards according to him.

According to Guerin they can't even agree on who invited Mario and Wayne to the meeting. They can't agree on a simple invitation and we expect them to agree on a CBA. This whole process is a joke and both sides look like complete idiots.

 

[OntCanuck]

The two guys working on this deal were two of the smallest revenue markets in the league. The small market thing is a red hearing. If the big market teams are at the cap limit most of the time how are they going to steal the first line players from the other team. Look at all of the big market teams and their payroll. Try to cut it down to the cap and still have the required number of players. Even with contracts like they have how many good players do they have to get rid of to make room.

 

[futurcorerock]

Well the salary cap is moot at this point, because according to Guerin in the DMN, they never even discussed the salary cap. They talked arbitration, qualifying offers, revenue sharing etc., and the league has gone backwards according to him.

According to Guerin they can't even agree on who invited Mario and Wayne to the meeting. They can't agree on a simple invitation and we expect them to agree on a CBA. This whole process is a joke and both sides look like complete idiots.

So just because Billy Guerin says it makes it so? I heard Saskin spewing venom today, so anything the PA board members have to say is farce to me.

 

[sundstrom]

Uggh. Guerin is one of the worst participants in this whole fiasco. What happened to his, I'd rather die than play under a cap line?

 

[Jester]

for the record at least 15 teams weren't willing to go to the 45 M number or it would have been offered. if bettman agrees with a deal all he needs is a simple majority in order to put the deal into effect. the 8 team deal only comes into effect if bettman DOESN'T like the deal that other owners are trying to push and wants to nix it, that is when the 8 votes matter... that's all he needs to kill it.

so while you're sitting there bashing on the small-market teams for "killing" the league, understand that in reality if the deal is to be made that bettman likes (say 45 M) then half the league is actually against it in order to stop that from going through. the fact that the owners haven't put forward a higher number tells you that bettman doesn't have the votes for that offer, he has 16 votes in favor of 42.5 which is why it went to the table.

for the record, notice the avatar, i'm a flyers and and obviously my boys would have agreed to pretty much anything... but i think it is slightly idiotic to beat up on small market fans like this is there fault and they are a minority in not getting to the 45 M number. for whatever reason, there are enough teams out there that we can't see that on the table.

 

[futurcorerock]

Uggh. Guerin is one of the worst participants in this whole fiasco. What happened to his, I'd rather die than play under a cap line?

wanna know the irony? He was a former Bruin